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Old 07-27-2011, 06:04 PM   #1
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


The room has been painted somewhere around 5-7 years ago by me using latex paint. This was the firsts time it was painted since the house was built which was about... 10+? The reason i was repainting it is because there were areas in the drywall which were dripped on and needed replacing. I then used lightweight joint compound (blue) to finish using many coats (also learning how to do this for the first time). I got it all finished like i wanted, primed with Zinsser 123 twice i believe.

While applying the joint compound i thinned it down at one point to be able to cover thin layers in large areas. I made sure it was all dry before layering and painting.

I painted the ceiling with Olympic white flat paint. I masked off the ceiling from the walls and repainted the walls (green). Upon pulling off the masking tape (blue brand name, wide) some areas where i did the work, the paint peeled off easily, also around the entire edge, about 50% was peeling in thin slivers about 1/4" some areas bubbled without peeling. The area i worked on seems to have come off to the joint compound, perhaps even taking some of it with it? not sure. The primer definitely came off!!! Upon closer inspection i peeled of wide flat chunks easily. The old untouched areas that peeled just seem to have pulled off this and last layer of paint. I also remember while brushing the edges the paint had trouble sticking in some of these older (previous coat) areas.

We had some leaks in the house, they all got fixed, dry walled well. I'm not sure what is causing this peeling?

Is there moisture still there?
Could it be the joint compound wasn't dry? Shouldn't have diluted?
Was the paint too thick? (it was an old brush).
Perhaps sand the joint compound to create a rough texture for primer again? (i used a wet sponge method to smooth it out... maybe too smooth).

Anyway, I'm now afraid to mask off the walls from the ceiling fearing that the paint will come off there as well. (I found another small area where paint was not adhering to the wall.)

so... what is my problem here? I'm thinking of sanding it down, spackle, prime, paint again.

help!!! (pics soon)

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Old 07-28-2011, 04:39 AM   #2
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


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Originally Posted by PolishPaul View Post
The room has been painted somewhere around 5-7 years ago by me using latex paint. This was the firsts time it was painted since the house was built which was about... 10+? The reason i was repainting it is because there were areas in the drywall which were dripped on and needed replacing. I then used lightweight joint compound (blue) to finish using many coats (also learning how to do this for the first time). I got it all finished like i wanted, primed with Zinsser 123 twice i believe.

While applying the joint compound i thinned it down at one point to be able to cover thin layers in large areas. I made sure it was all dry before layering and painting.

I painted the ceiling with Olympic white flat paint. I masked off the ceiling from the walls and repainted the walls (green). Upon pulling off the masking tape (blue brand name, wide) some areas where i did the work, the paint peeled off easily, also around the entire edge, about 50% was peeling in thin slivers about 1/4" some areas bubbled without peeling. The area i worked on seems to have come off to the joint compound, perhaps even taking some of it with it? not sure. The primer definitely came off!!! Upon closer inspection i peeled of wide flat chunks easily. The old untouched areas that peeled just seem to have pulled off this and last layer of paint. I also remember while brushing the edges the paint had trouble sticking in some of these older (previous coat) areas.

We had some leaks in the house, they all got fixed, dry walled well. I'm not sure what is causing this peeling?

Is there moisture still there?
Could it be the joint compound wasn't dry? Shouldn't have diluted?
Was the paint too thick? (it was an old brush).
Perhaps sand the joint compound to create a rough texture for primer again? (i used a wet sponge method to smooth it out... maybe too smooth).

Anyway, I'm now afraid to mask off the walls from the ceiling fearing that the paint will come off there as well. (I found another small area where paint was not adhering to the wall.)

so... what is my problem here? I'm thinking of sanding it down, spackle, prime, paint again.

help!!! (pics soon)

masking tape applied before primer cured.
latex paint needs 30 days to cure

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Old 07-28-2011, 05:08 AM   #3
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


Or, when the house was originally painted, they applied finish directly over bare drywall, rather than primer. That will happen if you do that. Prime all the failed areas, spackle, prime, finish. Forget the tape, cut it by hand. Check my blog for tips on painting without tape. Sorry for your misfortune.
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:46 PM   #4
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


also make sure there is no dust on the wall after you sand the compound. Its usually hard to see. I use a vacuum, then paint.
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:09 PM   #5
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


Thank you for your feedback.

Chrisn, 30 days for latex to cure?? I didn't want to believe you at first, but you're correct! "cure" being the operative word here

After sanding etc, i vacuum w/brush AND wipe with wet rags (sometimes even wipe up dry after wet rag!).

I believe a few things happened here:
  1. Paint was in garage for few+ years so it probably needed some thinning
  2. Which lead to the pain going on thick and not "curing" well
  3. This probably weakened the bottom layer (wet? paint reaction? just a theory here?) which allowed it all to come up with tape.
  4. Additionally, i wet-sponged the joint compound instead of sanding so it probably had a surface that was too smooth. Should have sanded before priming. These areas peeled in large pieces and was the "Big" problem.
  5. Finally, i thought i knew a lot about paining
I removed loose paint where i could, sanded, spackled, sanded, cleaned and i'm going to prime it after some rest. JSheridan, did you say prime failed, spackle AND prime again? Is it a good idea to put primer on the rough compound? I didn't prime before spackling.

p.s.
I also remember last time how cutting by hand was easier... just clean up any mistakes immediately. Tape has its purpose, but not here. Thank you all! Sorry no pics, had too much work and guests coming in 2 days!!!
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:59 AM   #6
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


Additionally, i wet-sponged the joint compound instead of sanding so it probably had a surface that was too smooth.

No such thing as too smooth. The wet sanding would hane had no effect on the outcome, unless it was not dry. I do it all the time.
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Old 07-29-2011, 06:27 AM   #7
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


Paul, usually when paint comes off with tape, it's due to two main reasons. There wasn't proper sanding of trim, so the topcoat is not properly bonded to the trim. And, it pulls from wall surfaces because drywall or compound patches weren't primed, but had finish applied directly. Finish isn't formulated to bond to bare gypsum. I'm thinking that you pulled off down to the original surface, not the stuff you applied, making it an issue caused by the original painters. Were there areas that peeled that can confidently say you didn't apply any patch? I'm curious about the answer. While Chrisn's theory is highly possible, it's less likely.
Sand, prime, patch, sand, prime, finish.
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Old 07-29-2011, 08:45 AM   #8
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


well, i found out more last night.

It seems like some areas i painted years ago are the problem. I found a rough spot in a hallway that i decided to spackle and while applying it, the paint underneath started to come off and mix with the spackle. I then noticed some areas on that wall that had bubbling paint. Both rooms were painted by me. I've painted other rooms as well and never had this problem, but then again, things didn't start peeling until i touched them so there could be more! There were rooms done by pros which i don't think have this problem, but then again, i haven't touched those walls yet

Now, about the room i'm working on.
The areas where i applied joint compound were the areas where the paint came off with primer to the gypsum i put down. I was able to pull off large flakes of paint. The rest, along the edge that came off with masking tape, seems to have come off to the original paint (just as that hole in the hallway); these are areas where i did NOT patch. BTW, trim isn't repainted (and it holds tough).

Perhaps the gypsum was still wet when i painted since i diluted some final layers?

I'm still unsure when you say "Sand, prime, patch, sand, prime, finish"?

Am i to undrestand that one should sand an area to be patched, PRIME IT, patch it sand it, prime it AGAIN? and then finish? Why should i apply primer BEFORE the patching? In my case i had to put in a new piece of drywall, taped, joined 3+ layers, then primed. Can you elaborate on that advice?

My theory now is that:
  1. Paint was too thick
  2. Gypsum was not completely dry
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:59 PM   #9
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Latex pain peeling in some areas. Primer came off too! Odd problem...


  1. Paint was too thick
  2. Gypsum was not completely dry

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