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drewid153 08-27-2012 02:41 PM

HVLP spraying help
 
To start of I am a complete newcomer to spraying and refinishing furniture…..
I have a Fuji mini-mite 4 stage turbine HVLP with the stock 1.4mm tip. I am looking for some advice on using this to paint an oak table and chairs white. I have read of many options in terms of products to use but all seem to have advantages and disadvantages. Paints like a waterborne alkyd ( http://www.dulux.ca/en/our-products/...ne-finish.html ) seem great but thinning sounds like it’s not suggested so I may have issues spraying through the hvlp. Most information seems to point to lacquers but the volatile nature of these, unless using a water based version, is defiantly a concern. Could I use latex and get good results and a durable finish? I have created a spray booth in my garage and used a fan to exhaust fumes but the fan and the lights are by no means “explosion proof” so I would like to avoid solvent based products. I am open to suggestions and am hoping someone would be kind enough to point me in the right direction in terms of getting started with this project. Any information on everything from sanding, priming and coatings would be greatly appreciated!

On a side note I live in Canada so I may be some what limited in product availability compared to our neighbors down south.

Thanks

ric knows paint 08-28-2012 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drewid153 (Post 997537)
To start of I am a complete newcomer to spraying and refinishing furniture…..
I have a Fuji mini-mite 4 stage turbine HVLP with the stock 1.4mm tip. I am looking for some advice on using this to paint an oak table and chairs white. I have read of many options in terms of products to use but all seem to have advantages and disadvantages. Paints like a waterborne alkyd ( http://www.dulux.ca/en/our-products/...ne-finish.html ) seem great but thinning sounds like it’s not suggested so I may have issues spraying through the hvlp. Most information seems to point to lacquers but the volatile nature of these, unless using a water based version, is defiantly a concern. Could I use latex and get good results and a durable finish? I have created a spray booth in my garage and used a fan to exhaust fumes but the fan and the lights are by no means “explosion proof” so I would like to avoid solvent based products. I am open to suggestions and am hoping someone would be kind enough to point me in the right direction in terms of getting started with this project. Any information on everything from sanding, priming and coatings would be greatly appreciated!

On a side note I live in Canada so I may be some what limited in product availability compared to our neighbors down south.

Thanks

I'm not real familiar with the Fuji brand HVLP, but a 4 stage turbine should have no trouble atomizing most "fine" waterborne finishes with little or no thinning necessary. The waterborne alkyd from Dulux (Akzo Nobel) does not recommend thinning, but I don't think that's necessarily due to any type of incompatibility as much as it may be an application issue...If this is the product you're going to use, obviously try it first, un-thinned, to determine if this is the type of finish you want, and can work with. As long as you're testing the product, then try it thinned* to see what application advantages, or dis-advantages, you may incur. Disadvantages may include uncontrollable runs & sags, poor leveling, excessive overspray or bounceback, delayed dry time and possibly compromised adhesion.

* Thin only with clean water...No solvents...No Floetrol (or other latex "flow" additives)...Clean water ONLY.

Also note that Dulux recommends specific primers beneath each app of their waterborne alkyd finish - in other words, this is not a self-priming product even in repaint work. Wateborne alkyds are nice finishes and are usually fine for projects such as kitchen table and chairs. Remember, these are alkyd finishes - just because they are borne in water, thin with water and clean up with soap and water, gives them no characteristics of acrylics (good or bad). The most noticeable downside of using an alkyd coating, is they will tend to discolor (yellow) over time (especially in the absence of UV light).

There are a number of acrylic coatings that'd be OK for use on this project. Insl-X's Cabinet Coat (Ben Moore) is an example of a low-blocking, hard drying, fast curing acrylic that has exceptional adhesion and reasonable scratch and mar resistance - a clear acrylic poly could be applied to the table top to provide even more moisture and mar resistance, if needed.

Acrylic lacquers are an interesting option for you though. The term "lacquer" has kind of changed over the years, and acrylic lacquers are really more similar to acrylic paints than anything "lacquer" - but due to the altering of acrylic resins with various thermoset plastics, these finishes do dry very hard and are somewhat moisture resistant - top coating with clear finishes is not really recommended as they will discolor the pigmented app (especially white). To add greater moisture resistance, consider using a pre-cat, waterborne acrylic lacquer...All above coatings will have a degree of "incidental" moisture resistance, greater moisture resistance will help to provide better protection from permanent water spotting and moisture rings. It is still, always recommended that you use place mats and coasters for drinking glasses and hot plates.

Personally, I'd probably use the pre-cat WB acrylic lacquer 'cause of (a) greater moisture resistance and (b) generally speaking, lacquers spray beautifully (though practice is still recommended).

I hope there is some info there that's helpful - I have a tendency to wander off topic once in a while, though. Let us know what you decide.

drewid153 08-28-2012 12:30 PM

Thanks Ric

Yes I think im going with tinted wb lacquer as I understand that will give me the best looking and durable finish. I now only need to find a retailer that sell the product and will tint it in my area.... which has proved difficult.

Cheers

ric knows paint 08-28-2012 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drewid153 (Post 998369)
Thanks Ric

Yes I think im going with tinted wb lacquer as I understand that will give me the best looking and durable finish. I now only need to find a retailer that sell the product and will tint it in my area.... which has proved difficult.

Cheers

Hey Drew,

If you can't find a retailer to supply your lacquer, try searching Mohawk on the web...I think they will ship it to you...They've got pretty good products and it'll be a factory finish white as opposed to a tinted clear. Good luck.

notmrjohn 08-29-2012 03:04 PM

hey, ric, "(especially in the absence of UV light)." I think you meant "presence." That's why you shouldn't use alkyds at Christmas time.
dre can I ask why you're painting oak? Its a matter of personal taste of course, some folks like chocolate and some vanilla, but I always cringe a bit when somebody paints oak. And with its variation of really tight and really open grain you're liable to get the texture showing through, which you may like or even be going for. But you might need to apply and sand a filler B4 priming.
Painting oak, sigh, I bet you're one of them chocolate eaters too.

ric knows paint 08-29-2012 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notmrjohn (Post 999163)
hey, ric, "(especially in the absence of UV light)." I think you meant "presence." That's why you shouldn't use alkyds at Christmas time.
dre can I ask why you're painting oak? Its a matter of personal taste of course, some folks like chocolate and some vanilla, but I always cringe a bit when somebody paints oak. And with its variation of really tight and really open grain you're liable to get the texture showing through, which you may like or even be going for. But you might need to apply and sand a filler B4 priming.
Painting oak, sigh, I bet you're one of them chocolate eaters too.

Nope..."absence" - an interior alkyd will yellow more when not exposed to direct sunlight. For example, a closet baseboard painted with an alkyd coating will yellow much faster than the baseboard painted in a room with windows - the interior shelves of a bookcase (holding books) will yellow much faster than the exposed side of the bookcase...An object painted with alkyd - then kept in a dark environment - will yellow...but as in each of these cases, some of the yellowing may be reversed by then exposing the painted object to direct sunlight...Plus, you really don't see white alkyd house paints turn yellow outdoors, right? (or at least not the boards subjected to daily sun)...(ain't alkyds a funny thing?).

notmrjohn 08-29-2012 05:19 PM

'Nope..."absence" ' Wull whaddaya know. Thanx. I guess i can use alkyds near the Xmas tree after all. And put a black light in the closet.


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