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Old 01-27-2013, 12:43 PM   #16
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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Originally Posted by ccarlisle View Post
You mean there's a difference between a 'flat' sheen and a 'matte' sheen?
Usually it's to get away with the manufacturer hype. To market a "scrubbable flat", they have to do something, because flat paint isn't scrubbable. So they add some sheen to it, which makes it easier to clean. We've always known that, that's why we use eggshell paint when we want our walls easier to clean. But they can't call it eggshell because everyone knows that's not flat. So they call it matte. That sounds kinda flat. It actually is a bit less sheen than eggshell.

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Old 01-27-2013, 01:49 PM   #17
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


Actually, it's not marketing hype. Matte has a definite angular sheen, and it's not sold as a flat. Matte is recognized in the hierarchy of glosses, it's an official level, not a pseudo-flat. Many of today's flats are washable, some highly washable. It's the stain resistance and durability that gives matte an edge over flat. It doesn't burnish as easily as flat might either. It lies between flat and eggshell, and is chosen by those who don't care for sheen but still want some extra protection. BM calls it matte, some call it flat enamel (which I've used for as long as I can remember, and as recently as the other day), and Finnaren and Haley used to call it a scrubbable flat, but the basic sheen level is the same. One coat coverage, among other things, is hype, matte is not.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:03 PM   #18
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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Actually, it's not marketing hype.
Sherwin Williams marketed Duration as scrubbable flat. Marketing hype. It's actually matte.

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It lies between flat and eggshell,
That's what I just said.

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some call it flat enamel
Marketing hype, to confuse people between flat and enamel.

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Finnaren and Haley used to call it a scrubbable flat, but the basic sheen level is the same.
That's an example of what I just said.

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One coat coverage, among other things, is hype, matte is not
One coat coverage is hardly hype. I didn't say matte was hype, I said calling it flat was hype.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:06 PM   #19
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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Old 01-27-2013, 02:07 PM   #20
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


Oh boy, here we go...

Semantics guys. Don't fight over them. Different companies use different words, its true.
And confusing to those who don't use the stuff all the time..
And Marketing is a part of every word. Is all a part of the game.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:24 PM   #21
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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Oh boy, here we go...

Semantics guys. Don't fight over them. Different companies use different words, its true.
And confusing to those who don't use the stuff all the time..
And Marketing is a part of every word. Is all a part of the game.
NO! It might be confusing, but it's not a hype meant to fool people, last word.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:27 PM   #22
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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NO! It might be confusing, but it's not a hype meant to fool people, last word.
"Scrubbable flat" that is is actually matte is marketing hype meant to fool people.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:37 PM   #23
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


So... anyone notice that Sw's satin is quite a bit different than BM's satin?
Ultra spec low sheen is just a hair over Aura's matte?
Unfortunately- there is no exact definition of the words used not only between different co.- but even within different lines in the same company.
So stop quibbling over semantics. Please.

We could guide a DIY when they talk about a specific product- but the same words are not universal.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:55 PM   #24
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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So... anyone notice that Sw's satin is quite a bit different than BM's satin?
Ultra spec low sheen is just a hair over Aura's matte?
I think the point is that matte should always has more sheen than flat. The differences between "pearl" and "lo-sheen", or one company's eggshell vs. another's aren't really the issue.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:57 PM   #25
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


I stand corrected, the F&H product was called Master Scrub, and it was a flat, not a matte. I used to use it quite a bit and not remembering the name was driving me nuts. No matter, BM bought F&H, sold their product for a while and then shut them down. Shame, they made some great products.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:18 PM   #26
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


So- do you think all flats are the same?
Builders flat like Pro Mar 700 vs Super paint flat?
or Duration flat?

They are not.

So to say scrubbable flat- or flat enamel- tells me- someone who knows about this- that they will have some angular sheen- not dead flat. More like what some call a Matte. Semantics.
if it says Ceiling flat- it better be dead flat or it's bs. And some ARE Bs.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:27 PM   #27
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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So- do you think all flats are the same?
No, but for example I think all flats should be flatter than all eggshells. And definitely within one paint line, the flat should be flatter than the matte.

Believe me, when a manufacturer calls something "scrubbable flat", and then puts "matte" on the label, they know exactly what they're doing and why.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:32 PM   #28
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


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So to say scrubbable flat- or flat enamel- tells me- someone who knows about this- that they will have some angular sheen
Yeah exactly, and most homeowners don't know about this, which is precisely the reason I mentioned it.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:34 PM   #29
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


I agree- not a "marketing Hype"- it is just different verbage to the same end.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:45 PM   #30
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How Do I Protect Acrylic Paint on sheetrock From Water Damage?


BTW- I can't remember anyone using the term "matte " more than 10 years ago. Words have trends too. Before they all said "scrubble flat" or the like.
AFAIK, it was BM that started the "matte" trend.

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