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Old 01-21-2012, 09:20 PM   #1
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Fools and Their Money Soon Part


Initially I thought I was of sound mind and judgement, but after purchasing a 1926 craftsman style fixer, I question my judgement... So I've tackled much in the last two years, but the exterior painting has me intimated.
The paint has bubbled on the south facing sides down to the 1926 cedar lap siding. The bubbled paint is very brittle and will crumble into pieces when touched. It appears the cedar, where exposed, has a white tint to the wood. My neighbors have had similar siding paint issues and most have resided, some have just dealt with the bubbling. I love the look of the 4" reveal lap siding and the cedar is tight grained with no rot, even in the exposed wood areas. The three areas that I need advice on are: PAINT REMOVAL- I assuming I need to take all the paint off down to the wood, it's a fairly large house. Is there a planer or some tool that would expedite this process?; WOOD PREP- not sure if I need to sand, wipe with mineral spirits, etc; PRIMER & PAINT-I live in the NW so not sure of type of primer/ sealer to use and the final paint. Thanks in advance for your help.

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Old 01-21-2012, 09:51 PM   #2
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No one here can see what you have there, there's no pictures to try and even guess a little better.
A house that old may have lead paint and may need someone with a lead abatment Licence to remove it.
The law lets a home owner do anything they want, but requires someone with a special licence to remove lead paint if they get paid to do the job.
(at least in VA that's the law)
Sounds like someone may have tryed to paint over the old paint with oil based paint.

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Old 01-21-2012, 10:38 PM   #3
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There are special sanders designed to sand lapped siding and bring it down to bare wood--

Like Joe mentioned--the old paint will contain lead--so sanding might be a nasty job---

Let's see how a pro painter would attack this job.

Depending on your location--that siding may well be redwood and not cedar---Redwood was the more common siding wood on houses built before 1965
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Old 01-21-2012, 11:06 PM   #4
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YES!!!
You've gotta be DAMN careful with older brittle paint films. Odds are high that there's Lead involved. Many painters won't touch jobs like this...LEGALLY anyway!

Old Oil-based paints WILL fail at some point, down to the original layer. You obviously have this in progress. Latex paints subsequently applied have a slight "pulling/shrinking" property to them. Eventually, this LITERALLY pulls-off old Oil paints that are naturally near/at the failure-point.

Old wood like that is worth saving...PROPERLY.
The "Old-growth" siding you have is from MUCH better/denser wood than todays "fast-growth", much less dense lumber.

Will it be cheap?!?!.............welllllll...that's what reliable estimates from reputable painters will tell ya!
Improperly done removal contaminates your immediate environment. NOT what you want to have happen....
So-
Get that paint tested!

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Old 01-22-2012, 12:04 AM   #5
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Thanks for the info so far. Yes I have had the lead paint analysis done and yes it contains lead paint. As someone said in one of the posts, home owners can legally perform the removal with being certified. That being said, I have researched proper lead paint abatement procedures and will follow them as though I was a contractor, for my myself, my family and my neighbors protection and of course the environment...I will post some photos of the cracked paint areas asap.
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:51 AM   #6
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Funny. I could have written your exact post - down to the year of the house. Only difference is we tackled the paint first, so that is mostly behind us now. We did ours one side at a time, and cumulatively spent months prepping. In terms of advice, we laid down a bunch of corrugated plastic sheets, end to end, against the house to collect the falling paint chips as we scraped, and were extremely meticulous about vacuuming them all up with a HEPA vac at the end of each work day. You MUST work diligently to remove as much paint/as many paint layers as possible. We used 3" drywall knives and the like, and while we read about the various sanding and shaving systems, we decided our siding was not thick enough to use them. We never found any rot either, but replaced quite a few board feet (200) of siding with clear cedar because we found weird cuts by previous homeowners, or that some boards had cracked in the sun right at the lap line. We used a great S/W water based wood primer and finish coat system that is holding up well and still looks great. You need both. If you follow the directions on the cans, they are designed to provide both mechanical and chemical bonding. You can go with another manufacturer, just be sure they are reputable.

Overall it is a TON of work, but it is very rewarding. Choose a good color scheme (we looked at historic palettes and walked QA, and Wallingford in Seattle to get ideas), and I have had people I have never met come up and ring the doorbell just to tell me how good the house looks. Really. Of course, I am a professional, but still. Good luck, and post some pics if you can. I'd be very curious to know the projects you have undertaken on the inside.
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Old 01-22-2012, 03:29 AM   #7
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I love the look of the 4" reveal lap siding. After years of scraping, sanding, replacing damaged clapboards, I have the perfect solution.
Vinyl siding!
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Old 01-22-2012, 05:08 AM   #8
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http://www.paintshaver.com/heat-n-st...FYURNAodSEy86A
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Old 01-22-2012, 09:37 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faron79 View Post
Old wood like that is worth saving...PROPERLY.
The "Old-growth" siding you have is from MUCH better/denser wood than todays "fast-growth", much less dense lumber.

I couldnít agree with you more.

About half of what I do these days is restoring 90+ year old homes inside and out back to there original like new condition.


Repair as needed and restore the rest.


These are the jobs that are fun for me. There is a certain amount of pride with turning these old homes into a shiny new penny again and the customers that come with these jobs are in a class of their own and are usually a pleasure to work for.


Iím sure the original craftsmen that built these homes would appreciate it and never could imagine that a hundred years later someone would come along and poke thousands of holes in their work just to wrap it in plastic.


Sorry for getting off topic here but your comment just got me thinking of the big picture.
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Old 01-22-2012, 11:01 PM   #10
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I will hype the last major tool I bought before taken out of the race again. An infrared stripper. It makes a job like this so much easier. Get the rail system and you can slide along the siding. It is safe and layers and will come off at once. You can rent one but there tend to be waiting lists from what I hear so reserve one ahead of time. I sold mine for more than the books said it was worth after a year or two of depreciation.



Does not change the lead abatement issue though.

Once done, I would make necessary repairs, sand and prime with something like Benjamin Moore Fresh Start (alkyd if you can buy it) tinted 40 percent of your paint formula. Follow with the best 100 percent acrylic you can find.

Or you could buy one of the brand new stripper/primer/paint in one products. Brush it on and it strips all the old paint off, primes the surface and applies a finish coat all in one pass. It runs about $27 a gallon though

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Old 01-23-2012, 04:33 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdsester View Post
I will hype the last major tool I bought before taken out of the race again. An infrared stripper. It makes a job like this so much easier. Get the rail system and you can slide along the siding. It is safe and layers and will come off at once. You can rent one but there tend to be waiting lists from what I hear so reserve one ahead of time. I sold mine for more than the books said it was worth after a year or two of depreciation.



Does not change the lead abatement issue though.

Once done, I would make necessary repairs, sand and prime with something like Benjamin Moore Fresh Start (alkyd if you can buy it) tinted 40 percent of your paint formula. Follow with the best 100 percent acrylic you can find.

Or you could buy one of the brand new stripper/primer/paint in one products. Brush it on and it strips all the old paint off, primes the surface and applies a finish coat all in one pass. It runs about $27 a gallon though

You are being ripped offI can get it for $23 here.
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Old 01-23-2012, 04:53 AM   #12
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I would suggest avoiding the primers and paints and just go with a solid stain, two coats and you're done, better breathability and better in future repair/repaints. Newb, the white haze may be primer residue in the wood grain/pores, just sand over it. As to prep, all the wood needs to be sanded, with extra effort on the areas that have been exposed to the elements and UV rays of the sun.
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Old 01-23-2012, 05:08 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwikfishron View Post
I couldnít agree with you more.

About half of what I do these days is restoring 90+ year old homes inside and out back to there original like new condition.

Repair as needed and restore the rest.

These are the jobs that are fun for me. There is a certain amount of pride with turning these old homes into a shiny new penny again and the customers that come with these jobs are in a class of their own and are usually a pleasure to work for.

Iím sure the original craftsmen that built these homes would appreciate it and never could imagine that a hundred years later someone would come along and poke thousands of holes in their work just to wrap it in plastic.

Sorry for getting off topic here but your comment just got me thinking of the big picture.
I appreciate your post here Ron. I consider myself an old school craftsman myself, so I understand your motivation. Most "painters" I know today are merely color change artists, not painters. I really enjoy taking a weathered, run down place and restoring it to gem status. That's sometimes a greater reward than the pay. Even with standard everyday repaints, there's a lot more work that goes into it that most painters ignore or don't know to do. I have a lot of customers who appreciate the work that I do, they understand. So I know the feeling you express about those types of customers. Contrast that with the many painters over the years who look at me like a kook because I still adhere to the practices and care I was taught starting out. Those types of customers are getting harder and harder to find though, and you and I are of a dying breed.
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Old 01-23-2012, 08:30 AM   #14
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I worked almost exclusively on antique homes. One of the last complete restorations was magical. It was early 1900s balloon construction built by employees of a lumber company during the winter months. Thing was perfectly square to the day. Even the garage had wallpaper (After the war every possible space was chopped into living units and given a mailbox for GI bill benefits to go to the UofI. Many nice places were completely destroyed before an occupancy law was enacted. This garage had wallpaper and a wood stove to prove it was an apartment!). Anyhow the structure had beautiful cypress/cedar siding that had been on with some paint layers since the beginning. We took it down to the wood made all repairs, primed with it Fresh Start. The owner fell on bad market times, ran out of time, and had to sell it.



First thing new owners did was rip the hideous wood siding off, dumpster it, and replace it with vinyl! I nearly cried and the historical preservation folks came unglued but the damage was done. Unfortunately such stupid moves ripple through entire historic neighborhoods. The people were heavily fined and there was a threat to make them take the vinyl off and put replacement wood back on but that never went anywhere. The idiots still have no idea they reduced the value dramatically since it cannot be sold as historic, in least in the district it is in, with vinyl siding.

The idea of a solid stain is a good one. I lot of the fellow historic restorers in Central Illinois used an acrylic version of product by MAB once the wood was stripped. I think it was Timberline but I fly from memory not to be trusted. It worked out great. I used it on fences and things. I hope Sherwin Williams did not KO that product when they acquired MAB.

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Old 01-23-2012, 08:40 AM   #15
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You are being ripped offI can get it for $23 here.
It is well worth the extra $4 to me to have a product adjusted for altitude! It is sold under the brand name BARE and instead of a furry animal on the can there is naked pole dancer to drive home the point it is stripper/primer/paint in one.

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