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boba7523 04-01-2013 08:51 PM

Epoxy Newb - Have a Few Questions
 
Hi everyone!

I'm adding epoxy to my concrete garage floor and have several questions.

1.) Can you guys recommend any epoxy paint within $100 budget for a 2 car garage that in dark red?

2.) I'm looking at this one, which would be $200 for a 2-car garage. With this kit,

3.)Do you guys have any recommendations on alternatives to the Ruse-Oleum one I posted? Car will be parked in the garage so the epoxy needs to be durable...

4.) I sometimes work on my car in the garage and will have jack stands. Will the Rust-Oleum one endure the weight placed on the jack stands?

5.) Going to go with 2 part epoxy; heard that it's more "durable" than 1 part. Is this true or am I being jipped out by marketing?

Thanks! :yes:

boba7523 04-01-2013 08:59 PM

I also saw this one, which is water-based (http://www.homedepot.com/p/BEHR-Prem...5#.UVo7BJOG3Xo)

It says it's for use in garage; will it fit my requirement? --> Endure weight of car on jackstands, hot tire pickup, basically "rough abuses."

user1007 04-01-2013 11:32 PM

Some reason you decided on an epoxy finish? You are skipping over a nice floor paint in oil or waterbased because you needed the hardness of epoxy for what reason?

You do know the floor has to be spotlessly clean before you put anything on it.

I have nothing against epoxy resin floors I guess. But do look at expiration labels. There is perhaps no worse an experience then cleaning up a resin job that did not cure.

I personally would paint your floor with a floor product from Benjamin Moore or Sherwin Williams for that matter. Two coats of Ben Moore's floor paint, waterbased, would be my first choice. If you do not like the factory colors, a real paint store should be able to tint it for you to what you want.

boba7523 04-02-2013 12:13 AM

Hi sdsester,

I like the finish, the gloss, and the feel of epoxy floor. :)

Epoxy has expiration dates? Wow i did not know that. Thanks for the tip!

PS: my garage floor is concrete right now.

retfr8flyr 04-02-2013 01:53 AM

The real key to an epoxy floor is the preparation. You can put the best epoxy down and if the floor wasn't prepped properly it will pull up and not last well. The best way to prep the floor is to rent a grinder and grind the surface, the second best it to use acid etch process on the floor. Without doing a good prep you are just wasting your time and money with epoxy.

I have been researching epoxy coatings for several weeks, as I am about to redo my garage with epoxy for the floor. I went with the Wolverine Coatings System from Alpha Garage http://www.alphagarage.com/ I would recommend increasing your budget as you will not get a decent epoxy floor for $200. If you want some good information on epoxy coatings give Fred at Alpha Garage or Scotty, at Legacy Industrial http://www.legacyindustrial.net/cart/ a call. They are both great guys and can answer all your questions.


Earl

chrisn 04-02-2013 02:39 AM

I would listen well to retfr8flyr and do not even let the Behr product enter your mind. ( prep is the most important )


BTW, retfr8flyr , were you a commercial pilot?

retfr8flyr 04-02-2013 02:48 AM

Yes I was, I retired in 2005 and flew for Airborne Express, thus the retfr8flyr user name.


Earl

boba7523 04-02-2013 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retfr8flyr (Post 1150695)
The real key to an epoxy floor is the preparation. You can put the best epoxy down and if the floor wasn't prepped properly it will pull up and not last well. The best way to prep the floor is to rent a grinder and grind the surface, the second best it to use acid etch process on the floor. Without doing a good prep you are just wasting your time and money with epoxy.

I have been researching epoxy coatings for several weeks, as I am about to redo my garage with epoxy for the floor. I went with the Wolverine Coatings System from Alpha Garage http://www.alphagarage.com/ I would recommend increasing your budget as you will not get a decent epoxy floor for $200. If you want some good information on epoxy coatings give Fred at Alpha Garage or Scotty, at Legacy Industrial http://www.legacyindustrial.net/cart/ a call. They are both great guys and can answer all your questions.


Earl



Just tried the materials estimator on that website. Ouch, $725 to do my garage is way out of my budget at the moment...

I've heard greatreviews on the Ruse Oleum Industrial Epoxy on Amazon. What do you guys think about that one?

Also, I'm going to do the acid etching to clean the concrete instead of grinder. This is a weekend project for me, i'm not a professional so the grinder might seem too much....

So steps are:

1.) Remove grease/oil spots. Can you guys recommend a good cleaner for this?

2.) Pour acid etch + pressure wash it and scrub scrub scrub.

3.) Wait till concrete is dry.

4.) Mix solution and apply epoxy.

jsheridan 04-02-2013 04:47 AM

Use any good degreaser. Read up on working with acid for etching floors, it's not an everyday product. 725.00 seems like a lot, are you sure you did it right. I did a large, more like 2 1/2 car, garage a few years back with PPG's Aqua Pon and I think the total material bill was about 320.00. For this type of job you must follow instructions to the letter.
Careful with the muriatic acid, it might eat away the whole floor, just kidding.
Where does scrub, scrub, scrub come in?

ric knows paint 04-02-2013 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boba7523 (Post 1150553)
Hi everyone!

I'm adding epoxy to my concrete garage floor and have several questions.

1.) Can you guys recommend any epoxy paint within $100 budget for a 2 car garage that in dark red?

2.) I'm looking at this one, which would be $200 for a 2-car garage. With this kit,

3.)Do you guys have any recommendations on alternatives to the Ruse-Oleum one I posted? Car will be parked in the garage so the epoxy needs to be durable...

4.) I sometimes work on my car in the garage and will have jack stands. Will the Rust-Oleum one endure the weight placed on the jack stands?

5.) Going to go with 2 part epoxy; heard that it's more "durable" than 1 part. Is this true or am I being jipped out by marketing?

Thanks! :yes:

Boba,

For painting garage floors with epoxy, I'm gonna recommend a couple of things...(#1) Consider a color other than dark red. Epoxies are not UV stable and will fade & chalk (nature of the beast). If your garage will be exposed to direct sunlight, via window or open door, fading (and possible chalking) will occur dramatically and quickly. Red fading would be more noticeable than gray or white. What I'd recommend instead is to go with a lighter color then apply vinyl color chips to achieve a decorative effect if so desired...I'd also recommend a clear coat of epoxy be applied over whatever color you ultimately decide to use for additional protection and ease of maintenance (although that recommendation won't really help you stay within your budget).

(#2) Rustoleum makes a very good product. But the product you highlighted in your post would not be my first recommendation. They also make a water-borne epoxy garage floor system that, in my opinion, offer up advantages over the solvent borne you listed (unfortunately, lower cost may not be one of the advantages). While Rustoleum makes very good products, there are several other companies that make equally good water borne epoxy systems recommended for use on garage floors...

Which brings up (#3). Painting a garage floor can be tricky, and sometimes with disastrous results. Surface preparation is key and, unless you've got experience painting concrete floors, is unlike any other prep you've done for other painting projects. Trying to read about proper surface prep, on hardened concrete exposed to hot tire traffic, is not the same as having someone walk you through the necessary steps of preparation and describe - in detail - what each step should produce, or look like, or feel like etc. Talk to somebody with experience and, no disrespect to any big-box employees, generally speaking is not going to come from Home depot. Talk to your local independent dealer for product, systems and procedures recommendations. This independent businessman or woman, has a vested interest in your community, has experience far beyond what an average department store or big box employee has, and has the ability to talk you through possible pitfalls of an epoxy application.

Finally (#4). Don't be pound foolish and consider a single component product for your garage floor needs. Single component, epoxy fortified (modified) acrylics or alkyds, may - or may not - work in your situation. Most probably won't. These are compromise systems that are tuff and durable as they relate to more conventional floor coatings, but not in terms of resistance to hot tire pick up, and road salts, and exposure to hot oils and solvent cleaning as epoxies are...Single component acrylic or alkyd coatings (regardless of what the label says) has way too high a risk for failure, and the repair is more difficult than going the proper route in the first place.

Good luck and let us know what you decide.

JMDPainting 04-02-2013 07:03 AM

When I do a high use , high traffic floor that needs a product that will hold up I use Devoe High Performance coatings. I've used their two part Epoxy on garage floors , on gymnasium shower stall concrete walls and also on a very high traffic professional mechanic's garage floors and walls. All with excellent results. As others have said, it's all on the prep. If you don't take the time to do the proper prep no matter what you use may fail.

http://www.superfpaint.com/categories/Industrial/

ToolSeeker 04-02-2013 07:45 AM

On the rust o product you listed almost everyone I know who has used it liked it with the exception of it lifting with hot tires. And as said the prep is key follow manufactures direction to the letter. Especially since you already mentioned grease and oil spots.

retfr8flyr 04-02-2013 09:55 AM

Pour-N-Restore is a great product for getting out oil stains. I would use it on the worst spots and then use a good industrial degreaser on the whole area with any oil stains. Epoxy is really a get what you pay for coating. The water based versions don't holld up very well and the solvent based version come in many versions. You need to consider what you are putting down. Epoxy quality is based on the percentage of solids in the coating. If it is a 40% solids that means 60% of what you put on the floor will evaporate away. So if you put down the coating 6 mills thick, after it dries it is only 2.4 mils thick. An epoxy that is 100% solids is the best way to go, you put down 6 mils and get 6 mil after it dries. The only reason to thin down epoxy is to sell it at a lower cost but you are actually paying more because most of what you are paying for evaporates into the air.

I really suggest you talk to the guys I mentioned and rethink what you have planned. If you want this floor to last then do it right the first time. Replacing a bad epoxy job is a real nightmare and not something you want to have happen.


Earl

ric knows paint 04-02-2013 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retfr8flyr (Post 1150850)
Pour-N-Restore is a great product for getting out oil stains. I would use it on the worst spots and then use a good industrial degreaser on the whole area with any oil stains. Epoxy is really a get what you pay for coating. The water based versions don't holld up very well and the solvent based version come in many versions. You need to consider what you are putting down. Epoxy quality is based on the percentage of solids in the coating. If it is a 40% solids that means 60% of what you put on the floor will evaporate away. So if you put down the coating 6 mills thick, after it dries it is only 2.4 mils thick. An epoxy that is 100% solids is the best way to go, you put down 6 mils and get 6 mil after it dries. The only reason to thin down epoxy is to sell it at a lower cost but you are actually paying more because most of what you are paying for evaporates into the air.

I really suggest you talk to the guys I mentioned and rethink what you have planned. If you want this floor to last then do it right the first time. Replacing a bad epoxy job is a real nightmare and not something you want to have happen.


Earl

Water bourne epoxies have come a long way since they were first introduced to the market, and the earlier versions really weren't very good products. They also weren't "true" epoxies. That's not the case anymore. These water bournes are remarkable products that hold up just as well as their solvent counterparts - because, in a dried film, they're pretty much the same as their solvent counterparts. They even have a few advantages over solvent, but that's for a later discussion.

You are right regarding 100% solids, but who is going to put that into the hands of one not as experienced as yourself. These are not products for the DIY-ers. Solvents can render any resin less effective than an un-diluted version, but there's a trade-off with that. Cost is not one of the factors why manufacturer's make reduced versions. Ease of application, penetration, flow, transmission of vapors necessary to expel or eliminate gasses created during induction, are only a few reasons why one may choose a reduced, rather than a 100% solids version...and what of the solids? Does one assume the solids in question are epoxy resin? They are not. There are many other solid components mixed into any coating that takes away from the absolute toughness and durability of a resin...it's not just solvent that affects a finish product in that way. Each of these components are necessary to achieve different performance or application characteristics though.

Back to Boba...Water Bourne epoxy. Be confident in this product's ability to perform in a way you need. Follow package directions closely and, again, speak to a local independent regarding this new endeavor.

user1007 04-02-2013 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retfr8flyr (Post 1150850)
Replacing a bad epoxy job is a real nightmare and not something you want to have happen.
Earl

:thumbup::thumbup:
Trying to patch one that flakes in places on you is no fun either.

Read the prep instructions for the product you choose carefully and mix your acid dillution exactly as suggested. Less is more. You may not accomplish this project in a weekend. We have not seen a picture of your garage floor but it needs to be cleaned and etched before you try to put any finish on it.

And in all this? Adequate ventilation please and an aspirator should be on your purchase list too. Cured resin products whether singular or two part can make quite a stink.

There are people that do floors like you want for a living and have vans with equipment to mix real two part epoxy at exactly the right formulation and temperature with no air bubbles. They can offer you any look you want. I know this is a DIY site but they may end up being cheaper for you then trying this yourself.

Finally, allow any floor finish to cure. Hopefully your car/cars will be safe left outdoors for a night or two? If you put the weight of a vehicle and perhaps heated tires on a new floor coating? It has to fail.


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