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Old 04-08-2011, 08:26 AM   #46
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


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Originally Posted by mark2741 View Post
Be glad when this is finally done, and now I know why the Trex stuff is so popular : )
Oh yeah? Read some posts on here about the composite decking. I sell stains/sealers to people all the time for their "maintenance free" expensive decks. They're not all their cracked up to be. If I had a ton of money to throw at a new deck floor...I'd go with IPE. Its expensive, but its amazing. I dont know, even if I had the money, I believe IPE is rain forest wood. I'll just stick with Cedar for my new deck. Im young enough where the maintenance doesnt kill me too badly.


Oh, to the OP. This is the hardest part, fixing someone else's mistake. In a couple years, do a light cleaning and reapply the SRD. If you keep up on the maintenance while the deck is looking good, you shouldnt have to do all the work you did this time. Thats sort of the trick with decks. Once they start looking like they need to be done...they really need to be done. If you wait to long, put it off, or try to squeeze another season out of it...back to square one

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Old 04-16-2011, 10:08 AM   #47
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Update....still not much progress due to getting rain in my area every 2 to 3 days. Supposed to rain all day today.

But....I went to the local Sikkens dealer (a local paint shop that has always given good advice in the past for paint) and explained the situation to the guy and told him I wanted Sikkens Semi-Transparent stain. He said he had 3 color samples available he could give me. He went in the back and handed me three small cans in three different tints - Natural, Natural Oak, and Cedar. He handed me a pamphlet as well and told me how to prep the deck (which mirrors what was in the pamphlet, which mirrors what I did and described in my last post).

Yesterday, after 2 days of dry-time after a thorough drenching of rain a few days ago, I chose a small section of deck board and tried the 'Cedar' sample. It was WAY dark and looked like garbage - much darker and browner than the reddish tint in the color chart in the pamphlet. I then tried the 'Natural Oak'. It was slightly better, slightly less darker than the Cedar, but still looked like garbage. This morning I tried the last of the samples - the 'Natural', which on the color chart should basically be almost clear. I put it on and it is a dark, reddish tint - what I would have expected the Cedar to look like. Perplexed, I just did a google search for 'Sikkens stain too dark' or something like that and found some discussions. That's when I realized that the guy at the paint shop gave me samples of the wrong stuff!!!!! He gave me what I think are Sikkens SRD, not Sikkens SRD Semi-Transparent. The small sample cans are white and just have printed on them:

Sikkens Color Sample
078 Natural

On the back it mentions something to the effect of "this sample can be used to demonstrate any translucent color' or something like that. That tells me, based on the description of SRD (vs SRD Semi-Transparent) that he gave me plain SRD.

So now I will either go back to that store and ask him why he gave me the wrong stuff and ask if he has the semi-transparent, or look for another Sikkens dealer in my area, or check out the Cabots stuff which Lowes sells and apparently is also a good product.

I just learned this and thought I'd post here to get some feedback. What do you guys think? Have any of you used the SRD (just plain 'CETOL SRD' - no semi-transparent)? It still shows the wood grain but it is WAY dark. Unless the guy also gave me tinted colors, which I'm guessing is highly probable.

I just found this color chart and sure enough it is definitely different from what I had been given for sure because the numbering is different. Really ticked about this.
http://www.nam.sikkens.com/product-c..._category=deck
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Old 04-16-2011, 10:29 PM   #48
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


I'm a Sikkens dealer too...

SRD IS Semi-Transparent, AND the only S/T Sikkens for decks.
(well....there IS DEK-Finish, which is a film-former, but it's a different animal ENTIRELY!)
There is a new Waterborne SRD out now, but there's no sample bottles of that yet.

The "Cetol" phrase is meaningless...it's just Sikkens "brand-word" for a "finish you can SEE thru"...

Regarding color:
Your final color will be a crapshoot! It's just the way it is with stain you can see through! Final color is 90% dependant on the native color of your Cedar...AND how absorbent it is.
You could put that one sample on 10 Cedar decks, and you'll have 10 different hues.

>>> Dry times:
2 days isn't enough...UNLESS you're in Phoenix, and the temp is 95! Check with a moisture-tester. THAT'S the only way to be sure.

Faron
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Old 04-16-2011, 10:48 PM   #49
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


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Originally Posted by Gymschu View Post
Mark, no need to re-wash the deck as long as you plan on doing it within 2-3 weeks. Believe it or not some stains can be applied onto a damp (not soaking wet) deck. I like Deckscapes from SW but I know Sikkens is great stuff too. In a perfect world, it would be nice for the deck to get at least 2 to 3 days dry time before you apply the stain.........sometimes that just doesn't happen.
SW bought MAB a few years ago and MAB made the best outdoor stains on the planet. I would not buy anything else. I am sort of out of the business but I bet with brand names changes we are talking the same thing here.

Are you going oil or acrylic stains here though. You cannot put an oil based stain on wet deck. Let it dry. Roll it on and pray for no rain for 4-8 hours even at 40-45 degrees. You will be fine.

Like painting anything? Remember the rule. Two coats!
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Old 04-16-2011, 11:01 PM   #50
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


DO NOT apply 2 coats of ANY SRD S/T though...you'll regret it.
I promise.

ONE coat only of ANY SRD...the Pre-tints, the 190 Oil tint-base, & the new SRD-Waterborne-tintable.

DO NOT roll it on.
>>> Rolling on stain is worthless, and can lead to spotting if it dries b4 you can brush it in...in which case you've just needlessly doubled your work.
>>> Yes, wait for deck to fully dry. Get a moisture-tester.

Get a Wooster "Stainer" brush, unscrew the handle, and screw in your shop-broom pole.
Now you can STAND and do the deck floor!

I can't even count how many of these brushes we sell every summer!!

Faron
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Old 04-17-2011, 07:54 AM   #51
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Why would they sell different types if they are the same? Here is the semi-transparent:
http://www.nam.sikkens.com/product.c..._category=deck

And here is the regular SRD:
http://www.nam.sikkens.com/product.c...egory=log-home

The semi-transparent is made of "High Solids Alkyd/Oil", while the SRD is made of "Alkyd Oil".

The color choices available for each are also drastically different.
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Old 04-17-2011, 07:55 AM   #52
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Also - I don't have a cedar deck. It's just older pressure-treated wood.
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Old 04-17-2011, 12:11 PM   #53
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Oh, I see what ya mean Mark!

Both are SRD Oils. The one with the "Lotsa colors" is the SRD #190 tint-base that came out a couple years ago.
Both SRD "series" can be used for Decks or Siding.

NOTE-
The ONE COAT line in their descriptions!!! DO NOT apply 2 coats of this stuff. You'll regret it, as I said.

Color:
Yes, on P/T wood, all bets are off for your final result!! BIG difference there!

Faron
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Old 04-17-2011, 04:59 PM   #54
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Thanks Faron. One question - by 'all bets are off' in regards to PT wood - what do you mean by that?

I'm gonna go tomorrow back to the local sikkens dealer and ask them whether they carry the semi-transparent and if they have any samples they can provide of that. If not, or if they try to give me the same stuff they gave me before (the plain SRD), then I'll either drive the extra to the other sikkens dealer or go with Cabots at Lowes. I am not happy at all with the look of the three samples they provided me of the translucent SRD.
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Old 04-17-2011, 08:38 PM   #55
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Oh...the "all bets are off" statement only pertained to the color you'll end up with on P/T wood!

If you applied your SRD #078 to 3 P/T-decks, you'll have 3 different versions of the color! Some may be markedly different. Is it the stains fault? Obviously not...
Your final look is entirely dependent on the woods' native color.

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Old 04-18-2011, 01:35 PM   #56
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Just got back from a lunch-break visit to another Sikkens dealer that is about 20 minutes from my work.

So it appears that the regular Cetol SRD is the same as the semi-transparent SRD, with the practical difference being that the semi-transparent version comes in all kinds of colors (i.e., green, blue, etc.). I'm not really looking for an unnatural look so I asked them if they had any samples. They had only a few left of the regular SRD (they said they don't carry and don't think that Sikkens supplies sample cans for the semi-trans SRD stuff).

Although they didn't have any of the finishes I really wanted, I bought (for $4.99) a sample of the Natural Oak and will give it a try once the rain finishes and the deck dries.

I explained to the guy what happened with the samples I got from the other Sikkens dealer - that even the 'Natural' stain sample was way dark, and he said it's probably because the samples the guy gave me were very old. He told me to shake them up really, really good, and that the stain should look very similar to the chip in the brochure so long as I'm not applying it on a gray deck. So we'll see.

I am also going to head to Lowes tonight for an un-related project and will check out what they have in the Cabots line, as I've read nothing but good things about that stuff. I wanted to go with Sikkens and still may, but damn if they ain't making it hard : ) Between this constant rain and the first local Sikkens dealer giving me the bad sample cans, I'm about to give up and just look for a different brand stain.
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Old 04-24-2011, 09:49 AM   #57
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Okay....the frequent rains have continued to put a stop to my ability to stain this deck - it's been weeks! ugh...

But I still have the issue of choosing a stain color and have a question regarding semi-transparent deck stain application -

Are you supposed to wipe off the excess? What exactly is 'excess' in this context? I have stained hardwood before (not a deck, but furniture piece). When doing that, I apply the stain with a rag, wait a few minutes, then run a clean rag over it the remove the darker spots.

In the earlier sample tests that I posted about, I simply applied a coat of the stain and left it on the deck board. Should I have, after a set period of time, 'wiped' off the excess? If so, I feel like a moron cus I didn't : ( I just read the Sikkens directions literally, which just say to apply it with a brush and that's it.

Reason I ask is because I'm having trouble finding a deck stain that is the right shade. Last I tried a fresh, well-shaken sample can of Sikkens SRD Natural Oak and it is *way* too dark. Much darker than the color sample on the brochure. I mentioned the problem to my brother and he said it should probably be wiped off before it dries, but he never stained a deck before so he wasn't sure. I re-read the directions and see no mention of wiping the excess, but perhaps Sikkens is not catering to buffoons like me? : (

If I should be wiping the 'excess' - is it simply a trial and error process in terms of how long to wait before wiping, and how 'hard' to wipe? Seems odd because the boards are not perfectly smooth so clearly there will be 'excess' in the ridges of the wood over the smoother parts.
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Old 04-24-2011, 10:01 AM   #58
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


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Originally Posted by mark2741 View Post
Okay....the frequent rains have continued to put a stop to my ability to stain this deck - it's been weeks! ugh...

But I still have the issue of choosing a stain color and have a question regarding semi-transparent deck stain application -

Are you supposed to wipe off the excess? What exactly is 'excess' in this context? I have stained hardwood before (not a deck, but furniture piece). When doing that, I apply the stain with a rag, wait a few minutes, then run a clean rag over it the remove the darker spots.

In the earlier sample tests that I posted about, I simply applied a coat of the stain and left it on the deck board. Should I have, after a set period of time, 'wiped' off the excess? If so, I feel like a moron cus I didn't : ( I just read the Sikkens directions literally, which just say to apply it with a brush and that's it.

Reason I ask is because I'm having trouble finding a deck stain that is the right shade. Last I tried a fresh, well-shaken sample can of Sikkens SRD Natural Oak and it is *way* too dark. Much darker than the color sample on the brochure. I mentioned the problem to my brother and he said it should probably be wiped off before it dries, but he never stained a deck before so he wasn't sure. I re-read the directions and see no mention of wiping the excess, but perhaps Sikkens is not catering to buffoons like me? : (

If I should be wiping the 'excess' - is it simply a trial and error process in terms of how long to wait before wiping, and how 'hard' to wipe? Seems odd because the boards are not perfectly smooth so clearly there will be 'excess' in the ridges of the wood over the smoother parts.
When applying deck stain you do not wipe it off. Sikkens srd is an alkyd/oil base, so you need to use a quality china bristle brush. Apply it by brush, maintain a wet edge, apply from one end of the board or joint to the other end before moving onto the next board. If you are applying there semi-transparent they have 60 colors if you are using the translucent they have 10 colors.
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Old 04-24-2011, 10:13 AM   #59
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


Thanks! That makes me feel slightly better that I'm not a complete buffoon : )

I still have the problem of why the stain is so much darker than in the color chips in the brochure.

The only sample I have not tried yet is the 'Natural Light' one, which none of my area stores has a sample of. I found one discussion of it online that says that there is a big difference in color/shade of the Natural Light compared to the next shade darker, which is 'Natural'. The Natural is way too dark, so I'm gonna go with the Natural Light but I'm not a wealthy man and it is annoying that I have to drop so much money on a 5-gallon bucket of this stuff without knowing how it is gonna look first : (

Has anyone tried the Sikkens Natural Light. The reason I'm hesitant about it is because my deck wood is old (pics in first couple of posts in this thread) and I'm concerned it might be too 'clear'/transparent. But I guess I just will have to trust that it is still in the SRD/semi-transparent category for a reason...

Incidentally, I did check with Lowes and Sherwin Williams about sample cans of the Cabots and DeckScapes stuff and, much to my surprise, they don't offer samples. At least Sikkens does (unfortunately my local dealers don't have any of the Natural Light samples left though).
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Old 05-06-2011, 08:57 AM   #60
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Deck Power Washed...now many days of rain before stain!


An update (yet again!)

It's been a while since the last update due to the same reasons why this project has never gotten done - rain. It's rained in the Philadelphia area at least once every 3 days for the past 2 months : (

It rained heavily earlier this week, and we have conflicting weather reports now calling for mostly sunny/dry weather by some, and other stations calling for the same but with possible light showers tonight and tomorrow night. In hopes to finally apply stain either Sunday or early next week, I did a light deck wash using a pre-mixed gallon of Cabot deck cleaner (very light amount used as I didn't have enough to cover the entire deck), then followed with my low-pressure electric pressure washer. Then, I applied a strong dose of Benjamin Moore deck brightener and pressure washed off yesterday. Wasn't impressed immediately but now that the wood has dried and it made a definite difference. Made the wood much brighter and more even in tone. I'll try to post a pic tonight to show the difference.

Now I still have the same dilemma - choosing a deck stain. I had settled on Sikkens Cetol SRD based on reports on the internet and Consumer Reports, however the samples I tried previously are too dark in shade. I tried the Natural Oak on a scrap piece of new 2x6 and it was still too dark for my tastes. I'm concerned the next step lighter, Natural, will still be too dark. And the Natural Light I read is more of a clear-coat, which would not be ideal either. So I may see what Cabot has to offer at my local Lowes. Regardless, unless we get an unexpected dose of heavy rain over the next few days, then I should *finally* have a stained deck next week and will assuredly post pics. Thanks again for all help.

Has anyone used the SRD Natural Light? The printed color chip looks like a golden yellow color. I assume it has to have a fair amount of pigment due to it being a semi-transparent but I'm concerned it's going to be too clear.

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