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Old 08-17-2009, 06:34 PM   #196
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Commenting on Behr Paints


I painted a Temp door to my addition yesterday
No sags I could see
Went back 1/2 an hour later & sags in several places
Only reason I used the Behr paint is its an old door that is only up until I insulate the room this winter
I figured I'd use the junk Behr paint rather then waste good paint on a Temp door

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Old 08-18-2009, 04:42 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
I painted a Temp door to my addition yesterday
No sags I could see
Went back 1/2 an hour later & sags in several places
Only reason I used the Behr paint is its an old door that is only up until I insulate the room this winter
I figured I'd use the junk Behr paint rather then waste good paint on a Temp door

Duhhh, really??? who would have thought that??
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Old 08-20-2009, 11:24 AM   #198
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Commenting on Behr Paints


I am no expert by any means, just an average DIY'er who figured that paint was paint. So I bought Behr to paint a bedroom and bathroom. First thing is the overpowering smell, and then multiple coats have to be applied. When it dries there are shiny spots, etc.

After reading the site, I tried SW for the kitchen. I noticed a difference right away. Color was the same as the swatch, great coverage, and an even finish.

For a difference of about $7, I saved time and was happy with it. I guess you get what you pay for?
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Old 08-20-2009, 05:20 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by Nestor_Kelebay View Post
I think people in here should keep in mind that neither Behr nor Benjamin Moore nor Sherwin Williams nor Pratt & Lambert make any of the things they use to make their paints with. None of them make their own resins; they all buy them from companies that make plastics. None of them make their own pigments; they all buy them from chemical companies that specialize in different kinds of pigments. Similarily, none of them make any of their own additives.

So far as I know, the only company that makes it's own binder resins is ICI of Britain, which sells it's paints under the tradenames "CIL Dulux" in Canada and "Glidden" in both Canada and the US.

So, Behr could start making better paint simply by buying the same resins, pigments and additives from the same chemical companies that SW, BM and P&L do. The reason why they don't is a decision of Behr management. Behr knows their customers are primarily DIY'ers that only paint once every 15 years and will get their advice from Consumer Reports. If Behr's paints are of lesser quality, they will shine in the pages of Consumer Reports as long as the difference in price is commensurate. So, instead of striving to make the best paint, Behr management is striving to make the best value paint.

Chemical companies will always be pushing the paint companies to buy their latest and greatest resin, or pigment or mildewcide or rheology modifier or whatever. Of course the paint companies won't buy it unless they feel the increase in cost is justified by the increase in performance.

On company that bucked the trend was C2 Paints.
http://www.c2color.com/

C2 would buy these latest products from the chemical companies to use in their paints, and would then concentrate their advertising budget on comparing their paints to the best from SW, BM and P&L. Of course, their "independant lab tests" would confirmed that the C2 paints were higher hiding, more colourfast, self leveled better, dried harder, etc. etc. etc. than the SW, BM or P&L top line paint.

That's how C2 marketed their paints; as being better than the best SW, BM or P&L could offer. Their advertising concentrated on independant lab tests that compared C2 paints with the biggest names in the business. Obviously C2 didn't have any technical expertise to speak of, they simply relied on the technical expertise of the chemical companies to make better products.

I've noticed that they've stopped doing that. Their current advertising only says that they have 16 different colourants in their tint machines rather than the 12 that is standard in North America. And, their colour swatches are a whopping 12 inches by 16 inches in size, rather than 2 square inches or less you get with everyone else.

I only wanted to mention this so that people wouldn't get the idea that "Sherwin Williams" or "Benjamin Moore" or "Pratt & Lambert" make their own great paints. The truth is that these paint companies buy everything they put in their peints from chemical companies (except perhaps for the water and mineral spirits). It's those chemical companies that deserve the accolades for making the great binders, pigments and additives, not the paint companies for mixing and diluting as per instructions.

C2 paints is proof than ANY paint company, even Behr, can make a better paint than SW, BM or P&L; you just have to buy the latest and greatest products on offer from those chemical companies, despite the fact that the increase in bang won't justify the increase in bucks. You simply pay an independant lab to compare your paint with those on offer from BM, SW and P&L and you advertise those results. It makes you look like you have the best technical expertise.

C2 used to sell their paint out of about a half dozen locations in the USA. Now, they've enlisted a lot of independant paint retailers across North America to add C2 Paints to their product line, thereby increasing C2's market exposure significantly.

So, it's not the name on the can that makes the difference, it's the management that does. It's a management decision on what level of quality paint to make, not a limitation of each company's technical abilities. Any company wanting to make better paint simply has to buy better ingredients from their suppliers. Behr makes mediocre paints because they know their customers are DIY'ers that are much easier to please than professional painters.
Just want to correct some of the misinformation shared above. Benjamin Moore does indeed make their own proprietary resins and do make two proprietary colorant systems, one is a zero VOC waterborne system. So no, it's not the resin suppliers of the world that get credit for cutting edge products like Aura or Natura, it's Benjamin Moore.
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Old 08-22-2009, 10:27 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by slickshift View Post
I have used Behr paints and stains
I won't use them again
The best thing I can say about them is, if that is what the average homeowner thinks painting is like, then Behr has defininately got me jobs (Thanx B.)

I find it hard to work with and terrible at covering

Really, if you have been doing some painting lately and have sort of a handle on it, switch over to something good
After you've done a small room with the good stuff, actually before you finish, you'll forget the Behr stuff
It'll be quicker, nicer, better coverage...

I suggest going to a local paint shop and trying some Ben Moore for you're next project
You won't be disappointed


forget the behr stuff? haha i think your forgetting who is number 1 buddy. behr is... i sell paint all day long and have performed many tests and behr is definitly the best
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Old 08-22-2009, 10:31 PM   #201
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I'll never buy Behr again
I'll only use the remaining paint I have on Temp projects
It's junk paint
I consider Behr #2 & I don't mean I'm counting
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Old 08-22-2009, 11:58 PM   #202
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You have to wonder if "paint_guy" works for behr.

The truth be told, I used some of the Behr paint a few years ago, and it didn't hold up. The guy that works for Behr was supposed to forward my problems/complaints to the company, and they would get back with me. They never had the *alls to contact me. Go figure........

Last edited by bofusmosby; 08-23-2009 at 12:01 AM. Reason: addition
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Old 08-23-2009, 12:43 AM   #203
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Wonder if "paint guy" has really ever painted walls with the behr crap or just a piece of sample board. Using it and selling it all day long are two entirely different things. Most diyers aren't going to take the time to research the product prior to use and many sellers bank on it.

One room with sagging paint was enough for me.
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Old 08-23-2009, 04:51 AM   #204
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forget the behr stuff? haha i think your forgetting who is number 1 buddy. behr is... i sell paint all day long and have performed many tests and behr is definitly the best

That is truly a laughable statement
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Old 08-23-2009, 09:03 AM   #205
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But It's already got the primer mixed in.....
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Old 08-23-2009, 06:27 PM   #206
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But It's already got the primer mixed in.....
Ya, well, he didn't say that
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Old 08-27-2009, 10:18 PM   #207
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you wanna know a secret? Farrow and Ball makes the best paint i have ever seen. this stuff is amazing. i hope you get a chance to try it.. its not sold everywhere. here is a link to a picture of the paint can.

my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)

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Old 08-28-2009, 04:46 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklez View Post
you wanna know a secret? Farrow and Ball makes the best paint i have ever seen. this stuff is amazing. i hope you get a chance to try it.. its not sold everywhere. here is a link to a picture of the paint can.

my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)

No big secret but it is very expensive.
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Old 08-29-2009, 01:15 PM   #209
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Hi, sorry if I'm repeating things that have already been discussed, but I didn't have time to read the whole thread. We also chose Behr when we started our improvement projects a couple of years ago, because of the Consumer Reports rating. We were (are) novices, and the paint seemed fine to us. By the time we moved from the kitchen to the dining room, I had gotten acquainted with some of the various brand websites. I stuck with the Behr because they have this great interactive website that offers coordinating color suggestions. This was a great tool to get me thinking outside the box, so to speak. It gave me ideas for colors that I would never have thought of otherwise. I kind of like to figure things out for myself rather than getting advice about color.

Anyway, we went on to paint our dining room mostly with Behr (we did one wall with a Ralph Lauren color), and that was two years ago, and it seems fine. Cleans well, looks even, etc. I only needed one coat (a mid green) after priming with tinted Kilz, so that really impressed me.

I've also painted tons of foam board with paint samples using Ralph Lauren, Behr and Sherwin Williams (they sell the quarts for just $5). I did notice that the SW smelled stronger, took longer to dry and seemed different in texture.

Anyway, it's kind of shocking to see all the negative comments about Behr. I thought I was using the best paint available because of that rating. I just bought the Behr paint today for the living room. We still have the bedrooms and family room to do, so maybe I'll get acquainted with the Benjamin Moore next.
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Old 08-29-2009, 07:00 PM   #210
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I thought I was using the best paint available because of that rating. I just bought the Behr paint today for the living room. We still have the bedrooms and family room to do, so maybe I'll get acquainted with the Benjamin Moore next. This would be the best move you have made.

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