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cdnpolarbear 12-30-2008 01:27 AM

Border question.
 
Greetings,

I am new to this forurm, and been reading a lot of the posts, lots of great information.

I recently bought my first house -- and as such am both excited and buggy-eyed as to all that needs to be done. The first job of course is painting the interior.

With all the rooms, the ceiling is a stucco ceiling, with a four inch border of smooth surface that meets the top of the wall (making the corner). I was thinking of painting this four inch edge to match the wall, giving a crown moulding apperance.

I dont want to get any paint on the stucco, and from what I have been reading using tape will not get me the edge that I need. ( I even tried taping a portion and noticed that the stucco is creating a gap between the ceiling and the tape - a gap where paint can get into and ruin the stucco ) Has anyone else done this and what would be the best way to get a decent result.

Any advice/info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

jensenconstruction 12-30-2008 01:49 AM

we usually cut these in by hand, but that takes a lot of practice to be able to freehand a straight line.

Maybe one of these Trim Guides will work for you.







.

r3dmonk3y 12-30-2008 07:55 AM

I am not an expert and I don't know if this would work cause I nevered tried it myself. I'm guessing you want to paint the border without any paint being on the ceiling stucco.

This is the best one I think would work but it required you painting the ceiling.


a) Paint the border and try to get minimum paint onto the stuffo ceiling
b) Afterward, tape the border where it's meeting the ceiling and paint the ceiling (since the border have no texture)

It's just doing everything backward cause you can't tape the ceiling cause of texture, but you can tape the border if it got no texture. :thumbup:

cdnpolarbear 01-05-2009 09:11 PM

Thanks for the responses guys..... A few more questions though....

I got me two of thoes metal guides.... one 23 inches and the other about 12 inches....... Right now i am busy patching and filling holes in the drywall.

I saw how the painted border looked at a friends house... really looks good (even though the paint job is not the best)

Any other suggestions as to how to make this border really clean???

Also, Like i said, i am going though and filling holes with drywall compound. I am noticing that after the compound drys, their is a little "dimple" where the hole was.... Am I doing something wrong here cause that dimple was not there when it was wet.

Finally, I do know that these spots need to be primed. Is it worth it to prime the whole thing? or do i just need to spot-prime? And when I do start to paint, what order would be best???? Should I try the border first, then work on the walls, or visa versa??? I know the border/trim will take more time than the walls, so will the drying time on the border/trim affect the look on the wall where they meet? What is average drying time???

I know i may sound dazed and confused, but I just want to do a good job and get a good result.

sirwired 01-06-2009 04:43 PM

It is pretty common to have to apply multiple coats of j/c. When drywall goes up they use 2-3 coats of the stuff.

The trick when spot priming is to use a roller. If you spot-prime with a brush, your final finish coat will have some noticeable smooth spots where the roller stipple is less. Trim or walls first?... it's a matter of personal preference. I personally do trim last, but others do the reverse. Drying time is whatever the can says it is; it varies by coating. Some are ready to recoat in one hour, some take four, and they all depend on conditions. (Cool and/or humid conditions extend drying time.)

IMPORTANT NOTE: If using tape, DO NOT apply the tape until the coating is AT LEAST two weeks old, preferably longer. Failure to wait this long will cause the tape to peel the paint.

SirWired

cdnpolarbear 01-06-2009 07:02 PM

Thanks for the advice....... I asked the same question yesterday at HD when i bought some Caulk.. the guy at the paint counter told me the same thing.... last night i went back and re-filled the holes.... most of them did not have that dimple any more....... i guess i just have to keep re-filling.

I also have noticed that some spots of the wall have circular bumps to them..... big ones -- in other words not from a roller/brush.... I diged into one of the bumps and found the screw head that was used to secure the drywall to the stud..... I figured i can just tighten this - as it wasnt screwed in deep enough and re-mud the area... is this the best way to go about this, or am seting myself up for missery?????

You know.. this is my first house...... everything is starting to pile up... all that needs to be done... all the money spent..... I am sure am glad this forum is here though.....

PS: Any advise for dealing with the fiancee who wants to paint everything boring beige???

Thanks for all the help.

sirwired 01-06-2009 07:23 PM

If the screws were put in when the house was built, the bumps may be due to the inevitable settling that occurs with every new house. Tightening and re-mudding is the way to go.

Standard hint from this forum... HD is a fine place to pick up things like roller covers (Purdy White Doves only!), brushes (Purdy or Wooster only!) and caulk (DAP Dynaflex 230 is about the only painting caulk worth buying there. Avoid GE caulk at all costs!), but don't get your paint there! Get your paint from an actual paint store, and buy near or at the top of the line. You will be much happier, and have fewer headaches.

As far as moving the SO (or SWMBO... She Who Must Be Obeyed) off of beige... try some mild pastels. It would also be a great idea to stop by one of those paint stores and purchase a color fan. That is about 100x better than picking up strips from the store. This will be $10 or so, and well worth the investment. Also, Sherwin Williams will mix up a sample quart of almost any color for $5, which can be great for trying out a new color before committing to $60 worth of paint; most of our rooms have gone through three or four of those samples before making a final decision, and this was after consulting the color fan. (Note: That sample quart cannot be used as actual paint... it's about as durable (and covers as well) as that $8/gal crap from BigBox. I usually paint some posterboard as a first step, and brush some on to a primed wall to make my final decision.)

We used SW "Lantern Light" yellow (code 6687) in our kitchen and dining room, and it was a nice change from a standard beige without being too jarring. HINT: If using the Sherwin fan, pretend the "bold colors" section doesn't exist. We thought "Daffodil" would look nice when consulting the chip, but a $5 sample later we could tell the color description was disturbingly accurate. :-)

SirWired

krazni 01-06-2009 07:36 PM

if you want to try freehanding the paint
1. Hold the brush (probably a 1 1/2" sash brush) like a pencil, with the angled tip toward the top
2. As you stroke, rotate the brush slightly and add slight pressure; that will give you a smooth line as you draw the brush. The straight will come with practice, and a smooth line looks straighter than an irregular one, even if it isn't quite straight.

about the one color lady -- I married one :yes: She couldn't picture what she wanted, but after a couple years, we are slowly repainting as she realizes what she wants. And it is easier for me to put up with something that isn't really my preference than to live with her when she is discontent. It's not that big a deal:yes:

cdnpolarbear 01-06-2009 08:11 PM

To paraphrase a little green friend of mine.... "Much to learn... I still have"

Its all about the little things.... It dont take much to make me happy... I am glad i am on track with the tightening of the screws in the drywall.

I guess i am making a trip tommorow to return that GE calk..... it was got at HD..... they had MONO.... and some other kinds too... somthing that started with Alex something or other....(i think). So why is GE so bad????

Interms of the paint.... I most likely will go with BM..... The friend who had his house painted went with BM and he liked it (not sure what weight that will carry since he paid someone to paint for him)

I like the Idea about the color testers..... Maybe I will just go and prime everything... then just get a bunch of testers to see what will work best. That being said..... if i paint some of the wall with a tester and then decide against it... Can i just prime over top that, or should i re-prime the wall????

I guess the big thing is that I take for ever to make decisions... SWMBO on the other hands decides like a knee-jerk reaction.. (dont get me wrong.. I love her to death and she is the best that has ever happened to me...but still... pure knee-jerk reaction -- SHe had the whole house decided in 10 minutes)

So then I guess the plan is to finish the rest of the patching and such.... and then prime everything...... Does it matter where I get the prime from??? or does PrimeA=PrimeB???

Any advise on painting impossible to reach places??? Like the back corner of a stair case. I got me one of thoes telescopic ladders... and I can get within a couple of feet... but thats it..... It would appear i would need a painters pole of some sort... but I need one that is stable if i am doing trim..... any suggestions.....

I swear if i get through this and my house and I are in one piece... I am throwing the biggest BBQ EVER!!!!!!

sirwired 01-06-2009 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdnpolarbear (Post 208276)
To paraphrase a little green friend of mine.... "Much to learn... I still have"

Its all about the little things.... It dont take much to make me happy... I am glad i am on track with the tightening of the screws in the drywall.

I guess i am making a trip tommorow to return that GE calk..... it was got at HD..... they had MONO.... and some other kinds too... somthing that started with Alex something or other....(i think). So why is GE so bad????

It's overpriced, and I know that one time when I bought "lifetime mildew warranty bathroom caulk", it mildewed in 2 months, after being a royal pain in the rear to apply. That did not exactly instill confidence on my part in the rest of the GE caulk product line. The DAP Dynaflex 230 is a Siliconized Paintable Elastomeric Latex caulk; pretty much the best kind available, but still cheap enough to be worth the price. Alex Plus is not awful, but not enough of a price difference to be worth it. Plain Alex dries out too much, IMHO.

Quote:

Interms of the paint.... I most likely will go with BM..... The friend who had his house painted went with BM and he liked it (not sure what weight that will carry since he paid someone to paint for him)

I like the Idea about the color testers..... Maybe I will just go and prime everything... then just get a bunch of testers to see what will work best. That being said..... if i paint some of the wall with a tester and then decide against it... Can i just prime over top that, or should i re-prime the wall????
BM only has samples available in limited colors, and the samples are the size of a shot glass. That said, if you want to use BM, by all means do so; it's good stuff... you will be about 50 times happier than Behr. *cough* *spit*.

Quote:

I guess the big thing is that I take for ever to make decisions... SWMBO on the other hands decides like a knee-jerk reaction.. (dont get me wrong.. I love her to death and she is the best that has ever happened to me...but still... pure knee-jerk reaction -- SHe had the whole house decided in 10 minutes)

So then I guess the plan is to finish the rest of the patching and such.... and then prime everything...... Does it matter where I get the prime from??? or does PrimeA=PrimeB???
Stick with paint-store primer, (or Zinsser products) and you will be just fine. Avoid Kilz water-base primer at all costs.

I don't have any suggestion on your stairwell...

SirWired

cdnpolarbear 01-12-2009 09:02 PM

Well.... I just got home after a days work on the house......

Progress is happening.. but when your learning as you go, progress comes slow.....

So as of now.... the lesson of the day, is dont buy cheap plastic drop cloths....... they have no weight to them, and they are a pain to setup.

Second lesson of the day is to not bother putting drop cloths when your sanding cause your going to vacuum anyways.....and the cloth will get in the way... I supose the only time you need the cloth is when your actually putting paint to wall.

I have few more rooms to sand.... then cleanup.. and finally i get the put primer on.....

That being said... I know that the trim will take longer to do, and when i am done the trim/border in a room, and start on the walls, the freshly painted border/trim will be dry. My consern is that when i start painting the walls, there will be sections where there will be multiple coats of paint (from when i did the trim and when i did the upper/lower portions of the wall)

I am worried that this will cause a blotchy look.... something i dont want given the money and time i am investing in goood BM paint(AURA), and 2 weeks of vacation from work (which is not really a vacation)

Any suggestions on how to start???? or am i just worring about nothing?

Also when i went to the BM store, they had 3 different kinds of primer.... all different prices..... any preferences out there... i know that the most expenisive one was also good for priming metal, so that leaves the cheapo BM primer and the mid-grade.... anyone know what the difference is between them?

Sorry for ranting on.... any/all help is greatly appreciated.

Bubbagump 01-13-2009 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirwired (Post 208308)
Avoid Kilz water-base primer at all costs.

Absolutely! I tried Kilz2 to spot prime a few areas that I had patched and it simply did not hold paint.... at all. The paint just fell off which meant I had to re-level, re-prime, and re-paint... a huge pain in the arse. Nothing like doing the whole job over again.

krazni 01-13-2009 06:28 PM

I'm sure you are aware that drywall dust will trash your home vacuum if you use it much. The dust is so fine that it will coat the motor, etc, and cause issues later. I've found that using dropcloths and keeping them tight to the wall enabled me to roll up most of the sanding dust and carry it out, keeping the vacuuming to a minimum.:)

And a thought about painting your colors... If you put your lighter color on first, you can be a little less precise with it and run it just a bit futher than where it will end. Then when you tape your straight line for your dark color, it will typically cover the excess lighter color fine. Remember that most bold colors will take multiple coats to achieve their depth of color.

cdnpolarbear 01-13-2009 11:31 PM

Well.. back from another day at the house...actually got a lot accomplished today....

Thanks for the words of wisdom....... its greatly appreciated....

So today I went and got primer.... went with the Benjamin More all puropse primer. And it was on sale so that was a bonus as well......

I also picked up a quart of oil based primer (as per the recomdation of the BM person when I mentioned to her that one of the bed rooms has a water stain to it that appears to be going through the skim coat of drywall mud........

Kranzi -- Thanks for the tip about the home vacuum...... Today i finished sanding and started the clean up... rolled up all the drop cloths.. and started to vacuum the bedroom carpets.... (there is a lot of dust in the living/dining room so for that it will be the ole broom coming to my aid... good thing you said what you did... i was going to vacuume all that drywall dust on the hardwood floor to save time...... thanks for the heads up)

I figure i have no choice but to use the vacuum on the carpet.... but there was not much that needed to be done.

As for the paint color... i have come to the conlusion it really dont matter what the colors are... so long as wifey is happy...... so beigh and "earthy tones" it is..... besides... i would much perfer boring colors that will put you to sleep than unhappy wifey.......

Hopefully tommorow i am putting primer to wall...

Thanks for all the advice.

CdnPolarBear.

cdnpolarbear 07-20-2009 05:10 PM

Well.. much time has passed and a lot has been learned.......... many thanks to all that helped me......

Painting is about 90 percent done... other than one small room, and touch ups.......

I must say though that the border on the ceiling came out MINT!!!! I swear.. who knew that something costing me 2.99 (11 inch trim guide) would be worth its weight in GOLD!!!!!! the rounded corners had to be done free hand, but after a while it was fairly easy........ and any spots where i "slipped" i just dabbed a bit of primer over to hide it.... you cant even tell.....

As for the stairwell.. that was all done too.... thanks to a Grade 1AA teloscopic ladder.... all in all.... my paint job cost me about 1000 do to.... my buddies who had his done for him cost him 7 times that (mind you his house is twice as big as mine).... but even he admits that my job is better than the guy who did his house.......

Alot also has happened with other projects.... (wont get into cause they are outside the scope of THIS post -- but lets just say that the value has already increased and there is still more to do)

Anyways... was on here looking up something else and though i would say a big Thanks to all that helped with advice.......


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