Benjamin Moore Advance and Natura Problems
Benjamin Moore Advance and Natura Problems I am having problems with Benjamin Moore Natura paint peeling. Does anyone know why it would peel? I believe the walls had behr paint on them before. Should the walls have been primed? Do all paints peel like this?
Is it typical if you use an eggshell finish on a wall to do the first coat with flat? Wouldn't you use eggshell for the first coat as well?
I had advance painted on the wood work and you can see what looks to be blue underneath. The original woodwork was white, but I'm assuming the blue was the primer. It looks like they only did one coat and it looks really thin. I have posted some pictures at the link below. I hope it is ok to do this without violating forum rules. Please look at the photos and let me know what you may think is wrong. I really appreciate the help.
Pic 1 Blue on woodwork under advance
Pic 2 Natura Peeling
Some educated guesses-
Was the ww primed first? or was the color underneath dark? What you might be seeing with the blue is just simple lack of coverage. Dark underneath white often looks blue.
The pulling- first- it is a tub surround it looks like. Very possibly there was soap residue or something that wasn't cleaned making adhesion poor. And it also looks like it pulled when tape was pulled. It takes up to a couple of weeks for paints/ primers to cure to full hardness and adhesion- I would almost always score the tape edge before pulling tape to prevent that.
I'd vote for some kind of contaminant on the surface: dirt, grease, soap film, etc.
It seems that it just wanted to peel near the tile ridge, i.e. where dirt collects.
also where it would have been taped( ie, he got tape onto the newly finished wall and did not cut the top edge before pulling it and the new paint film off)
Natura & Advance Application Tips
Whether you are using Natura Zero-VOC Interior Paint, or the new Advance Waterborne Alkyd Interior Paint, in order to obtain a uniform and opaque appearance as well as obtain proper adhesion, you must take the time to properly prepare all surfaces to be painted.
Most paint failures can be directly attributed to a lack of proper surface prep. Bathrooms and laundry rooms, and kitchens all require extra surface preparation in order to remove soap particulates, conditioners, soaps, hair-spray, grease and grime prior to applying a primer and finish coat.
Surfaces to be painted must be clean, dry, and free of dirt, dust, grease, oil,soap, wax, scaling paint, water soluble materials, and mildew. Remove any peeling or scaling paint and sand these areas to feather edges smooth with adjacent surfaces. Glossy areas should be dulled. Drywall surfaces must be free of sanding dust.
Almost any household cleaner will perform adequately. TSP (trisodium phosphate) is the best cleaning agent for grease laden painted surfaces and the residue associated with it. Mix TSP with water and sponge it over the walls and woodwork.
TSP is somewhat caustic, and will actually remove the gloss from old paint. That helps new paint because glossy surfaces don't bond as well. But be careful not to get TSP on painted surfaces you won’t be painting. As always, follow all package directions. Rinse with clean water to remove all traces of soap.
If you would rather avoid the use of TSP (trisodium phosphate) , you could use a strong detergent cleaner or a TSP substitute. Follow up this procedure by using a good quality primer such as our N023 Fresh Start 100% Acrylic Primer. If you are going from a light color to a dark color or vice-versa, you should consider using a primer tinted to a like color of the topcoat, or final coat.
Advance calls for the use of the 790 Advance primer for most situations. Two topcoats are recommended.
Technical Data Sheets contain surface preparation information and primer recommendations and can be downloaded via the www.benjaminmoore.com website.
Simply type in the product number or name and download the TDS.
Send all paint related inquiries to firstname.lastname@example.org We try to respond to all email inquiries as soon as possible—usually within 48 hours.
Benjamin Moore & Co.
BM Advance Spraying with Airless Sprayer
I'm just finishing spraying my cabinets white - total reface from oak.
We used the BM Advance Satin 3.5 gallons and BM Advance Primer 2.5 gallons. The finish paint was $50/gallon and I think the primer may have been $48/gallon. The color we chose was Cloud White and we love it. They have to jimmy rig the Advance Primer to tint it, but it's possible. I sprayed everything in the garage in an enclosed plastic area. I would highly recommend a lazy suzan type turntable to spray all your pieces on. It eliminates so much risk of spraying multiples at once. I only saw one available at walmart and it turned out working amazing. It was a two stand with 3 wooden dowels. So on the large stuff I set them on the 3 dowels. For the smaller stuff I popped the top of the turntable on that had three golf tees glued to it. I bought the Graco Magnum LTS15 for $270 at Lowes with a 10% off coupon. Got some experience ahead of time by painting the exterior of the house. Used a Graco RAC X Fine Finish Tip 214.
Finishing our large kitchen in two weeks. First week lowers, then this week uppers. It will be about 100 accumulative hours spent. I paid friends to help me sand on the Saturdays and help brush/roll paint the inside. Our first day spraying was 99F. The max temp for application is 90F with a recommended 77F. I was fanning the AC into the garage as much as possible. One of the boards had a bad cracking effect and eventually had to use stripper and start over on that one. A few of the others had minimal cracking that we got cleared up with sanding and the additional coats. The cracking was noticed mid day and half way through spraying primer. I lowered my sprayer pressure down from the recommended 75% pressure to between 45-55% and intentionally sprayed less and never saw the problem again. I had all the cabinets drying in the garage. Used 2x4s across saw horses, etc. I hot glued golf tees to the boards and set the boards on those. Be mindful not to flip them after the dry to touch time or you'll get dimples. Wait at a very minimum the recoat time. Make sure to use two finishing coats. The inside required three finishing coats. I cleaned them all with TSP and Klean Strip Sander Deglosser. Also used an orbital sander of 120 grit before primer and then 220 grit after primer. Then a fine sanding block between coats. We also used an Elmers sandable wood filler to fill screw holes. You can see a handful of divets from over sanding. In a perfect world we would have spent more time redoing some things, but who wants to have their kitchen tied up for a minimum of two weeks. Overall we are very pleased with the BM Advance.
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