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Old 11-17-2010, 07:47 PM   #16
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Behr and Consumer Reports


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Originally Posted by DCCenter
JD Power rates Pratt and Lambert (owned by Sherwin Williams, but higher end stuff) and Benjamin Moore 1 and 2 respectively.
Sherwin is good paint but their tracking system blows.

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Old 11-18-2010, 08:22 AM   #17
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Behr and Consumer Reports


Going back to when I was a new homeowner that didn't know any better, I used a lot of paints good and bad.

When we first started painting our first places, we used flat (dumb). I will say, that on the cheap end of paints, Behr's flat paints covered exceptionally well, when compared to other similarly-priced paints. As you increase the sheen in the paint, Behr gets exceptionally worse. Behr flat does show a lot of knicks and smudges if you bump into it - but I'm not sure if that was the Behr paint, or the dumbness of using flat on a wall. Now that I know better than to use flat paint on walls (I use eggshell or satin), Behr is obviously not my choice of paints for all of the reasons you can find all over this forum. I have stuck with them for painting ceilings however, as I have always had good results with the flat, and good coverage with 2 coats. I don't believe in any one-coat paint (it might exist) and two coats of Behr flat on a ceiling gives me perfect coverage with no track marks or unevenness. That being said, I use "Navajo White" for my ceilings, which is not a true white and more of an off-white. A true white might be different.
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Old 11-18-2010, 10:53 AM   #18
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Behr and Consumer Reports


Thanks all for the responses. I especially like the one who responded with averageconsumers waddling around big box stores while stuffing their kids with burgers and fries.

Yes, I subscribe to consumer reports. Over the years, I have used what they suggested to buy products, such as washing machines, dryers, water filtration products, freezers, etc... I can say that they've never steered me wrong, but I would put myself in that average consumers group...minus the burgers and fries.

My primary goal is that I want the finished product to look awesome for years. Price is secondary, and I do not mind (I actually like) to do it myself. I come here to this forum because I want a product that will work well. Like you said, people here are professional painters and when you work with this stuff day in and day out, you tend to know what you're dealing with. Plus, you're not biased.

So, thank you all for the responses, and I'm going to stick with something like BM or SW...probably SW just because they're more accessible.
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Old 11-18-2010, 11:38 AM   #19
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Behr and Consumer Reports


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Yes, I subscribe to consumer reports. Over the years, I have used what they suggested to buy products, such as washing machines, dryers, water filtration products, freezers, etc... I can say that they've never steered me wrong
I religiously checked through consumer reports for most everything for years (with an online subscription too) and I can tell you from my experience anyway that they just don't come close to the accuracy of the end user feedback. Something about being a customer and having an opinion so totally outweighs any formalized testing for most products.
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:00 PM   #20
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Behr and Consumer Reports


Nope. If you have taken the time to come here and ask about a product, having already made some kind of comparison, then you're waaay above Mr&Mrs AverageConsumer...and for that you deserve a good job that answers the criteria you wrote: looks good and lasts for years.

You didn't add one that you will find out about on the job: ease of application/fewest # of coats to get that awesome look that lasts for years...and here's where cheaper paints fail. They may all look good, but we don't know for how long. And some might require two coats wereas a better paint requires only one...

Quality pays; and so for the added $10 a gallon that BM might cost, I'll go for the top quality every time because it's cheaper in the long run. And that's the basis for the pro painters choices you find here, with the one added qualification: their reputations ride on every job. So no cutting corners.

I think that just doing the research beforehand saves you time and money in the end; you did that, so good!
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:59 PM   #21
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Behr and Consumer Reports


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Originally Posted by ccarlisle View Post
Nope. If you have taken the time to come here and ask about a product, having already made some kind of comparison, then you're waaay above Mr&Mrs AverageConsumer...and for that you deserve a good job that answers the criteria you wrote: looks good and lasts for years.

You didn't add one that you will find out about on the job: ease of application/fewest # of coats to get that awesome look that lasts for years...and here's where cheaper paints fail. They may all look good, but we don't know for how long. And some might require two coats wereas a better paint requires only one...

Quality pays; and so for the added $10 a gallon that BM might cost, I'll go for the top quality every time because it's cheaper in the long run. And that's the basis for the pro painters choices you find here, with the one added qualification: their reputations ride on every job. So no cutting corners.

I think that just doing the research beforehand saves you time and money in the end; you did that, so good!

You got that right
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Old 11-19-2010, 01:55 PM   #22
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Behr and Consumer Reports


I have to say my experience with Behr has been quite different that what others say.

I used the top end Behr (the paint/primer in one) a number of times, and I've had great results. Superior coverage with a single coat, even when covering deep colors.

This paint is quite thick - unlike the way it's described by others.

I've used this paint in my primary home, as well as our lake home, and I've always had good luck. I'm almost ready to paint my addition at the lake house, and this is what I'll use.......
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Old 11-19-2010, 07:33 PM   #23
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Behr and Consumer Reports


there is what's referred to as the "behr roulette wheel" some of it does work alright. however, one day you'll get a color that just runs, leaves lines and generally pisses you off. this is why most of us gravitate to SW or BM. besides, you can get a decent SW paint for the same price as behr.
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Old 11-19-2010, 09:07 PM   #24
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Behr and Consumer Reports


Thanks all for the information. I went to Sherwin Williams and I have to say that I was extremely impressed with the guy working there. He didn't make me feel like an idiot, he didn't push anything on me, and it was just a great experience. I was really shocked because sometimes when you walk into a place where you're not a professional, they make you feel kind of stupid. But no, he explained everything to me, including the different spray patterns and psi's. I told him I had a graco, but I forget what tip it was (515) and what the psi was on the machine.

I ended up purchasing 6 gallons of paint there and two packs of rollers and it was 250. I believe the paint worked out to be about 30 (per gallon) for 2 gallons of cashmere and 39 (per gallon) for the 4 gallons of duration.

I was at HD tonight and glanced at some of their paint. I want to say it was about 30 bucks for a gallon of their paint. IMHO, 9 bucks additionally per gallon for the premium SW paint, I dont' mind spending. Now if it was like 20 bucks more, I might rethink....or maybe not.

I'm going to start this tomorrow and I don't anticipate any issues. I'm anxious to see how it will turn out.

Thanks for everybody's input. And BTW, it's interesting to read CR reviews....but I do agree that user opinions and reviews are so much more meaningful than CR. I'd take 30 user reviews on amazon.com over a CR report any day.
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Old 11-20-2010, 06:54 AM   #25
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Behr and Consumer Reports


Another thing: that $30 you paid for real paint and the $30 price tag on Behr...which one is worth more?

The overhead and markup on a gallon of paint for a 40,000 sqft bright orange store with parking lot and 35 employees - or the smaller paint store with 2000sqft and 5 employees?

I reckon the Behr 'costs' about $10 to make; then you add markup and expenses and you arrive at a selling price $30 a gallon. BM and SW costs $20 to make (but it's better paint) and I don't begrudge $10 markup to get the service.
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Old 11-20-2010, 03:33 PM   #26
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Behr and Consumer Reports


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Originally Posted by ccarlisle View Post
Another thing: that $30 you paid for real paint and the $30 price tag on Behr...which one is worth more?

The overhead and markup on a gallon of paint for a 40,000 sqft bright orange store with parking lot and 35 employees - or the smaller paint store with 2000sqft and 5 employees?

I reckon the Behr 'costs' about $10 to make; then you add markup and expenses and you arrive at a selling price $30 a gallon. BM and SW costs $20 to make (but it's better paint) and I don't begrudge $10 markup to get the service.
not sure, i was thinking about this the other day. HD has kitchen cabinets and a host of other slow moving product they keep on the shelf offset by fast movers like paint and saw blades. i would not at all be surprised to see the actual cost for behr to fall between $5-10, ten would be on the high side. as for SW, at their best price bracket promar 200 is $19 and change with most of us paying $23-28 a gallon. SW also does SO much commercial business. one of my friends who owns a established painting business will buy 1000+ gallons a year from them and that's just him. so, i agree it stands to reason the SW paints probably cost more to make....either that or they are just a LOT smarter with the formula lol. what i can't even begin to guess is how much they would cost. HD is a little easier because you can tell awful fast where the high mark up items in that store are.

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