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-   -   Well.... FRACK! (http://www.diychatroom.com/f39/well-frack-153158/)

DangerMouse 08-09-2012 12:47 PM

Well.... FRACK!
 
Has anyone else here been approached by frackers to lease their land?
The more I read about it on line, the more I think my neighbors are idiots for signing up!!! Thoughts?

DM

DexterII 08-09-2012 01:09 PM

There was chatter about the fact that they would be coming to us soon, but they ran into some fairly stiff opposition in some areas that would have been more immediately impacted, so it seems to have cooled down a bit here, at least for the time being. And, now that Enbridge wants to expand their pipeline capabilities, on top of their most recent issues, I mentioned to someone the other evening that they may drop the fracking discussion until things settle down a bit. I have read a fair amount on the subject, even though I can't recall half of what I read any more, and have not yet been able to formulate an opinion. It seems to be one of those things that is going to come, regardless of public opinion, but I am not convinced that the technology is fully there yet to do it "right", whatever that might mean, not to mention the problem of legislating the proper inspections, guidelines, etc., without politicians at the federal, state, and local levels letting their own agendas get in the way of what is good and right for the rest of us.

DangerMouse 08-09-2012 01:20 PM

Here is some interesting reading I plan on sharing with a few of my neighbors....

http://ohiocitizen.org/?cat=94&paged=2

http://beavercountian.com/content/da...r-county-court

http://gomarcellusshale.com/forum/to...age=1#comments

http://salon.glenrose.net/default.as...=plink&id=2861

http://www.cnbc.com/id/47897630

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.s...st_they_c.html

DM

rusty baker 08-09-2012 02:00 PM

There was an article in Rolling Stone about it a few months ago. It was a disaster for some people. The money didn't amount to much, their well water was ruined and they ended up with a huge mess. And it was all legal.

user1007 08-12-2012 07:30 AM

I would call your State Department of Natural Resources and/or state level EPA for suggestions and information. Let them know what is going on. They may be able to help. Really! Of course here the budgets of both have been slashed dramatically.

DNR here has some jurisdiction over land use over and above the landowner, sort of like an easement for the good of all citizens, and the net effect is they have been able to save or restore some badly damaged land. I know of one horizontal drilling operation that did loads of damage years ago. It was supposed to be safe but a leak happened and the material used to line the drilled spaces so pipe can later be slipped through was not detected until acres and acres of prime and protected wetlands were severely damaged. The company, of course, wanted out with a slap on the wrist, minimum fines, and permission to start in again waving landowner leases. DNR did not let them get away with it.

Unfortunately, waving revenue promises in front of land owners in these tough times is of course tempting. Taxes still have to be paid on the land. DNR and EPA really do understand. The are not the heartless government agencies sometimes portrayed. I shutter to think what would happen without them in at least some situations like you mention.

joecaption 08-12-2012 08:04 AM

If you look around on the plumbing area at some older post you'll see quite a few people asking what sounds at fist to be a strange question. Most sound something like this "How much does it cost to run a mile long water line" or "What type pump do I use to pump water from a tanker truck to my house".
All of them could not have a well because of contaminated soil from fracking or oil and gas drilling.

Mort 08-12-2012 11:07 AM

We live right on a river that flows into the Columbia, so I'm thinking frackers wouldn't want that sort of headache.

tiger500 08-13-2012 09:54 AM

No, but I was just watching a documentary on it a couple months ago and it just totally blew my mind. No way in hell would I agree to anything like that.

Canucker 08-13-2012 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdsester (Post 986640)
They may be able to help. Really! Of course here the budgets of both have been slashed dramatically.

.

This sounds like my government too, they don't bother changing legislation, they just take funding away from the departments that oversee those areas. Good luck catching anyone doing anything wrong then.:wink:

AGWhitehouse 08-13-2012 02:36 PM

No use getting the government involved...the frackers and the gov't really want the same...it's all "totally safe" right up till the last bit is pulled from the ground. Then it'll be "oh sorry, we didn't know"...

Jim F 08-14-2012 09:28 PM

Wow, hot topic in my neck of the woods right now. Here, the landowners have formed a coalition. This will, hopefully help them negotiate the best deal from the drillers without getting hosed. It seems like a good idea to me to get the same sort of collective bargaining power in your area DM.

I have one of the "postage stamp" village lots so they are not knocking on my door to sign a lease. The Anti drillers sure have and my wife sent them on their way because she knows how I feel about it.

There has been a lot of scare rhetoric online, especially in discussion forumns and very little of it is based on facts. They are only now just beginning to study the possible risks on groundwater contamination and other possible harmful effects horizontal drilling and hydrolic fracturing. There are incidences of contaminated wells etc. but these incidents are reported and magnified way beyond the actual occurances. They are now discovering that some of these contaminated wells in Pennsylvania, for example, are either not contaminated as they once thought and have been deemed safe for drinkning or in some instances were cause by other industry such as coal mining.

Here the large landowners sport signs supporting drilling or fracking and the postage stamp owners sport the anti-fracking sort. This seems self-serving in both instances as well as uninformed on behalf of the small lot owners since they have a financial stake in this as well.

These operations, where they are allowed to exist add money to the tax base thereby reducing the tax burden for everyone. The area of upstate NY where I live is dying. It has been hit hard by the recession and I feel that the benefits of gas drilling and production in the Marcellus Shale far outweigh the risks.

user1007 08-15-2012 05:54 AM

I realize it is a controversial issue. First, I assure you the one horizontal drilling project I mentioned here that destroyed acres and acres of wetlands was not overstated or made sensational. It was and will remain an environmental disaster of great proportion for several generations to come. The State has seized the land and compensated those who owned some of it private with funds they got from the suing the drillers. But it is a mess. What once was thriving environnment looks like a crusted over scene from a science fiction film.

Our ever increasing demand for energy and fresh water (this state is running out because development exceeds the ability of aquafores to replenish and we have polluted the rivers beyond safe use) means we have to get it somewhere. Horizontal drilling may be part of the answer.

The disaster I mention got to be so because the drillers "set it and forgot it" and were not mandated to keep an eye on what they were doing. Had they been held to regular inspections it probably would not have happened. Had they been mandated to use safer drilling and core lining practices in the first place it probably would not have happened. Will any companies including the one here that got nailed for millions offer to do this on their own?:no::no::no::no: For the one in question, millions paid for the damage even though some of the settlement was punitive was still cheaper than implementing safe practices as company policy.

Horizontal drilling can be done safely but safety comes at a cost. Severe environmental damage and proclaiming "oops" when something goes horribly wrong is not, in my opinion, the best way to pay those costs. People here screamed at the IEPA and DNR for not doing more to prevent disaster. Most screaming loudest were landowners that before the disaster accused both agencies of creating situations so oppressive the drillers threatened to pull the leases and revenue streams. One guy with a hunting lodge and campground (land around it totally destroyed for that purpose) was absolutely hilarious as he screamed for fracking before it started but then wanted public hangings when it went bad.

Jim F 08-15-2012 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdsester (Post 989162)
The disaster I mention got to be so because the drillers "set it and forgot it" and were not mandated to keep an eye on what they were doing. Had they been held to regular inspections it probably would not have happened. Had they been mandated to use safer drilling and core lining practices in the first place it probably would not have happened. Will any companies including the one here that got nailed for millions offer to do this on their own?:no::no::no::no: For the one in question, millions paid for the damage even though some of the settlement was punitive was still cheaper than implementing safe practices as company policy.

Horizontal drilling can be done safely but safety comes at a cost.

Exactly!

user1007 08-01-2013 07:52 AM

Anybody else watching this situation in Canada unfold? It was not exactly fracking but similar technology. Not only can the exact source of the leak not be found, nobody seems to know how to stop it. A giant oil spill is unfolding on both sacred native Canadian land; it is apparently sort of an eyes only military site too. Nobody is being allowed near it. Some say the leak may dwarf the Valdez spill and the BP spill in the gulf combined if it continues at the current rate.

It happened when pressurized steam was put into the earth with no real thought as to what would happen if it broke things apart elsewhere then expected.

I miss the mouse by the way.

gregzoll 08-01-2013 08:04 AM

Gas Land 1 & 2 tells the best story how bad this disaster is. Next to it, is the underground storage of CO2.


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