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Old 05-27-2013, 03:38 PM   #16
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Wow. Tad paranoid?

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Old 05-27-2013, 06:01 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by sdsester View Post
A color rendering index of 80 is just not acceptable to me or any of my gallery clients. I do not care the primary color temp in K when staring at it.
I'm assuming art galliers don't use incandescent style bulbs anyway, these 60 watt LED's are made to closely resemble the familiar incandescent bulbs we all used in residences for so many decades in table lamps, pendant lamps and so forth, a 60 watt bulb isn't going to light a commercial space, let along a whole art gallery!
I think you mistook my posts, or else I assumed you were interested in normal residential type lighting, but it seems you are more focussed on comemrcial and art gallery installations and it should be obvious these 60 watt bulbs are not even designed for that purpose at all.
You need track lights and floods in a large gallery space, they (Cree) DO have PAR20, PAR30 and PAR38 floods in LED and I don't know what their specs or CRI IS for those bulbs since I did not buy those.


Quote:
Lad you are missing the point. Staring at the temp a bulb and its primary temperature is one thing. If, when you are not staring at it, it can only deliver a color rendering index of 80?
They look fine to me regardless of the number...

Did you see the photo I posted before?

Here they are for comparison:

A room lit with a 60 watt incandescent:




The same room Lit with the Cree 60 watt such as those I purchased:



Can you tell any difference? about all I see is maybe the Cree 60 watt is just ever so slightly brighter, everything else is pratically exactly the same, even down to the filament glow- which is what I said earlier, these particular bulbs are designed for the purpose you see in the pictures- residential up lighting, pendant lights, ceiling lights, table lamps with shad etc


Quote:
I do know what you mean though. There are lots of light bulbs out there in the 5,000K (starting point of daylight) that really look awful. Because, guess what I am going to suggest? They only emit light at 5K or whatever. They have a color rendering index capability of 80 or lower. Switch to full spectrum, 6500 or above, with 95 CRI or above and it will change your life.

Color is judged as a standard at 6500K to start with a reliable CRI of 95 or above just to start. 80 CRI is not even close.
From what I've read, the color k is one factor and the CRI is one factor, neither is more important than the other and just because one number differs from another doesn't mean a particular bulb should be discarded from consideration, there's a lot more to the specs and real seat of the pants "look" than some numbers suggest.

The spiral CFL's we all have appear to be in the 80s CRI too, but the CFL's have a bunch of disadvantages that puts the LED's ahead of them now:

1) The price has come way down now to $12.97, now we will be splitting hairs on $12 bulbs v/s $10 bulbs, not $50 bulbs v/s $10 if you know what I mean.

2) The Cree bulbs are assembled in the USA not China like CFL's all are.

3)They contain no mercury and don't have to be disposed of as hazardous waste as CFL's are legally required to be.

4) They are extremely rugged in construction and well built,I would have NO qualms using these in a trouble light at work!

5) They give off almost no heat at all, even after running 24/7 for 2 weeks you can hold the bulb in your bare hand

6) They CAN be used in totally enclosed fixures, ceiling cans, track lights etc CFL's will burn up.

7) Leds themselves as components in general are extremely rugged and long lived, with a long track record

8)These bulbs come with a 10 year warrantee

9) they use even less power than CFLs

10)The CFLs like all fluorescents- tend to lose some of their light output as they age.

11) The Cree LEDs can be dimmed

I can think of a few more I'm sure, now maybe these benefits are not worth ripping out all your working CFls and replacing them, but as the CFL's burn out and go bad, replacing those that do with these LED's is definitely worthwhile.

I wish I could get a good photo of my 5 light fixture with these Cree bulbs in it, but when I tried it the photo was way over exposed in part and underexposed in the rest, they must use some special techniques to shoot photos in a room of bright light fixtures, but I really like the look of the light, especially in the fixtures I have as they match the 1910 era of the building and the tin ceiling, and the light has a warm elegant look.
I have the PAR20 over my computer desk in a track light, it's definitely brighter than what I had.

To be perfectly clear, I am ONLY addressing specifically the Cree brand of 60 watt LED bulbs and their PAR20 spotlight, I cannot vouch for any other brand or bulb style, and if anyone has had bad results with *AN* Led bulb for any reason, be it price, light, performance, lifespan etc keep in mind not all are the same any more than a Yugo car is the same as a Mercedes car, don't dismiss the LED aspect then, dismiss the BRAND because every review and a number of published tests, including a bulb tear down have had high marks, scores and positive reviews on this particular BRAND (Cree) so don't go and buy a GE or Sylvania brand LED bulb and expect it to be the same, they aren't the same!
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Last edited by RWolff; 05-27-2013 at 06:05 PM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:15 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by mj12 View Post
I was all over those led light bulbs when I saw they went down to 10 bucks. After a few months they have mostly ended up in the fridge. For one, every time you turn on the light it seems that like the bulb blows out. It is like a flash. The light quality is ok I guess. I have led strip lights that I routered into my door jambs and stay on all the time to act as a night light of sorts. But you can not see them inside the room, only when the bedroom doors are open. Not to rain on anyone's party, but I may as just tell you now so you know. These led bulbs are all part of a global enslavement of humanity. The flicker rate is highly controllable. Basically people can be influenced on a larger and larger scale thanks to these bulbs. I would use caution with these bulbs.

You did not mention what BRAND these were, I would think it quite unfair to condemn an entire product line based on cheap knock-offs, I have not seen a $10 LED bulb yet, Cree has the lowest price at Home Depot and they are $12.97 there only, on Amazon etc they are closer to $20 so HD must be partially sponsoring the bulbs selling them at wholesale cost or a little below.
The bulbs you are describing are completely different from ones I'm describing, let us not try comparing a Yugo to a Mercedes in brands, or a $1.95 flashlight to a commercial chandelier.

THESE are the bulbs I am talking about, they have a glass bulb with a silicone coating on the outside (helps get a good firm grip on them, and holds the glass if you break one) these are $12.97 I don't know what the $10 bulb is mentioned below unless it's the 40 watt model.
These bulbs come with a TEN YEAR warrantee:




This is what they look like inside:




Updated April 24 Cree shines as fiscal 3Q revenue reaches a record $349M

LED lighting company Cree reports record revenue amid strong demand for its products, including its new consumer-focused $10 LED light bulb that was unveiled last month.


Quote:
Updated March 6 New Cree LED bulb means 200 jobs in Durham, perhaps more to come

Cree's new line of LED bulbs that the Durham-based company introduced Tuesday means new jobs for the Triangle. Cree already has hired 200 people to make the bulbs locally, and the LEDs are made in N.C. as well, a company executive says.
Note that's 200 AMERICANS put back to work instead of shipping more cash to CHINA!
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Last edited by RWolff; 05-27-2013 at 06:20 PM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:43 PM   #19
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The bulbs are the cree bulbs. The ten dollar bulbs are the cree 40 watt equivalent. I also have the cree bulbs with the coating that are 12.95. I bought them from the bigbox. There are pros and cons to all these bulbs. If you stroll over to the electrical forum you will see many of these led bulbs are difficult to dim. Leds are the future as a major hurdle has just been overcome. The physics is more than I could ever understand, but basically as I understand things led will be able to become very very bright with only minimal power consumption. In practical terms a very small led bulb will be able to illuminate a football stadium. I read this in a technical manual so it was very hard to understand exactly what they were saying, or if the findings translate into real world applications.
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Old 05-27-2013, 08:39 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mj12 View Post
The bulbs are the cree bulbs. The ten dollar bulbs are the cree 40 watt equivalent. I also have the cree bulbs with the coating that are 12.95. I bought them from the bigbox. There are pros and cons to all these bulbs. If you stroll over to the electrical forum you will see many of these led bulbs are difficult to dim.
Well I can't say much on that, I didn't buy the 40 watts, but if you had a problem with them they DO come with a 10 year warrantee.
All of mine have been working just fine, the PAR20 over my desk is normally on a lot of hours a day every day.
I never needed a dimmer and feel dimming lights is not something I need, but the Cree bulbs come highly rated on the dimmability aspect but I assume you do need to verify your particular dimmer is compatable, not all dimmers are and that could be the problem, according to one of the bigger test results articles I read that I posted a link to before- they found they could dim them WAY down and it was smooth, so the dimmer itself needs to be verified it's compatable (and works properly itself)

Also, anything like voltage spikes, and storms that cause surges are going to pretty much toast any bulb, especially any that have electronics in them as all leds and CFL's have.


Quote:
If you stroll over to the electrical forum you will see many of these led bulbs are difficult to dim.
I would not hold much faith in the working of a big box store's sample display light thing, something just tells me they use whatever cheap kind of generic dimmer they use for the display is going to work with some bulbs and not others, but the dimmer you have in your house is likely better, and it might not work with some bulbs that work at the store and vice-versa.
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Last edited by RWolff; 05-27-2013 at 08:42 PM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 10:50 PM   #21
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Rwolff.,

I have used the commercal verison of CREE LED luminaries for recessed cans and let you know that they do work very well and there are few good plus that we can assisted to that.

A) low power drawage.

B) fully dimmable ( only with proper dimmer switch )

C) long service life can go much as 50 K hours without burnout.

D) with the recessed can verison either retrofit or new construction verison the lens is good and have no hot spots at all.

They do come in several wattage rating but some case just watch they will mention lumines as well so use both for your judgement on it.

And they will come in few differnt colour tempture as well.

I been useing European spec'ed verison which they are 240 volts and I have no issues with them for last couple years.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 05-29-2013, 01:20 AM   #22
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Heres a video of a tear down examination of one of these bulbs
Cree LED 60W Light Bulb Extreme Teardown and Review


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Old 05-29-2013, 08:14 AM   #23
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As far I can tell, most LEDs dim great, but you really have to have the correct dimmer. And a lot of dimmers that really seem like they should work right don't. That issue should shake out fairly quickly over the next few years as LEDs completely eclipse the other bulb types in almost every way.

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