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Old 09-21-2010, 08:34 PM   #31
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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Mediocre? I like the 18V Dewalt power tools <snip>. My blue 18V Ryobi is a good drill <snip> Milwaukee used to be one of my favorite power tools <snip>. My Makita 18V impact driver is highly rated for its power and light ergonomic shape. Bosch is well designed and durable......can't go wrong with any of these winners
That's EXACTLY what I mean by mediocre. They have some decent tools, some pretty ones, and some dogs as well. They are not high-end, nor harbor frieght specials, that's what mediocre means...average, middle of the road, what ever.

I'm not knocking them, just saying they aren't as special as those that drank the kool-aid coming out of their marketing department like to say they are. They are an average( mediocre) tool, with an above average market share. A lot like Ford in the auto industry, or Budweiser in the world of beer. None of these are phenomal products, just marketed extremely well.

I was simply responding to a post that implied that they were a superior "high-end" brand, and that there market share was a testement to that fact

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Old 09-21-2010, 08:50 PM   #32
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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That's EXACTLY what I mean by mediocre. They have some decent tools, some pretty ones, and some dogs as well. They are not high-end, nor harbor frieght specials, that's what mediocre means...average, middle of the road, what ever.

I'm not knocking them, just saying they aren't as special as those that drank the kool-aid coming out of their marketing department like to say they are. They are an average( mediocre) tool, with an above average market share. A lot like Ford in the auto industry, or Budweiser in the world of beer. None of these are phenomal products, just marketed extremely well.

I was simply responding to a post that implied that they were a superior "high-end" brand, and that there market share was a testement to that fact
FYI----Ford has the highest quality of any mfg import or domestic. Yep, even Toyota.
And it's not because they advertise. It's because they worked hard to improve overall design and fabrication.

The public picked up on it because they liked what they saw and bought it.

Try taking a marketing class. I do sales for a living and I know what motivates a consumer to yes or no to a product. And that's quality.

You have a personal bias to pwer tools and you aren't even a tradesman by your screen title as a "DIY HACK". So what does a hack know?
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Old 09-21-2010, 09:02 PM   #33
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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FYI----Ford has the highest quality of any mfg import or domestic. Yep, even Toyota.
And it's not because they advertise. It's because they worked hard to improve overall design and fabrication.

The public picked up on it because they liked what they saw and bought it.

Try taking a marketing class. I do sales for a living and I know what motivates a consumer to yes or no to a product. And that's quality.

You have a personal bias to pwer tools and you aren't even a tradesman by your screen title as a "DIY HACK". So what does a hack know?
I have a "personal bias to power tools"? that's funny. I am in no way attacking them, but you are taking my observations ver personally and blindly defending them. that's what good marketing does. You definelty drank the Kool-Aid. " Stay thirsty my friend!!".....
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Old 09-21-2010, 09:21 PM   #34
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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I have a "personal bias to power tools"? that's funny. I am in no way attacking them, but you are taking my observations ver personally and blindly defending them. that's what good marketing does. You definelty drank the Kool-Aid. " Stay thirsty my friend!!".....
No. I am putting out verifiable facts on your belief that a "mediocre" product
can not get the market that De Walt and Ford have with out it being better than you say i.e. a quality product.
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Old 09-21-2010, 09:49 PM   #35
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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No. I am putting out verifiable facts on your belief that a "mediocre" product
can not get the market that De Walt and Ford have with out it being better than you say i.e. a quality product.
Sure you can, as long as you offer a good value proposition, and strong marketing you'll grow market share. From the mid 90's -2004 DeWalt spent $$$$ to put their logo everywhere, billboards, city buses, NASCAR. it was really unheard of in the industrial tool market. they literally made themselves a houshold name.
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Old 09-21-2010, 10:13 PM   #36
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


I have several DeWalt tools, although the only cordless one is my drill. Corded or cordless, they are great tools. The fact that B&D owns them has nothing to do with it. GM makes corvettes and crappy commuters. Companies that I have worked for have a junk line, an intermediate line, and top line of products - what separates them are the specification demands and the tolerances.

For corded DeWalts I own:
router
12" comp miter
12" sliding comp miter
16 ga nailer
3/8 drill
1/2 hammer drill
recip saw
table saw (the little dw744)
circ saw
bench grinder
12" planer
and I'm sure there's something else that I forgot about.

I can't think of one complaint for any of them. Even the little table saw has a fence that is superior to any other that I've seen (rack and pinion - zero play, zero float).

I also own Powermatic, Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Rigid, Metabo, and Lincoln Electric. Rigid is as low as I go. I will never buy a Ryobi and if I were given a Ryobi as a gift, I would grind it until it was dust, put the dust in a ziplock bag, wrap the bag with 5 rolls of duct tape, lock the taped bag in a home safe, seal weld the safe, dig a 12' hole, throw the safe in the hole, pour concrete in the hole, build a house on top of the hole, and then pull a Grizzly Adams and head for the Rockies. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 09-22-2010, 09:31 AM   #37
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


That's the beauty of great marketing, it builds strong feelings of brand loyalty. We could easily be having this debate about Ford vs Chevy, Coke vs Pepsi, Sony vs Pioneer, Microsoft vs Apple, etc....

For my money, Makita makes the best cordless tools. They are rugged, lightweight, and more ergonomic than DeWalts cordless offering. For the average home owner, Ryobi offers a lot of bang for the buck. Panasonic has a couple great tools in their cordless offering, but the selection is pretty limited, and they've done a terrible job getting these into contractors hands.

True, I am not a tradesman (which is why i belong to the DIY Chatroom), but I have sold several brands of power tools for a long time, and and participated in testing at commercial job sites across the country. I know contractors that swear by just about every brand out there, and when it comes to DeWalt it seems to be either a love them or hate them situation.

I am not saying they are junk, but I don't think they are superior overall to most of the other big brands out there. They are clearly above average when it comes to marketing. They have done a tremendous job at brand building and certainly deserve a lot of credit for that. The DeWalt brand was reborn because Black & Decker's market research showed the brand was thought of in much the same way Ryobi is thought of today, so they made the tools yellow, slapped a new brand badge on them, and marketed the heck out of the exact same tools, only to contractors instead of home owners. It's deffinetly one of the biggest (if not the biggest) marketing succes stories in the tool industry in the last 30 years.
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Old 09-22-2010, 09:42 AM   #38
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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The fact that B&D owns them has nothing to do with it. GM makes corvettes and crappy commuters. .
It doesn't matter today, but it did matter back when the brand was taking off. They were selling a lot of the exact same tools, under two different brand names. The only thing different was the name and the color. Gears, motors and such were exactly the same, and the schematics back in the day even listed the exact same internal part numbers. The brand has certainly evolved, but when they were growing their market share, it was all through marketing. This is what allowed them to get to where they are today. It was a lot like VW selling the Chrysler Town & Country ( or Dodge Grand Caravan) as the Routon, or when Honda first launched the Passport, it was simply an Isuzu Rodeo sold under a different brand ( but in the early model years when you popped the hood of a Honda Passport the motor had a big Isuzu logo right on it!!)
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Old 09-22-2010, 11:16 AM   #39
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I think I'm going to buy a Ryobi and a DeWalt. Just to make sure I've offended pretty much everyone in this thread to some degree.
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Old 09-22-2010, 11:57 AM   #40
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im just a homeowner and have ryobi. i bought my first home a year ago and needed tools to start getting the place move in ready. i dropped my nut on closing costs and was on a killer budget, i bought the ryobi 18v kit with drill, 5-1/2" circular saw and like for like 80 bucks. since then i've purchased their 18v impact driver. over the last year i've used the tools alot. my conclusion, the drill has held up ok, the circular saw absolutely blows. the impact driver has held up the best (and gets the most use). the batteries on the other hand are a joke. After a year, I'm constantly switching them out during the day. and forget about using the saw. I get just enough juice to barely cut though a piece of 1X12 pvc.

I kick myself for not getting something better to begin with and i kick myself even more for buying the impact gun instead of a better brand simply because it took the same battery as the stuff i have now.

If you're a homeowner and want to save money, buy the ryobi drill/drivers, stay away from battery powered saws, and at least get the lithium battery powered stuff.

I'm secretly hoping my current ryobi stuff craps out on me so i can upgrade. haha.
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Old 09-22-2010, 12:33 PM   #41
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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im just a homeowner and have ryobi. i bought my first home a year ago and needed tools to start getting the place move in ready. i dropped my nut on closing costs and was on a killer budget, i bought the ryobi 18v kit with drill, 5-1/2" circular saw and like for like 80 bucks. since then i've purchased their 18v impact driver. over the last year i've used the tools alot. my conclusion, the drill has held up ok, the circular saw absolutely blows. the impact driver has held up the best (and gets the most use). the batteries on the other hand are a joke. After a year, I'm constantly switching them out during the day. and forget about using the saw. I get just enough juice to barely cut though a piece of 1X12 pvc.
Cordless circ saws are one of the items that most manufacturers have struggled with over the years. They have all put out some dogs in this category! Makita had an awesome one in their MakStar line. It was available in 24v and took regular 7-1/4 blades. The downsides were it weighed a ton, and was mucho dinero ( and a lot of American money too).

Your Ryobi observations are spot on, but for $80 for a two piece set, it's still a good value if you are just using around the house and have realistic expectations of what an $80 set should do. with most of the other brands, you'd pay nearly $80 just for a battery.
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Old 09-22-2010, 12:38 PM   #42
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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Originally Posted by moopey View Post
im just a homeowner and have ryobi. i bought my first home a year ago and needed tools to start getting the place move in ready. i dropped my nut on closing costs and was on a killer budget, i bought the ryobi 18v kit with drill, 5-1/2" circular saw and like for like 80 bucks. since then i've purchased their 18v impact driver. over the last year i've used the tools alot. my conclusion, the drill has held up ok, the circular saw absolutely blows. the impact driver has held up the best (and gets the most use). the batteries on the other hand are a joke. After a year, I'm constantly switching them out during the day. and forget about using the saw. I get just enough juice to barely cut though a piece of 1X12 pvc.

I kick myself for not getting something better to begin with and i kick myself even more for buying the impact gun instead of a better brand simply because it took the same battery as the stuff i have now.

If you're a homeowner and want to save money, buy the ryobi drill/drivers, stay away from battery powered saws, and at least get the lithium battery powered stuff.

I'm secretly hoping my current ryobi stuff craps out on me so i can upgrade. haha.
For a small household jobs Ryobi is ok. But when you earn your living using a cordless tool your Ryobi won't make it.
I h ope you get something that will last longer. All of the big names have some lower priced cordless tools that cost a little more than Ryobi, but it's worth the investment.
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Old 09-22-2010, 12:44 PM   #43
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Cordless power tool brands - What's your fave?


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For a small household jobs Ryobi is ok. But when you earn your living using a cordless tool your Ryobi won't make it.
I h ope you get something that will last longer. All of the big names have some lower priced cordless tools that cost a little more than Ryobi, but it's worth the investment.
such as grinding ryobi tools into dust to be placed in a ziplock back and wrapped in 5 rolls of duct tape, and placed in a home safe.....
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Old 09-22-2010, 12:52 PM   #44
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such as grinding ryobi tools into dust to be placed in a ziplock back and wrapped in 5 rolls of duct tape, and placed in a home safe.....
yeah but don't get cut....if you bleed on Ryobi tool dust it will resurrect just like Chis Lee (my avatar) in "Dracula Prince of Darkness"..... .

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Old 09-22-2010, 09:55 PM   #45
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I like the Makita LXT lithium battery tools. I have a drill and impact driver that have never let me down. I own some DeWalt tools, but after the cordless circular saw let me down, I went to Makita and never looked back. Pricey, but well worth it.

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