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Old 05-01-2012, 09:19 PM   #1
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


Hey guys,

My Wife and I just bought our first house, when it came time for the home inspection he seemed to do his job, crawled into the attic, under the house and on the roof.

The house is a 1300sq ft house with a crawl space on pier and beam built in 1960. We reside in Oklahoma.

On his report the only thing he noted structure wise was to add support to 'spongy' floors in dining room and that the hall was out of level.

We took possession of the house yesterday, all last night and starting early this morning I've been removing carpet, tile and wood paneling that was hideous getting ready for the new carpet and hardwood floors I'm putting down.

I decided to go under the house and see about adding some support to the joists he wrote about when I start crawling around more and noticing things that were not in the report.











Below is a room that has been added in sometime in the past, I'm happy with how this looks.












I think I have an idea in the back of my head how I need to go about repairing the rotting part of the "sill" plate, it's odd how that is set up by the way.

And as for the joists that the ends are compressed where they meet the beam I figure I can jack the joists up a little bit to where I can sister or 'cantilever' a few feet of new joist next to it to take the load off the compressed part.

Then I need to find a solution for the beam where the joint is uneven.

Also, if you noticed on the weird sill plate where the wood is rotted you can see down into the cinder blocks. Anyone have an idea how to properly fix this? It's the same way around the entire house minus the addition.

Thanks for reading friends =/

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Old 05-01-2012, 09:19 PM   #2
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Structure troubles, please advise =/







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Old 05-01-2012, 09:21 PM   #3
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


We found this tonight.. We closed yesterday, I tried to call the inspection agency but they had already closed. I'm going to call again tomorrow but have a feeling that it will lead no where, they seem sneaky in the legal verbiage I've been looking over..

I'm a jack of all trades, carpenter, worked as an electrician and I'm currently working as an aircraft structures mechanic.. So I'm pretty handy at about anything I set me mind to, I will undertake this project myself if at all possible.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:28 AM   #4
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


We only have pictures to go by but from what I can see and would have noted is, there's no vaper barrier, there's fungus growing on the joist and the beam
Fungus eats the celulose that holds the wood fibers together.
Where that beam is rotted is there an attached deck or porch?
Those block piers should have been solid at the top.
Looks like undersized floor joist for the span and spaced more then 16" on center. (pretty common in older homes)
There's missing supports for the drain lines.
Since the hardwood was just attached directly to the floor joist it's going to be a weaker floor and cold air can just blow up though all the joints.
I do not see any cross bracing between some of the floor joist.
No support under a splice in the main beam.

The joist are compressing for several reasons, there weakened from all the moisture causing the fungus, not enough joist to spread out the load.

Not going to make you feel better but it looks like any old house I've ever looked at, there all pretty common problums.
I would not be installing any flooring or wall coverings until this stuff gets addressed.

Last edited by joecaption; 05-02-2012 at 09:41 AM.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:34 AM   #5
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


I know this does not help with a solution but was the home inspector referred to you by the realtor?
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:45 AM   #6
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


Sure sounds like it Hammer. One way to never have a house fail inspection.
Also someone did not remove the siding and add a double joist hanger.
Looks like a DIY addition when I see something like that.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:28 PM   #7
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


I've been speaking the the inspector and their company today and they are basically telling me that the rotted area in question was covered up with dirt at the time of his inspection and he did not see it. The termite guy when he went out there is the one who evidently moved the dirt to look for termite damage. I'm baffled as to why he didn't make calls to report the rot to the other guys.

So basically it seems like I'm stuck with the bill. I have 2 different contractors coming out in the morning to give me estimates on repairing damage or replacing the entire floor structure.

We have about $12,000 in a savings account that we can use for repairs that we have been saving for a trip. I don't even have a clue how much something like this would cost.. We paid $93,000 for the house which sits on 2 city lots equaling about .75 acres.

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Old 05-02-2012, 01:01 PM   #8
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


I am not sure I understand where you are going with this thread. If you are thinking that you want to sue the house inspector or the termite inspector because they did not report to you all the damage you later found, that is a legal issue, and requires an attorney to pursue. Before going down that route, you should read your contract with both inspectors, if they did what their contract required, I don't see how you would have a case, but this is America, you can sue anyone for anything.

As for repairing the damage, that is another matter. Frankly I have done a lot of insurance work, and I have crawled over, under, around and through a lot of houses that look a lot worse than the pictures you presented. Joecaption did a nice job presenting visually apparent issues, no doubt there more issues not obvious from the photos.

Whether you do the work yourself, hire a contractor, or elect to do nothing, your plan should be based on a thorough, careful, comprehensive evaluation of the entire structure. This is NOT something typically done by a home inspector, at least not for the few hundred dollars they are typically paid. I occasionally do detailed inspections for specific structural problems, and I typically charge a minimum of $500, upwards of $1000 if I have to prepare repair plans and estimate cost. I have no idea what the going rate is in Oklahoma, or if there are even any engineers out there who do residential work. Frankly, professional engineers and residential work don't mix well, no offense but the average homeowner thinks I am too expensive and not worth the money. Half the people on this forum probably agree, and my guess is that it carries over to most engineers, so generally I don't do residential work.

You may be able to find a qualified local contractor who can handle the repairs, based on the photos there is no obvious need for specialized engineering skill. There must be a lot of contractors looking for projects, surely one of them can handle your project,including a complete inspection, report, and recommendations on needed repairs.
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Old 05-02-2012, 02:14 PM   #9
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


Daniel, thanks for the reply!

I do not plan to take any legal action, I think I called them out of mere disgust in hopes they would agree that they missed the rot and agree to pay for some of it.

I will know more after tomorrow when contractors show up to look around

I see this ending up to be a total gut of the flooring structure.
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Old 05-02-2012, 02:29 PM   #10
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


I do not see any metal termite shields between cement block and wood sills or beams.
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Old 05-02-2012, 06:40 PM   #11
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


Is the way the sills are turned on end versus laying flat acceptable? I felt behind what I can see and it feels like 2 pieces of lumber tied together. I've never seen it done like that before.
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Old 05-06-2012, 02:18 PM   #12
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Structure troubles, please advise =/


I'd look most at dealing with the moisture typically in crawlspaces, yours looks much better than mine. Good reading at this site, I read through a lot of this and I hired a mold remediation company to come out for an inspection and to give me recommendations - most of the recommendations I was given I had already read on this web site:

http://inspectapedia.com/structure/C...ace_Dryout.php

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Please do NOT consider any "before" picture of my house as any kind of endorsement of any particular construction method. In fact, you should probably assume that if I post a "before" picture, I am posting it because I am soliciting advice on a proper replacement for one of MANY things done wrong by a previous owner.
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