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-   -   Replacement Window - Nail Fin Question (http://www.diychatroom.com/f2/replacement-window-nail-fin-question-26085/)

smoenra 09-01-2008 09:58 AM

Replacement Window - Nail Fin Question
 
I have a dilema in which I'm replacing a number of 9-yr old vinyl windows in my house. I have wood casements and jambs inside the house that I absolutely do not wish to remove. I'm considering removing the j-channel and vinyl siding and pulling the old windows out from the exterior. I would like to use a replacement window (no nail fin) and install and shim from the outside of the house. My question is, besides foaming in the replacement from the outside and re-installing the j-channel and vinyl siding, do I need flashing or a better way of sealing the rough opening to replacement window gap?

smoenra 09-01-2008 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoenra (Post 153849)
I have a dilema in which I'm replacing a number of 9-yr old vinyl windows in my house. I have wood casements and jambs inside the house that I absolutely do not wish to remove. I'm considering removing the j-channel and vinyl siding and pulling the old windows out from the exterior. I would like to use a replacement window (no nail fin) and install and shim from the outside of the house. My question is, besides foaming in the replacement from the outside and re-installing the j-channel and vinyl siding, do I need flashing or a better way of sealing the rough opening to replacement window gap?


Correction to the above, casements should've been casings and jambs should've been sills.

thanks

buletbob 09-01-2008 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoenra (Post 154017)
Correction to the above, casements should've been casings and jambs should've been sills.

thanks

what type of windows are there. you stated casements then changed to casing, do you have double hung???. if so then you do not need to disturb the wall casing,or jambs just need to remove the window stops, which will be reinstalled when the new window is installed. other wise you can replace them. I'm guessing you have some special moldings that you do not want to loose.

you can do it your way, but I'm going to tell you something in my in tire life I have never seen it done this way!!:no: but thinking about it, it can be done.:yes:
you will have to remove the brick mold and the 1/2" x 1-1/4 parting strip holding in the sashes, prep the opening then install your new window unit and then reinstall the wood pieces that you had removed.
A Lot more work!!. its doable. let me know what you decide and how you make out. BOB

smoenra 09-01-2008 09:33 PM

A bit of clarification. The windows are currently vinyl, no wood, and approximately 9-yrs old. Many of the windows have broken glass seals and are drafty - very poor construction.

From the inside of the house, I can see about an 1/8" of the frame of the vinyl window. I do not wish to remove any of the casings, moldings, sills, etc. I would like to simply remove the vinyl windows from the exterior of the home and install replacement windows from the exterior.

My question is, how do I go about sealing the gap between the replacement window and where the nail fin typically is (which I won't have). Is this not a good idea?

buletbob 09-02-2008 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoenra (Post 154066)
A bit of clarification. The windows are currently vinyl, no wood, and approximately 9-yrs old. Many of the windows have broken glass seals and are drafty - very poor construction.

From the inside of the house, I can see about an 1/8" of the frame of the vinyl window. I do not wish to remove any of the casings, moldings, sills, etc. I would like to simply remove the vinyl windows from the exterior of the home and install replacement windows from the exterior.

My question is, how do I go about sealing the gap between the replacement window and where the nail fin typically is (which I won't have). Is this not a good idea?

I think it would be better to post a picture of the existing window and see how that is installed so we can give you a more accurate answer. BOB

Maintenance 6 09-02-2008 06:39 AM

If you are going to replace from the outside anyway, why not use a window with a nail flange? Second, will you be able to find a window with the same jamb width as your current windows? Without a nail flange, you won't have a real good flashing detail behind your J-channel.

smoenra 09-02-2008 11:47 AM

I will post some pictures later tonight to help.

Maintenance 6, I can't use a window w/nail-fins because I won't be able to shim the window as I'm not wanting to touch the wood inside the house (casing, sills, etc.). I can order replacement windows that have the same outside (part around my j-channel) measurement as my current window, which should be the same measurement as the frame of the window.

smoenra 09-02-2008 09:08 PM

6 Attachment(s)
pictures attached

747 09-03-2008 02:04 AM

I think the guys above thought you were going to remove some double hungs. Thats not the case. It looks like that is a bay window with two casements. I would remove the whole dam thing and replace with a marvin 3 or 4 casement window custom order. That would require removing some vinyl siding and reinstalling. Nice vinyl siding job. You could get it white interior and exterior and carefull remove all interior molding put back. Carefully meaning start with a thin pry bar and gently work those molding out. You might have to rip a few for the new window.

smoenra 09-03-2008 09:19 AM

Can anyone tell me why I can not simply leave the wood inside my house alone and pull the windows out from the exterior of the home and re-install replacement windows from the exterior of the home, thus leaving all wood inside alone? My frustration lies with understanding what will happen or how to prevent any water from entering the area btw the window and rough opening on the exterior since I won't have a nail-fin.

thanks!

Maintenance 6 09-03-2008 01:29 PM

I'm sure you can do it from the outside. Will it be as weatherproof as an installation with a nail flange? No. Will the window be held into the structure as well as if it had a nail flange? No. Will you be dependant on expanding foam insulation as a water stop? Yes, unless you come up with some sort of flashing detail to replace the flange and protect the foam, which is not rated for water contact and not meant to be a water seal. Will you be dependant on more than one bead of caulk to provide the only water seal around the perimeter of the window? Sounds like it. If someone asked me to install a window that way, personally, I'd walk away from the job. Way too much perimeter for water to find a way in. Just my $0.02

747 09-04-2008 05:39 AM

I don't see why you are so intimidated by removing the interior trim on that window. You only need 3 tools. A utility knife, A putty knife, a small prybar. Take the utility knife and lightly score around all the wood to loosen up paint and to cut caulk out. Then take the putty knife and carefully free everything up. Then carefully use the small prybar to remove all wood.

smoenra 09-04-2008 10:19 AM

My concern is that all the wood around the window was sprayed on and corners were glued, filled, and sanded prior to spraying. I'm concerned with duplicating the spray finish. If any of the wood does not come apart well (due to glue) it will be difficult to duplicate some of the custom edge work. I would hate to have to hire a trim carpenter and someone to re-paint.


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