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Old 04-08-2013, 08:19 PM   #1
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Counterbored washer


The company where I worked until retirement had plenty of what was called "socket heaad cap screw washers". Now that I have a use for some of these I cannot find them anywhere on the net, nor at three (3) specialty bolt/nut stores, nor the local big box stores. I would like to post a photo of one of these but if I can't find one, I can't copy the photo. These would be as if you take a piece of round stock, cut it to length appropriately, drill and counterbore a hole in the piece for the cap screw to be used. You would leave a bit of metal in the bottom a bit thicker than a regular washer would be. The cap screw would fit down into the c'bore using the bottom for more bearing surface. These were mainly used when a socket head cap screw would be used to hold down something with a slot in it. The bottom of the head of a socket head cap screw would not have enough bearing surface to hold onto the metal on the sides of the slot. The socket head cap screw washer would give the bolt more bearing surface on the sides of the slot. Anyone know what these may be called and where to find them? Thanks, David

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Old 04-08-2013, 08:36 PM   #2
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Counterbored washer


I can picture exactly what it would look like but I've woked off an on in machine shops and own a machine repair company for many years and for the life of me I can not see what you would need one for.
No clue how the counter bore is going to do anything to give you more bearing surface.

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Old 04-09-2013, 02:08 AM   #3
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Counterbored washer


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I can picture exactly what it would look like but I've woked off an on in machine shops and own a machine repair company for many years and for the life of me I can not see what you would need one for.
No clue how the counter bore is going to do anything to give you more bearing surface.
x2. How is it giving you more area than a regular washer? I cannot see a reason for this type of washer either... I would check with McMaster they should have it, unless they were specifically machined for a purpose.. While that would be easy, that doesn't answer your question!
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Old 04-09-2013, 03:00 PM   #4
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Counterbored washer


Most SHCSs I've seen have knurled heads. If you're locating the head in a tight clearance slot, the knurling is going to score the sides of the slot. A counterbored washer would provide not only a smooth bearing, but also a rotating bearing to avoid galling. And probably has a tighter tolerance than a SHCS alone, since I've seen a few SHCS that are not quite concentric -- I think the heads are hot-formed and then quenched, aren't they? Would cause a bit of distortion.

Thurman, how many do you need? Maybe I can make some for you...
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Old 04-09-2013, 04:28 PM   #5
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Counterbored washer


The "counterbore washer" or "socket head cap screw washer" is used to provide more surface area to the part that is being bolted down. Some use a stack of regular flat washers, or a heavy-duty washer to do this but we ran test on some rather large pillow block bearings (somewhere around a six-inch shaft) and proved the regular flat washers will bend down into the slot under moderate pressure/torque. Even so called "heavy-duty" washers will bend under enough torque prior to the specific torque we were looking for. These counterbored washers would not bend, or give, into the slot area. Maybe because of the side walls of this type washer. I agree that most socket head cap screws have knurled sides, but these washer allow for that and do not have an interference fit. How many do I need? Only four (4) Sir, just for a project I am working on at home. McMaster-Carr, W.W. Grainger, MDS, and quite a few others do not carry this type washer. I thought maybe I was dreaming of these until I called a former co-worker who told he did indeed remember us using these by the box fulls at times on many projects. Maybe these were something that GM had made just for them for all I know, but I have used them. I'm making a set of motorcycle saddlebag hangers. The side of these washers will provide an area, on the side, to weld a piece of 3/8" round stock which will be shaped as I need them to be. I made a drawing of what I need and how I intend to use them but am having problems uploading the drawing.
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Last edited by Thurman; 04-09-2013 at 04:28 PM. Reason: OOPs, it worked when I posted the comment. Thanks
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Old 04-09-2013, 09:45 PM   #6
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Counterbored washer


If you know anybody with a small lathe, it should be very simple to make what you are looking for. Since you only need 4 of them. It wouldn't take long at all. You could even make them out of stainless so they wouldn't rust in your application!
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Old 04-10-2013, 08:31 AM   #7
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Counterbored washer


I've seen these simply referred to as cup washers....but a quick intarwebz search yielded very little of the type you're looking for ( tons of the "finishing washer" style), in metal/steel at least. A few in plastic and aluminum, but I doubt either of those would do you any good.

I did see something on a custom motorcycle website, but they were chromed. You may want to try places like that - custom car/motorcycle builders websites, as that's predominantly where I've seen these over the years, they're used in a "decorative" manner in addition to whatever structural support they provide. Even if a custom place doesn't have exactly what you're looking for, they might be able to point you in the right direction.
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Old 04-10-2013, 09:27 AM   #8
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Counterbored washer


You can get these from Misumi:
http://us.misumi-ec.com/us/ItemDetail/10300233040.html
You are going to pay more for these washers. A washer as you described has to be machined on a lathe. A standard flat washer will be stamped in a press, faster than you can count them. But I still don't see what this gets you that you don't get from a heavy flat washer.
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Old 04-10-2013, 09:31 AM   #9
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Counterbored washer


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Originally Posted by SPS-1 View Post
But I still don't see what this gets you that you don't get from a heavy flat washer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thurman View Post
we ran test on some rather large pillow block bearings (somewhere around a six-inch shaft) and proved the regular flat washers will bend down into the slot under moderate pressure/torque. Even so called "heavy-duty" washers will bend under enough torque prior to the specific torque we were looking for. These counterbored washers would not bend, or give, into the slot area. Maybe because of the side walls of this type washer.
Emphasis added.
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Old 04-10-2013, 05:59 PM   #10
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Counterbored washer


Found 'em: I work for Fastenal part-time, so we (the three of us at work) put our heads together (more like the Three Stooges) and did some thinking. My manager called the big Fastenal, got the right person to talk to and asked about these. We supplied them with my crude drawing and they came up with two answers: 1) Fastenal has a complete tooling/machine shop service and all I have to do is supply a working drawing and they will make me a dozen FREE of charge. 2) They found a tooling company in Michigan that makes these every day for a distributor. This makes sense, I worked for GM and this company in Michigan may have made them for GM. The Michigan company supplied this photo to Fastenal which sent it to me:
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