CFL's Are A Waste Of Money - General DIY Discussions - Page 3 - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > DIY Repair > General DIY Discussions

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-11-2010, 09:09 PM   #31
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South of Boston, MA
Posts: 17,248
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


My oldest CFL is over 14 years old
They don't make them like they used to

Advertisement

Scuba_Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2010, 11:40 PM   #32
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 600
Rewards Points: 512
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Fortunately, they don't price them like they used to either.
operagost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2010, 10:23 AM   #33
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 199
Rewards Points: 150
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by SPS-1 View Post
There is the Law of Conservation of Energy. Energy does not evaporate. All the energy that comes out of the wall outlet goes somewhere. In a space-heater, all the energy is converted to heat, regardless of how well it is designed. In a light bulb, CFL, halogen , or otherwise, other than the light that goes out the window, all the energy it consumes get converted to heat ( most of it directly at the bulb, the rest is converted to heat when the light is absorbed by walls, etc. )

I read an article on that Canadian report, and as I understand it, they were not suggesting we heat our homes with light bulbs in the winter. Their study had found that household energy savings from using CFLs were frequently less than estimated. They suggested that this is because, during the heating season, virtually all the energy saved by switching to CFLs, has to be made up for running the furnace longer.
In a climate with long heating seasons, the economics of switching to CFLs is not as good.

Now what was the OP asking about anyways ??? ....... Oh yeah, why don't CFLs last as long in a bathroom ? I don't know.
Exactly....nice overview...just one correction....when the electrons flow across the filament...that is when and where all the energy gets converted to light OR heat. There is no "conversion" of anything "to heat when the light is absorbed by the walls". The energy that is converted to heat at the filament radiates through (ie. is transferred to) the air and if there is enough heat ...and objects are close enough...the heat is TRANSFERRED from the air to the objects.
piste is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2010, 11:32 PM   #34
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Fairbanks, AK
Posts: 1,847
Rewards Points: 1,000
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


A timer to keep a light on, should you wish, is about 1/4 of one cent, if you will manage it. It is manual. Turn the light on. Lay a strip of duct tape over it. Fingers slide right off, light is on. Simple. BTW: I have only tried a couple of CFLs, and the light they put off is dim and weird; yellowish. I am not tickled by them, but have only tried a few. I agree, LEDs are likely the way to go. I see more and more stop lights going to LEDs, and truck lights.... and flash lights... Hey! Do I see a pattern here? later. j
jklingel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2010, 09:20 AM   #35
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 199
Rewards Points: 150
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by jklingel View Post
A timer to keep a light on, should you wish, is about 1/4 of one cent, if you will manage it. It is manual. Turn the light on. Lay a strip of duct tape over it. Fingers slide right off, light is on. Simple. BTW: I have only tried a couple of CFLs, and the light they put off is dim and weird; yellowish. I am not tickled by them, but have only tried a few. I agree, LEDs are likely the way to go. I see more and more stop lights going to LEDs, and truck lights.... and flash lights... Hey! Do I see a pattern here? later. j
Could you clarify your "timer" recommendation again? How is putting a piece of duct tape over a switch that is turned on a "timer"?

Regarding CFL types....I've been checking that out myself....the ones I found at Home Depot come in either "daylight", "bright white" and "soft light". The daylight ones are really white light like regular fluorescents..the "soft light" are pretty close to incandescent..the bright white are somewhat in between...so there are some optiosn.
piste is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 08:11 AM   #36
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


I don't think the problem I have is humidity.
There are two fixtures, one seems to get cycled on/off more than the other, since most times only one fixture is required, and they are switched separately.

If the NVision bulbs aren't any good, can someone suggest a better one that is readily available? I like the convenience of picking up the bulbs at my local HD.

I still believe that cycling is a bad thing for these bulbs, because they contain electronics.
But perhaps I did get a bad pack. I think both of the ones that have burned out over the past 15 months were from the same one.

As for electrical noise, etc, I have a surge protector installed on the SE panel. That's the best I can do.

FW
__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 09:49 AM   #37
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South of Boston, MA
Posts: 17,248
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Almost all of my bulbs are NVision
I have over 100 that are part of my Christmas display

I buy the Bright Effects from Lowes as they have the highest K rating - 6500K
So its a much whiter light - better then the normal bulbs
I started this thread on CFL's a while ago & it has been added onto by other people

http://www.diychatroom.com/f98/cfl-b...r-light-53115/
Scuba_Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 03:53 PM   #38
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


According to NVision's web site, a typical bulb will last up to 10,000 hours. They don't say anything about cycling them or not cycling.

If I think of only the money I am spending to burn the lights, I am saving more if I cycle them as needed.
Burning four 14w (60W equivalent) bulbs in a fixture for 8 hrs / day will cost me $29 / year in electricity, compared to less than $1 per bulb if I have to replace them every year due to the excessive cycling.

In conclusion, I am going to stop worrying about this, and just let happen what will happen.
I always drop the bulbs at my Home Depot recycling bin, so I am doing as much as I can.

What would really save both electricity, and the environment is for Americans to change their habits on their use of electricity.

For example; why do most people turn on the light when they enter a room, even when there's enough daylight coming in to make that unnecessary?
For years, I have relied on natural lighting as much as possible. I enjoy the natural light of the sun, and doing something like working at my computer, I don't need all that much light, unless I am reading printed material at the same time (or trying to use a solar power calculator)

And while on that subject; Do solar powered calculators save anything?
How much battery does the typical calculator need? If you have to keep lights burning just so that you can use the calculator, what's the point?

I'm rambling again. Sorry

FW
__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 04:10 PM   #39
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,729
Rewards Points: 1,278
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


I seem to have similar luck with cfls burning out fast. I doubt it's humidity. I wonder if it's vibration or power anomalies.
jogr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 06:14 PM   #40
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South of Boston, MA
Posts: 17,248
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by KE2KB View Post
What would really save both electricity, and the environment is for Americans to change their habits on their use of electricity.

For example; why do most people turn on the light when they enter a room, even when there's enough daylight coming in to make that unnecessary?
For years, I have relied on natural lighting as much as possible. I enjoy the natural light of the sun, and doing something like working at my computer, FW
Broad daylight my wife will have 3 lights on in her room while on her PC
Drives me crazy

With CFL's I have added lights or jumped to the next highest CFL wattage
Basement light for the steps I added a 2nd light over the laundry -13w both
Because if the light for the steps goes out all the spare bulbs are down there

Main basement I added a 2nd light down near the oil tank
Before I had to turn on (2) T-8 fixtures that use 96w each
The new bulb is a 20w CFL

Bathroom over head uses (2) 13w CFL's
Vanity now has (3) 13w 6500k CFL's instead of (3) 40w reg
Hallway has a dual 9w CFL fixture, used to have (3) 60w bulbs
Scuba_Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2010, 11:37 PM   #41
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 600
Rewards Points: 512
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by KE2KB View Post
For example; why do most people turn on the light when they enter a room, even when there's enough daylight coming in to make that unnecessary?
No one I know does that.
Quote:
And while on that subject; Do solar powered calculators save anything?
How much battery does the typical calculator need? If you have to keep lights burning just so that you can use the calculator, what's the point?
You need light to see the display whether it runs on batteries or not.
operagost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2010, 10:41 AM   #42
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by operagost View Post
No one I know does that.

You need light to see the display whether it runs on batteries or not.
Of course, but I don't need nearly as much light to see the LCD display as is required to run the device.

I've gotten into the habit of using my computer as a calculator; when I'm sitting in front of it of course. I wouldn't turn on the computer just to perform calculations that a simple one would do.

FW
__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2010, 11:14 AM   #43
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lewiston, Maine
Posts: 15
Rewards Points: 10
Default

CFL's are a waste of money


Quote:
Originally Posted by piste View Post
Exactly....nice overview...just one correction....when the electrons flow across the filament...that is when and where all the energy gets converted to light OR heat. There is no "conversion" of anything "to heat when the light is absorbed by the walls". The energy that is converted to heat at the filament radiates through (ie. is transferred to) the air and if there is enough heat ...and objects are close enough...the heat is TRANSFERRED from the air to the objects.
Actually, your correction is wrong. The visible light is mostly reflected around the room, however, the darker the object is that it hits, the more of the visible light is absorbed. This absorbed light is converted into heat in the object raising the temperature of the object. I could go into the physics of this, but that would be beyond the scope of this thread wouldn't it?

Also, the filament acts as a resistor and heats up as the electricity passes through it. The "heat" released by the filament is in three forms: radiation, convection, and conduction.

Inside the bulb is typically argon and nitrogen (a vacuum is also used in some cases). A convection current forms inside the bulb and transfers some of the heat from the filament to the gas in the bulb and subsequently from the gas to the bulb itself. A second convection current forms to transfer heat from the bulb to the surrounding air.

The filament also radiates electromagnetic energy (infrared and visible spectrum light). The bulb absorbs some of the infrared radiation and heats up. The rest of the infrared radiation moves beyond the bulb and is absorbed by objects or the air in the room.

Some of the energy is transferred via conduction to the socket and some even through the gas in bulb although this is minimal.

Quote:
I read an article on that Canadian report, and as I understand it, they were not suggesting we heat our homes with light bulbs in the winter. Their study had found that household energy savings from using CFLs were frequently less than estimated. They suggested that this is because, during the heating season, virtually all the energy saved by switching to CFLs, has to be made up for running the furnace longer.
In a climate with long heating seasons, the economics of switching to CFLs is not as good.
The heat that was normally given off by incandescent bulbs and is now not given off by the CFLs would have to be made up with the primary heating system in the home, you are correct. However, as others have pointed out, electricity is typically, if not always, more expensive per BTU than other forms of heat (e.g. oil, natural gas, wood).

Cost aside, electricity is a more useful form of energy than other forms. There are many many better things to do with electricity than convert it to heat: use an electrical motor to convert it to useful work, run computers, televisions, refrigerators, radios, etc.

If all you need is low quality heat, then making it from a burnable fuel is the best way. Nearly all of the heat released when it is burned can be used to heat your house. Conversely, converting burnable fuels to electricity (where most of the electricity produced comes from) is less than 50% efficient with the waste energy being lost as low quality heat at the power plant. Taking that electricity that you just wasted all that heat making and then turning it back into low quality heat to heat your house is asinine.

So, the point is, save electricity where you can as it is a higher value energy and use the lower value fuels to heat with. Therefore, using CFLs is always a good choice over incandescent regardless of your climate and primary heating means.

Advertisement

ChemE is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to ChemE For This Useful Post:
Big Bob (05-18-2010)
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Exact waste factor on paper Justen Roofing/Siding 3 04-10-2010 05:54 PM
Y-socket adapters in the garage - safe with CFLs? TitaniumVT Electrical 5 02-02-2010 12:19 AM
Waste pipe routing query Jol Plumbing 0 01-28-2010 05:52 PM
Is it a waste of money to buy high quality brushes? bluefitness Painting 2 02-08-2009 06:19 PM
Finding waste pipes under a slab Eva Plumbing 15 01-02-2009 03:12 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts