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Old 01-11-2011, 09:16 AM   #1
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


I have decided to do vinyl siding on this shop I am about to build, and I'm not sure how to do it. I have a read a few tutorials online and some other things, but I can't find all the info I need. This will be a small light frame construction building, and 2x4's will be used for the frame.

(I think) in the past I have seen OSB used, and then it is covered in tar paper, and then finally with vinyl siding. Is this correct? If so, how thick does the OSB need to be? The studs will be on 16" centers.

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Old 01-11-2011, 09:31 AM   #2
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


Well I imagine being in Alabama you will want to air condition that shop....correct?

If so you will want to insulate,

I would use OSB followed by 2" XPS (you could just use the XPS no OSB) then siding on top of that. You will have to use long nails into the studs of course.

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Old 01-11-2011, 09:38 AM   #3
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Yes I am in Alabama, and no I do not wish to air condition. This will simply be more or less a storage shed or small garage. It just needs to look nice on the outside. I live in a neighborhood with a homeowners association, and their rules dictate that it be finished neatly and all that jazz.

I really wish I didn't have to resort to vinyl siding, but I don't really know of any other decent wall coverings that look good and are cheap. I will basically have to learn vinyl siding, and buy the tools for it as well in order to do it myself.

Hardi backer or Hardi planks have been mentioned, but I'm not so sure about those.
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Old 01-11-2011, 09:58 AM   #4
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


OK---no insulation

Studs then OSB then Tyvek Wrap or tar paper then siding
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Old 01-11-2011, 09:59 AM   #5
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


Is there a minimum thickness I need to go with on the OSB?
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Old 01-11-2011, 10:08 AM   #6
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


I wouldn't use anything less than 1/2"
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Old 01-11-2011, 12:14 PM   #7
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


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OK---no insulation

Studs then OSB then Tyvek Wrap or tar paper then siding

Agree with this, except I would recommend going with a zip system sheathing rather than standard OSB and then Tyvek. The water barrier is built into the sheathing, and all that is needed to seal is the tape along the seams. Siding goes right on top of the zip sheathing.

http://www.zipsystem.com/

If you have any step downs in your structure (i.e., it's not basically level across all four sides), then you'll need to make sure you get the starter strip started and leveled correctly. Otherwise, the step downs may not match up when you bring the siding together.
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Old 01-11-2011, 10:48 PM   #8
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


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Agree with this, except I would recommend going with a zip system sheathing rather than standard OSB and then Tyvek. The water barrier is built into the sheathing, and all that is needed to seal is the tape along the seams. Siding goes right on top of the zip sheathing.

http://www.zipsystem.com/

If you have any step downs in your structure (i.e., it's not basically level across all four sides), then you'll need to make sure you get the starter strip started and leveled correctly. Otherwise, the step downs may not match up when you bring the siding together.
I agree..If you can find a supplier. The new ZIP panels are great. They dont require the Tyvek house wraps cutting down on labor. Install the ZIP sheathing and seal the seams with tape, install the siding and you are done. I really think the ZIP sheathing system is just a tip of new sheathing systems to come over the next few years.

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Old 01-11-2011, 11:39 PM   #9
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


I would not use OSB as it holds the moisture a long time, easy to rot; http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...d%20in%20walls

Alabama has 56" annual rainfall, Seattle has36' and they don't use OSB; http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...JSz4eA&cad=rja
If you need more information on OSB, let me know....
I believe the zip system is a denser OSB, even harder/longer for water to leave and dry out....
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Last edited by Gary in WA; 01-11-2011 at 11:41 PM.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:56 AM   #10
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


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Originally Posted by J S Machine
I have decided to do vinyl siding on this shop I am about to build, and I'm not sure how to do it. I have a read a few tutorials online and some other things, but I can't find all the info I need. This will be a small light frame construction building, and 2x4's will be used for the frame.

(I think) in the past I have seen OSB used, and then it is covered in tar paper, and then finally with vinyl siding. Is this correct? If so, how thick does the OSB need to be? The studs will be on 16" centers.
I have done siding on and off for approximately 10 yrs you just want a nice looking finish and keep the cost down don't worry about all of these fancy systems they are not necessary 3/8 osb is fine and then a single layer of tyvek or typar which is basically homehardware brand tyvek or a double layer of 30 minute exterior siding tar paper, as long as there is no way for the water to get behind the siding the paper is just working as a vapor barrier between the wood and vinyl you don't have to worry about the osb holding water because it shouldnt be wet vinyl siding is super easy you shouldnt have a problem
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Old 01-12-2011, 06:47 AM   #11
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


7/16'' will meet minimum requirements for vinyl siding,i like to see a seperate wrb, 15lb felt is fine
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Old 01-12-2011, 06:57 AM   #12
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


7/16" OSB, #30 felt and side away.

Vinyl siding isn't as easy as many people believe. You need to follow specific spacing recommendations, nailing specifications and impliment proper flashing details for a quality installation.

My advice is to educate yourself first. It'll be a worthy investment.
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Old 01-12-2011, 07:38 AM   #13
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


Like I said, I like the idea of vinyl siding, I just hope I don't have to buy a bunch of tools to do it. There are other outer layer finishing techniques, but I feel like vinyl siding will be the most cost effective. I'm sure I can figure it out, I just want to do it myself. I don't want to pay anybody to do anything because then I won't have the satisfaction of learning it and doing it. This whole project has been a dream come true, actualy building something myself and having a sense of accomplishment. I'll admit I've been a bit overwhelmed at times, but having great advice and guidance made it easier to do, and I learned how it is done.

I know the worst part of the storm is just ahead, but I am confident I can do it. I'm trying to get a materials list up so that I can get the materials bought.

2 more questions.

I know I will probably use 15w felt on the roof. It will have a regular 3 tab shingle roof, which i still have to learn to do.

On the sides, under the vinyl, I think I will use 30w. Is there any real advantage to using 30w here?

Also, I see loneframer has used staples to attach the felt to his walls before siding. Is this acceptable? What about on the roof? is a staple gun good to attach the felt before shingles go down?
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Old 01-12-2011, 07:55 AM   #14
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Vinyl siding, what goes underneath?


A point here:

Quote:
as long as there is no way for the water to get behind the siding
If you're using vinyl siding, water will get behind it. Vinyl siding just acts as a protection barrier for the sheathing from driving rain, wind, sun, and full on exposure. If you're expecting the vinyl siding to fully stop water penetration, then you're starting off going in the wrong direction.

There's a reason that vinyl siding has weep holes at the bottom. It's because water will get back there, regardless of how well you put the siding up, and it needs to be brought away from the house, and also allowed air to dry out.

Quote:
Like I said, I like the idea of vinyl siding, I just hope I don't have to buy a bunch of tools to do it
I just did my entire house and the basic tools you will need include (other than the materials you need to buy for the siding... i.e., j and f channel, starter strips, siding, undersill trim, corner pieces... inside and out, if necessary):
- hammer
- nails (1.5" galvanized roofing nails)
- snips (Wiss MetalMaster Aviation Snips work for me)
- a diamond blade (for cutting the siding... or turn your normal blade so the teeth rotate backwards, otherwise you'll rip the siding)
- level (may need a 6', 3', and or a torpedo depending on what size sections you'll have as you work up)
- caulking (always good to have. As you work up, you may find that you pull out some pieces of siding and then replace. I'd recommend that, if you cannot use the same nail holes when replacing, caulking them up. I've seen this not done and water penetration into the interior as a result)
- Tar paper (I used this on the corners. While the zip board is completeyl sealed, I still prefer the extra protection)
- staple gun (used this to put up the tar paper)


Beyond that, you shouldn't need too much else (unless I'm completely forgetting something. In which case, I'm sure I'll be reminded. :-) )
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Old 01-12-2011, 07:58 AM   #15
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Quote:
I believe the zip system is a denser OSB, even harder/longer for water to leave and dry out....
The zip system actually has a water proof membrane on the exterior. Once installed, and taped, water just runs down in sheets and does not penetrate the zip board. I was extremely impressed with this material, as we had some extra pieces sitting out on the side of our house, that went through all sorts of nasty weather, and it stayed true with almost no warping, splitting, etc... I've seen OSB go to hell under much nicer conditions.

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