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vinyl Siding / Soffit Question

25K views 42 replies 9 participants last post by  Gary in WA 
#1 ·
I'm fixing to get started on the vinyl siding on my building I have built. I am buying my siding from a local distributor and one of the guys they have working there used to be an installer. I've never done this stuff, so I'm pretty much going to go forward with whatever advice or instructions I am given. I have the PDF file that has the instructions (about 40 pages long) so I have a pretty good idea of the basics. I've been doing some studying, but I'm still not educated enough or experienced to understand the soffit enclosing teqniques.

My total costs will be about $600 in siding and trim pieces. I don't have the money to do buy it all at the moment, so yesterday I went and got what I could get for about $150. I'll buy the rest in the next few weeks as I get the money saved up.

He told me that I need to go ahead and do my corners, soffits and starter strips, to get them out of the way. So I bought enough starter strip to complete that, four corner pieces, all the vented soffit I will need, and some of the J-channel. I have not bought any of the siding panels yet.

Myself and the guy that used to be the installer were discussing how I am going to do my soffits. You can see here in this picture what I have. There are 1' overhangs all the way around.

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After looking at some of the different methods, and talking about it with him, he said an easy way to do it was to put a 2x nailing strip up against the building outside wall, and nail my soffit piece to that. Here is an illustration of what I'm talking about. The normal way would be on the left I suppose, and the way he is telling me to do it would be the one I drew on the right:



The 2x nailing piece is the square yellow box. The siding itself is indicated in green.

My question is, When does the 2x piece need to be added? I was thinking about this, and for some reason I feel like the 2x nailing strip should be nailed on top of the last piece of siding, so as to cover the gap that would be left exposed if it were added after the strip was attached.

I can't figure out that little intersection. Even if I nail the 2x strip to the wall first and run the siding up to it, the soffit piece will also be cut and run up (along the bottom of the 2x) to that corner where it will meet the wall. I know that cut will not be perfect, so what covers that???

He said the reason he used to use a 2x strip like this is because it is way cheaper than f-channel or J-channel, and works just as good. I just can't figure out why he told me to do my soffit pieces first if this strip must nail on top of the siding.

I'm sorry this is so long, I'm just trying to be sure I put enough info out there so you folks can understand me.
 
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#6 ·
I'm going to refrain from answering some our questions, becasue I am sure that there are a number of people here with much more experience with vinyl siding that I have, but, regardless, I would definitely use the channel for the soffit, rather than blocking. Different types of materials expand and contract at varying rates, which is one of the reasons that you hear popping along soffits. One of the things that people often do with trim is to use to many nails, or drive them too tight; with the channel, cut the soffit an 1/8" or so short, so that it does not bind, slip it in place, and let it float.
 
#10 ·
I found this, it looks exactly like what I am talking about. Except he uses a piece of wide trim or something to butt up to the soffit at the top of the wall.

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/how-to/articles/installing-vinyl-siding.aspx

If you look at the pdf version, on the second page down it has a cutaway on a house and looks exactly like what I'm talking about. The is an orange circle with "wide casings relpace j-channel"

I'm not sure if this would be a good way to do it or not.
 
#13 ·
that's right he just used the fat trim instead of j channel. it is only for looks. you can use the 2x2 on the wall if you want but I don't see why.
snap a line on the wall level with your sub facia, 2x4 on the overhang, install f-trim on the line and the sub facia. fill with soffit. Trim all windows/doors/corners/ soffit, wait till payday, buy siding, install. sorry if I wasn't making much sense but I think we got there, Didn't we?
 
#15 ·
Yes I'm following you Craig, but I'm still unsure of what could be done. Not saying this guy is right, but he steered me away from j channel right there and f-channel for a reason. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the reason is.

I just thought of somehting else. I'm sitting here picturing myself cutting these pieces of soffit to fit exactly, like the place where it needs to butt up to the wall, and then nailing them. I forgot completely about the way the stuff contracts and expands, so that won't even work. There has got to be some sort of trim in that corner under the 2x nailing strip, whether it be j channel, f-channel, wide trim to cover the gap that will surely show up from time to time be contraction of the soffit piece..
 
#16 ·
I'm sorry if I confused you more or butted in.I'm new to this and was just trying to help.If you use 2x you don't need f,but you still would need j channel or undersill to terminate siding panel.If you use narrow j which is fine you'll need caulking to help secure the siding.Undersill is different in that you snap lock it in.In your link Mike G uses wide vinyl j casing,I have that as well but it is pricey.
 
#17 ·
You didn't butt in man. I need all the help I can get lol.

Maybe that is what he meant for me to do with the J-channel. The stuff comes in 12' lengths you know, and I have fourteen of them on my quote paper. I bought half of them yesterday, which was seven. I don't think it will take fourteen j-channel pieces to go around my windows, door, and roll up door..Maybe the rest should be used for the place we are talking about, right up in that corner at the bottom of the nailing strip.

I see now what you guys are talking about with the nailing strip not really being needed, but maybe it will keep the j channel more straight (assuming that is what I will use there).

What exactly is the author of that pdf getting at when he says that "j channel is the hallmark of most bad vinyl jobs"..
 
#18 ·
The j buts tight to the soffit after the soffit is nailed to the 2x or in f channel.As you lock in you last siding piece dab caulking in the bottom where it locks in to the previous piece.Hhmm!!Wouldn't you rather big pieces of wide J trim,mitered perfect and standing proud and not cheap looking??Nothing beats cedar tho.
 
#26 ·
A couple ideas for you:
The pic shows the L shaped metal Tom mentioned.
This can go up against your 2x framing on the eaves as well
as the gable ends under the soffit.
Then the J will butt to the bottom of your soffit to accept the last
piece of siding and help hold up the soffit.

We usually incorporate the J into our returns and direct any water
that may get into it into the corner J.
Depending on your helps abilities,the built in J will give a much
cleaner look and help eliminate a possible water infiltration point.

Since your returns will not line up with the corners,you can run a
J along the bottom of it,then return it towards the gable soffit J.
 

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#27 ·
That picture definitely clears some things up. What is the purpose of the "L metal?" I talked to the guy again at the distributor and he said exactly the same thing about how it gets mounted up under the nailing strip. I don't understand why in the world this piece goes there. Obviously there is no ledge for the soffit to sit on.
 
#28 · (Edited)
That picture definitely clears some things up. What is the purpose of the "L metal?"
It will keep you from seeing the felt paper in the soffit groves
after the J is installed under it.

quote=J S Machine;629589] Obviously there is no ledge for the soffit to sit on.[/quote]

The top of the J will butt to the bottom of the soffit, positioned to accept
the top of the last piece of siding.I guess you could call this your ledge.

Imagine that your J is the trim piece in this pic.
It basically serves the same purpose.
 

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#30 ·
Depending on how confident you are in using a brake,the rental cost,the aggravation of transporting it,the
possibility of wasting material,and a maybe a less than desirable result,I might be inclined to just hire out
this part of the job.
Didn't you say somewhere that you had help that use to install?
 
#42 ·
Depending on how confident you are in using a brake,the rental cost,the aggravation of transporting it,the
possibility of wasting material,and a maybe a less than desirable result,I might be inclined to just hire out
this part of the job.
Didn't you say somewhere that you had help that use to install?

you do the nicest brake work oldfrt:thumbup::notworthy:
 
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