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Old 10-22-2010, 01:06 PM   #1
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


This is my first post.

This isn't diy, but I didn't know where to go to ask this.

My house was built in 1960 and currently has wood shake siding. It also has the original wood windows.

On a new vinyl siding install, is it best to install OVER the existing siding and let them fur it out for evenness? Or if it's only going to cost $200 extra, have the old siding ripped off then install the new?

I have worries about both. The existing is a tiny bit warped in places and don't know if this will affect the outcome of the new install.

Other worry is tearing off may cause more harm in the long run with seals around the windows, etc.

Thoughts?

Oh, and no, we're not getting new windows at this time due to $.

Thanks!

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Old 10-22-2010, 01:43 PM   #2
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


To be honest you are better off always riping off the old siding. Whatever you see on the house now will telegraph through and you will see it in the new siding at some point.

If its $200 to rip it off then do it.

As for not replacing the windows at the same time, I disagree with this. This is the kind of thing you really should do at the same time IMO but then again I would be the one doing the work and saving money so I can understand your predicament.

Good luck.

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Old 10-22-2010, 01:43 PM   #3
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


I’d tear it off. That way if there are any issues behind the siding such a rotted sheathing or termite damage it can be taken care of, you don’t want to just burry it.

If the new siding is installed properly there should be no issues.
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Old 10-22-2010, 05:40 PM   #4
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Agreed, tear it off, you will be happier later on. I bought a little 1945 cottage house with vinyl siding and ended up adding on about 1000 sq ft to it and doing stucco. When I did that, I had to go back and rip all the vinyl siding off along with everything that was covered up by it, which was: green foam board, cement/asbestos shingles AND the original siding under that which was some kind of weird simulated cardboard brick crap. So there was 4 layers of siding. It was a nightmare mess from hell.

Rip all the old stuff off and start clean, that's the right way to do things.

I personally would never choose vinyl siding, but if you aren't planning on ever redoing it again after you apply the vinyl, I guess it wouldn't matter. In my case I did stucco and re-sheared the house so all the layers had to be torn off. The only postitive to just covering it would be a little extra insulation.

Last edited by tuffloud1; 10-22-2010 at 05:45 PM.
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Old 10-23-2010, 09:24 AM   #5
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


I agree with the others - tear off the shakes. Great opportunity to see what's underneath and to repair if necessary. You really don't want to cover up potential rot/problems.
Also, it may be appropriate (although may not be in the budget) to do some house wrap and insulation (make the place weather tight). This may depend more on where you live as well.
Just my 2 cents.

Good luck with the project -- whatever you decide.
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Old 10-23-2010, 03:18 PM   #6
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Not only should you tear the old shakes off, but why not do it yourself and save $200.00.!
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Old 10-23-2010, 08:52 PM   #7
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


If you have shingles on the whole house, it is worth way more than $200. I would think that wouldn't even pay for gas and dump fees. How many square feet of wall are we talking about? Is there skip sheathing under the shingles/shakes? Any plywood for shear on the walls? What is the exposure? Three layers? You could be talking some serious labor here! 1960 wall insulation was around R-9, does your location warrant more for today's minimum? Enter you first three of zip, type house, heat: http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...on/ins_16.html

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Old 10-23-2010, 09:33 PM   #8
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


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Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
If you have shingles on the whole house, it is worth way more than $200. I would think that wouldn't even pay for gas and dump fees. How many square feet of wall are we talking about? Is there skip sheathing under the shingles/shakes? Any plywood for shear on the walls? What is the exposure? Three layers? You could be talking some serious labor here! 1960 wall insulation was around R-9, does your location warrant more for today's minimum? Enter you first three of zip, type house, heat: http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...on/ins_16.html

Gary
Thanks everyone!

3 sides of house. Front is brick. About 1300 sq ft section of tear off. I just hope I'm not opening a can of worm$ by tearing the stuff off. What we have now is in pretty bad shape and not worth the money to repaint. Here's the info from that site. I don't know what it means though.

Insulation Location R-Value* Notes
Attic 49 -

Wood frame wall cavity 13 Blow insulation into any uninsulated exterior wall cavity.

Floor 30 Over unheated, uninsulated space.

Crawl space wall 25 Crawl space walls are only insulated if the crawl space is unvented and the floor above the crawl space is uninsulated.

Basement wall interior 11 -

Insulative sheathing on empty wall 5 Recommendation assumes that the exterior siding was removed for other purpose, i.e., does not include any consideration of the cost of removing and replacing the exterior siding.

Add insulative sheathing to R11 wall 5
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Old 10-23-2010, 09:34 PM   #9
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Oh and I have no idea what's between the inside drywall and the outside wood shake siding???
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Old 10-23-2010, 11:30 PM   #10
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Ok, after doing some more research online I don't have a good feeling about this as my quote doesn't include any type of wrap. Just a 3/8" foil backed? lined? backer material.
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Old 10-23-2010, 11:42 PM   #11
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Usually you need 7/16osb and a house wrap under vinyl siding. You may want to check a small area and see what is behind the shakes and if it is still good. If you have to re-sheet the whole house it could be pretty expensive.
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Old 10-24-2010, 09:46 AM   #12
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


you can absolutely successfully overlay most existing siding with vinyl
you just need an installer that understands water and moisture management
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Old 10-24-2010, 09:57 AM   #13
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Poked a small hole in the interior wall. There's a thin paper/pink insulation up against the back.

Went outside to see what was behind the wood shake panels. There's what looks like black felt paper and plywood behind that. This was looking up from the bottom so hopefully it has plywood all over.

Spoke to another neighbor who used the same company and they put his on over the existing siding and it looks great. He said they did Tyvek over the old then put up the siding.
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Old 10-24-2010, 10:08 AM   #14
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


Quote:
Originally Posted by tomstruble View Post
you just need an installer that understands water and moisture management
when I tore off my aluminum siding (70s?) and got to the original shake (50s?) the ants/bugs had been living the dream under there... they pretty much ate all the way to the insulation! however... water infiltration was the catalyst. no water=no bugs.

in 2007. I tore everything off, resheathed with osb ($6/sheet?). replaced all windows (jeldwen $100/each?), and sided.

sounds like you plan to do windows someday, do the siding/windows together. it will look a lot better that way, and will probably be safer from the elements than replacements if done correctly.
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Old 10-24-2010, 11:57 AM   #15
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Vinyl siding over old wood shake??


vinyl siding in itself will not cure moisture problems,that being said it is one of the most free draining and ventilated sidings out there,rarely are there water issues under properly installed vinyl,reservoir claddings like wood fiber cement and stucco [synthetic or otherwise] can be way more problematic

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