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Old 02-21-2009, 01:21 AM   #1
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


I have a living room ceiling that's about 25' x 32'. I'm using 3/8" 4' x 12' sheetrock drywall to patch it back up. The wall already have 1/2" sheetrock on them.

So I've pretty much started laying the 4' side of the sheetrock along the 25' length,
In the middle area of the room, I will not be able to tuck the sheet rock above the wall sheetrock because it's in the middle of the room.

Will there be some sort of special way I need to fasten these to the ceiling beams? Or do I just go about using the drywall screws, the same as the rest of the other areas...

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Old 02-21-2009, 06:06 AM   #2
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


I wouldnt use 3/8 on a ceiling. 3/8 is for going over existing walls or ceilings.

1 1/4 screws will work but return what you bought and get some 1/2"

Personally, me and my crew always use 5/8 on a ceiling

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Old 02-21-2009, 07:50 AM   #3
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Ditto on the 3/8". Don't do it. You will regret it in a few months as the ceiling begins to sag... and it WILL.

Cut off a clean, straight and level ripping strip from the tops of the wall board so you can slide the ceiling piece over it. You NEED that ceiling piece edge to be supported by the wall board. And you will get a better job if you do it this way. Resist the temptation to screw within a foot (even as much as 16 or 18 inches) of the edges. Let the nice, level tops of the wall board support that flopping ceiling edge. Your top edge angle will have much less tendency to crack this way.
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Old 02-21-2009, 12:36 PM   #4
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Triple ditto on the 3/8". If you already bought it take it back. You need at least 1/2" on the ceiling and most people opt for 5/8".
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Old 02-22-2009, 02:35 PM   #5
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Oh yeah sorry about that...I actually meant to say the ceiling sheetrock thickness was 5/8" not 3/8". Thanks for catching it! The advice from everyone for catching my typo is what makes this forum so fantastic!!! Thanks for triple ditto'ing it!

So I know everyone, as a rule of thumb insists on letting the sheetrock be tucked on top of the wall sheetrock on along the edges, but what about in the middle part of the room where the 4' x 12' sheetrock cannot be tucked into the wall edges?
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Old 02-22-2009, 02:59 PM   #6
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


dont worry about tucking them into the wall edges. its not needed. theres nothing structural about sheetrock. just get them as close as possible for an easier mud job
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Old 02-22-2009, 04:04 PM   #7
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Below is an older post explaining the reason you want to let the wall board carry the ceiling board edge. It is now too late for you to use clips like this, but you can still "tuck" that ceiling piece in so that you will get a good, straight edge up there. Just nailing it up tight against the wall on every truss or joist is almost guaranteed to give you a wavy edge. This is more important along the edges rather than out in the middle somewhere because it is mainly along the edges that the unevenness of the trusses or joists will show up to a person's eye.
**********************************************
Here’s a small drywall hanger’s trick: (Yes, it will work for tall or fat drywallers too. )

Ever notice how some ceiling edges seem to undulate up and down for the length of a wall? This is obviously because the joists or trusses where the drywall is nailed along the edges aren’t level, one with another. Some sit high. Some sit low. So the D/W goes up and down.

Now, quality professionals fir down the whole ceiling with 1 x 3’s installed perpendicular to the joists or trusses. And they shim the whole ceiling level with thin strings called “jet line”. It’s very lightweight, and looks like dental floss. It can be pulled extremely tight so that it is almost perfectly level. This process results in two positive things.

One, it gives you a perfectly flat, level ceiling everywhere. And, two, it helps eliminate the ceiling cracks that eventually develop when temperature or settling cause trusses or joists to move and shift a little. But this process also adds somewhere about 1,500 to 2,000 dollars to the cost of the home. Is there a way around this for us poorer folk?

Yes. At least in part. Providing your building department will allow it (some won’t), you do have a way to make your edges more straight and level than they might otherwise be. We can’t really help the truss or joist movement, but we can help the edge problem.

It is based upon leaving the last 10”, or so, un-nailed along the edges of the ceiling. Now wait... we’re not done.

There are 90 degree clips made just for this purpose. They fit over the backside of the ceiling sheet for an inch or so, and have a parallel lip that fits just under the bottom side of the ceiling sheet to hold it in place on the edge of the sheet... much like plywood clips fit over the edge of a sheet of plywood. But, in addition, there is a 90 degree leg or strap that hangs down the wall in front of each stud.

So, fully installed (it’s much easier than it sounds) you have all these little clips hanging down in front of all the studs, and the 10 or 12 inch edge of the ceiling drywall. The whole edge sags just a little bit.

But... as you install each top sheet snuggly against the ceiling, you lift the ceiling that ¼ to ½ inch so it’s level and straight. It really looks good. Then you simply make sure to get a screw through each clip (They are there behind the wall sheet, waiting to be screwed through, right at the top of each stud.)

Of course, today being the day of the cheapest route possible, most dry wall hangers don’t even know about this method or these clips. And if they DO try to level that edge by leaving that last 10 to 12 inches un-nailed, (some of them have learned this trick) they unfortunately depend upon only the tape and mud to hold the top edge in place. Honestly, that will usually be enough. But it’s not good practice, nor professional.
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:17 PM   #8
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


so these clips are not meant for the middle of the room ceiling right? does the local home depot usually carry these?
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:28 PM   #9
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Quote:
Originally Posted by II Weeks View Post
1/4 screws will work but return what you bought and get some 1/2"
from one and a quarter inch to 1/2 inch screws? hehehe
yeah, we're always catching SOMEone here making a boo-boo.... even me sometimes!.....

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Old 02-22-2009, 11:15 PM   #10
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


No, they are are meant to be in the middle of the room, they are for the meant to be used along the ceiling and walls where sheetrock backing does not exist. Nothing is used in the middle of the rooms where the tapered and butt edges join one another. Just make sure your screwing into joists securely, especially the butt joints. BTW, old school rockers used to mud the tapered edges on the under side using scrap drywall affixed to both pieces.
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Old 02-23-2009, 05:59 AM   #11
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Quote:
1 1/4 screws will work but return what you bought and get some 1/2"
the full quote has it at an one and a quarter (1 1/4)
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Old 02-23-2009, 06:39 AM   #12
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


sorry weeks.... it read as if you went from 1 1/4" to 1/2" screws. that ain't so bad.... look at some of MY screwups! lol

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Old 02-23-2009, 09:13 AM   #13
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


Here's a trick someone else came up with, not me... I have not used it yet, but I intend to give it a try. It sounds very feasible.

Join your ceiling sheet butt ends in the dead space between trusses or joists, not on the trusses. (This is if you are NOT using striping.)

And you join the two butt ends by spanning the backside with a 5' piece of metal stud... NOT 4', but 5' !! This is important because the 6" hanging over each side will get screwed to the next row of sheets.

What this does is this:
We all know not having any taper at the ends of a sheet is a drag to tape. Metal studs are manufactured with raised ridges or ribs running the length of each edge. This ridge will let your screws actually "bend" both butt ends slightly upward toward the center of the metal stud, creating a bit of a taper all along the ends of both sheets. This gives you a slightly recessed end on your sheets, a little like the factory tapered edges.

All I can see here that might be added is that you may possibly have to play around with the positioning of your screws a little... or put extra screws in. I'll let you know when I give this a try.

And the 6" hanging over each side? Throw two screw in the tapered part of the adjoining sheet run, and you will have additional support, and never have a joint anywhere that isn't tapered for mud.

This also has the added advantage of not forcing you to have to get a double row of screws into both ends or your boards on one skinny truss or joist.
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Old 02-23-2009, 01:15 PM   #14
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Sheetrocking the Ceiling


The clips were developed and used for builders who want to go cheap and not use "deadwood" or frame proper corners to fasten the drywall. They are a pain to deal with and junk IMO. I had a half a box sitting in my basement for years that were leftover from a builder who had us use them. Finally threw them out. Just nail or screw the edges as you do the rest. If you CAN, get the ceiling sheet in behind the wall, but not necessary. You CAN try breaking your butt joints between the joists with the metal studs. If you do, cut them long as explained above. I've heard of the method and you can actually buy wood backing strips for that (called Butt Backer I believe) at a drywall supply. Never used them personally, just break on a joist. And definitely 1/2" on 16" centers, 5/8" in 24".
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Old 02-23-2009, 01:40 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjbatlanta View Post
The clips were developed and used for builders who want to go cheap and not use "deadwood" or frame proper corners to fasten the drywall. They are a pain to deal with and junk IMO. I had a half a box sitting in my basement for years that were leftover from a builder who had us use them. Finally threw them out. Just nail or screw the edges as you do the rest. If you CAN, get the ceiling sheet in behind the wall, but not necessary. You CAN try breaking your butt joints between the joists with the metal studs. If you do, cut them long as explained above. I've heard of the method and you can actually buy wood backing strips for that (called Butt Backer I believe) at a drywall supply. Never used them personally, just break on a joist. And definitely 1/2" on 16" centers, 5/8" in 24".
Actually, around here, it is just the opposite. The cheap guys wouldn't touch these clips. (mainly because they don't know how ) And the really good builders don't have to because they almost all strip (fir) their ceilings.

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