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Old 01-15-2010, 07:41 AM   #16
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Rim Joist Insulation


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Who said there was K+T wiring there, and in which picture do you all see it?

I don't...
They are looking at the old (very old) style round romex. These are not knob and Tube.. but what can you do?

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Old 01-15-2010, 07:50 AM   #17
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Rim Joist Insulation


Last picture appears to be K&T, but without another picture of the wires somewhere else running, it is hard to tell. Yes, it appears to be Romex, but need a second picture to tell.
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Old 01-15-2010, 08:29 AM   #18
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Rim Joist Insulation


On second look that may not be k&t. Especially that its touching the wood. K&T has insulators every so often that keep it from touching anything. Usually, not always tho. Given the year of house. Its still possible that K&T is there somewhere so my previous post still stand.
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Old 01-15-2010, 08:36 AM   #19
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Rim Joist Insulation


My MIL's house has knob & tube & romex
There aren't any insulators where it goes thru the floor in the basement up into the walls

The house in this thread was built in the 20's
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Old 01-15-2010, 09:41 AM   #20
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Rim Joist Insulation


yea I know. Im an accessor for the weatherization program so ive been in alot of old attics. About half of K&T that I see have insulators 2-3' apart and at the corners where it comes up through the open wall seals and plates. Dont really know if it supposed to be that way and the rest are just hack jobs or if touching wood was ok and the others where done by and obsesive electriction. Anyway I apoligize to the O.P. cuz we sure have gotten way of track from his questions.
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Old 01-15-2010, 09:44 AM   #21
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Rim Joist Insulation


no insulates were required when going through studs. These were used to support runs along the studs.
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Old 01-15-2010, 10:05 AM   #22
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yes old wiring, old romex, no ground, those two wires are coming from pole outside to fuses. Yes needs to updated. Back to the insulation question. How beneficial would it be to place foam board in the face of the cavity, leave the cavity empty. just 2 inch foam, with foam or caulk aorund the seams to make it seal better.
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Old 01-15-2010, 10:28 AM   #23
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This will be beneficial. Be sure to seal it well. Stopping air flow is you main concern.
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Old 01-15-2010, 10:44 AM   #24
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Knob-and-tubes.jpg

"in the face of the cavity," The rim and the bottom, one without the other would give you 1/2. Unless you mean between joists, that would do nothing for the floor above.

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Old 01-15-2010, 10:49 AM   #25
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Rim Joist Insulation


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yes old wiring, old romex, no ground, those two wires are coming from pole outside to fuses. Yes needs to updated. Back to the insulation question. How beneficial would it be to place foam board in the face of the cavity, leave the cavity empty. just 2 inch foam, with foam or caulk aorund the seams to make it seal better.
It's highly unlikely that you have both K+T and Romex wiring, it's usually one or the other, and by the looks of it, wth your confirmation, you have Romex. It just doesn't correspond to the K+T I have seen...I'm not an electrician tho'.

Your insulation approach is fine*. Caulk all four sides of the face board facing you, cut pieces of 2" styrofoam XPS to the right size i.e approx 16" wide by 9" high, for each bay), wedge that in there tight against the face, then caulk the gaps you might have made with the can spray foam.

That takes care of the insulation + air drafts; but in theory you still need a vapour barrier on the inside...Or, do the same thing with 1" polyisocyanurate board with the aluminium vapour barrier facing inside. That takes care of all three elements. Again, theoretically you still have a thermal transfer through the wood but that's relatively small. Once you've insulated and stopped the air drafts, you've accounted for most of the heat loss.

* Now while you're there, you might just as well stuff in some fibreglass batts in there, no? The fact that you are doing something is far more important than the exact method you use -you know what they say about inertia...go thumbs up for tackling a bit problem in your house.
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Old 01-15-2010, 10:51 AM   #26
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Rim Joist Insulation


no its not knob and tube, just old romex.

yes between the joist. it would do nothing for the floor above but it would stop the draft coming into the basement. should i just build a box with the foam board inside the cavity between the floor joist? If i just put some on the underside of the above floor and then face the cavity will that help the floor? Do i need foam with the foil on it or the plain pink stuff.
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:11 AM   #27
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use spray foam and resolve all issues at the same time and with much less effort. buy the DIY kits for about 600 sq ft area.
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:26 AM   #28
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place foam on top of cavity and then face it close??
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Old 01-15-2010, 01:18 PM   #29
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place foam on top of cavity and then face it close??
Wouldn't you want to do all sides of the cavity and the back and bottom to just to make sure there are no gaps or holes in it? That's what I always seen done with spray foam...
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Old 01-15-2010, 01:45 PM   #30
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No, no...IF you go with spray-foam - either professionally applied or the DIY kits - then you spray the top and bottom of that box and the back, in each bay. But it's tricky doing that but easier than crawling in there on all fours...expensive too. And you may just fill in the whole thing.

That's the best, from a contractors point-of-view and from the technical point-of-view. But IF you go the polystyrene route, I suggested you cut a piece the size of the back part, caulk and seal with canned spray-foam ie cover the part that faces outside. Then fill the rest with fibreglass to cover the pink portion you showed us.

The professionnally-applied foam is the best as it deals with the insulation, the vapour barrier and the air infiltration aspects of the job in one shot. But it's tricky in closed-in areas like that. Now what we suggested may not be doable either because you can't reach that far, but it'll be cheaper than foam.

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