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Mallard1123 02-27-2013 10:10 AM

removing wall?
i want to remove two walls that run along stairs north to south that divide my kitchen and dining room(wall 1 and 2). i will take the stairs and run them west to east at northwest corner of dining room then close in the hole and make kitchen and dining room one big room with an island in the middle for base cabinets and stove. my attic has rafters that are 2x6 that run east west and run all the way with no break. if i take out the walls should i support the ceiling joists in the attic to the rafters and if so how?

brockmiera 02-27-2013 10:15 AM

How far is the span from west to east exterior wall to exterior wall? Do you have ceiling rafters or is it a truss? Can you take a picture of your framing from the attic?

Mallard1123 02-27-2013 10:26 AM

its about 22-23 feet wide east to west sorry about it being sideways i changed it three times with no luck

framer52 02-27-2013 10:41 AM

if i take out the walls should i support the ceiling joists in the attic to the rafters and if so how?

No as a rule.

Are the ceiling joists one continuous board?

brockmiera 02-27-2013 10:41 AM

The pictures seems oriented correctly to me. Are you absolutely sure that you have a 2x6's spanning the entire width??? That is severely undersized. You are in SE Michigan? Detroit area? Snow load is 20-25 psf live?

Mallard1123 02-27-2013 10:48 AM

yes the joists are one continuous 2x6. Yes im north of Detroit about an hour.

kaschmid3 02-27-2013 11:41 AM

If I'm not mistaken u mean ceiling joists for attic r 2x6 the roof rafters look like 2x8

kaschmid3 02-27-2013 11:46 AM

Wether it is exposed or not I would put a beam of at least double 2x 8 header going north south onto load bearing points half way over exterior wall and hall wall but it all depends on your framing load points from below

Mallard1123 02-27-2013 11:58 AM

they are both 2x6's. I would really like to not have to put a beam in if i dont have to. i can't attach to rafters?

kaschmid3 02-27-2013 12:10 PM

R these real stairs or attic stairs

CVID 02-27-2013 12:12 PM

removing wall?
With the joist only being 2x6's, I would say that they are likely load bearing. Are there 2 walls (or beams) in the basement directly under the 2 walls you want to remove? If so, that is more evidence they are load bearing as they will be carring the weight down to the footings.

brockmiera 02-27-2013 01:30 PM

Im betting wall 2 is load bearing since it looks as though it would be a common longitudinal wall.

GBrackins 02-27-2013 04:07 PM

a lot of answers depends on what your building code is. the information I'm listing is based upon the 2009 International Residential Code (your code may vary, and needs to be verified by the building department).

if you have fixed stairs to the attic then attic joists must be able to support 30 pounds per square foot live load plus the weight of building materials (typically around 5-10 psf). These shall be treated as floor joists. if accessed by scuttle or pull down stairs then 20 psf, if no storage storage (areas you won't be walking around) then 10 psf. You can view the ceiling joist span tables from this code here

I agree with Brock, wall #2 appears to be load bearing since a 2x6 ceiling joist cannot span 22' to 23'. I'd expect the joist to be able to span around 12' to 13' (depending on species and grade of 2x6) based upon a live load of 20 psf. Also because of the location of wall #2 in regards to the basement stairs. Is there a beam in the basement under wall #2? Is there a beam under wall #1?

if you remove a load bearing wall without proper support of the attic/ceiling joists then you could experience excessive deflection of the joist which could cause cracking of the drywall/plaster ceiling and potential damage to the joists themselves (depending on actual loads).

Post back with answers to the questions and I'm sure you'll get responses.

Good luck!

Mallard1123 02-27-2013 10:16 PM


Originally Posted by kaschmid3 (Post 1126098)
R these real stairs or attic stairs

Not sure what your asking? I have real stairs to basement that i want to move.

Mallard1123 02-27-2013 10:19 PM

Wall 2 does have a beam under it in the basement.

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