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Old 08-29-2008, 10:59 PM   #1
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Remove Joist Bridge??


Hi there,

1960's cape cod... I am trying to install a ceiling fan in my family room. Above the family room is an attic. After finding the center of the room, I tapped a nail up into the ceiling (drywall), then headed up to the attic and removed the section of flooring, to find that nail. Low and behold, the nail is coming up right below the wood criss-cross joist bridging. If I could remove one of the two cross supports I could install my fan support... but it seems this might be a bad idea? Can I add a replacement and then once in place, remove the one I need gone? (If so, how do I nail in the bottom side - as there is obviously drywall up against it...??)

A friend of mine is telling me to just remove the one piece, as the other half of the criss cross is still there, and the supports on either side of the affected joists are in place too so no worries... but I don't have enough faith in him I guess!!

Any thoughts greatly appreciated, Thank you...

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Old 08-29-2008, 11:31 PM   #2
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Remove Joist Bridge??


It would be best to replace the bridging that you remove. There's a chance that you'd never notice a difference at all but why risk it?

The good news is that you don't have to use cross bridging. What I'd suggest is cutting a section of scrap 2x lumber the same depth as the ceiling joists, and bridge the space between the joists with that. It might be 2x6, 2x8, 2x10, or 2x12. You can use screws in a toenail configuration at each end of the block into both ceiling joists.

It will work just as well.

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Old 08-30-2008, 12:06 AM   #3
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Ok great that sounds like the way to go - except can you describe what you mean by "toenail configuration"? My first thought would have been to nail it in (angled through bridge into joist on each corner) but if my dense brain can grasp what you mean I would rather do it as recommended... ;-) Thanks again

Last edited by busy1; 08-30-2008 at 12:08 AM. Reason: add
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Old 08-30-2008, 08:04 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekctermite View Post
It would be best to replace the bridging that you remove. There's a chance that you'd never notice a difference at all but why risk it?

The good news is that you don't have to use cross bridging. What I'd suggest is cutting a section of scrap 2x lumber the same depth as the ceiling joists, and bridge the space between the joists with that. It might be 2x6, 2x8, 2x10, or 2x12. You can use screws in a toenail configuration at each end of the block into both ceiling joists.

It will work just as well.
Here is a suggestion that will work with KC's advice. remove the one section and cut the block 1-1/2" smaller in width. this way you can screw your octagon box to the bottom of the blocking and have the Oct. box flush with the ceiling. this way your not destroying the structural integrity of the bridging. just another idea. use some 3" deck screws and screw from the face of the ceiling beam and then from the block at an angle into the joist (toe nail) good luck BOB
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Old 08-30-2008, 11:04 AM   #5
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Remove Joist Bridge??


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Originally Posted by busy1 View Post
Ok great that sounds like the way to go - except can you describe what you mean by "toenail configuration"?
Once you've cut the block to length and have it held in the position it goes in (perpindicular to the joists between the joists), 3" or 3-1/2" deck screws at a 45 degree angle about an 1-1/2" from the edge of the block, penetrating the ceiling joists.

Here's an amateurish drawing (looking from the attic down onto the edges of the joists and block)...
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Remove Joist Bridge??-toenail.jpg  
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Old 08-30-2008, 06:31 PM   #6
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Remove Joist Bridge??


With all due respect to the learned posters:

good lord...1960's house ...add a fan box, remove one of a 1 by cross braces on a ceiling joist....that has attic deck in place

OP
do..it.. buy your bud a bottle of wine...and apologize for not having faith in him.

Drop cloth on floor ladder on drop cloth ( cut hole in ceiling..be sure to cheat and be away from ceiling joist.. you could cheat and get away from cross brace also, but you can remove cross brace without a problem unless you booger the ceiling taking it out)..( your in place properly nailed attic decking neatly replaces the purpose and function of the mid-span cross brace.)

besides that: you now add the 2x4 joist to joist to support your fan box.
(screw everything you can..less trauma on everything than a hammer and nails.) I feel you know what to do from there..

If you need more info please ask.

and/or add blocking, lateral bracing, hire an engr., have the ceiling tested for lead paint and asbestos... get a permit, hire a contractor... who will hire an electrical sub-contractor... you risk ceiling damage the more you or anybody fools with it..

enjoy your project and rejoice with pride that you DIY.
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Old 08-31-2008, 10:58 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by thekctermite View Post
It would be best to replace the bridging that you remove. There's a chance that you'd never notice a difference at all but why risk it?
I'll re-state my original post.
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Old 09-01-2008, 09:17 PM   #8
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Hey thanks everyone...

Just fyi, since there really isn't an 'attached' flooring up there (it's large sheets of plywood layed over) I went ahead and added the block support with the angled screws per the diagram, and attached my box to it as suggested, and everything worked out great. My friend came over this morning and helped run wiring to it, and the fan is now up and running! Thanks to all that replied, everyone had great information, and I didn't get my friend wine, but I did provide him with about 7 beers - AFTER we did the wiring, of course! ;-)

Thanks again...
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Old 09-01-2008, 09:20 PM   #9
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glade it all worked out for you.good luck BOB . hiccup! hiccup! excuse me!
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Old 09-01-2008, 09:56 PM   #10
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Bartender, cut BuletBob off!

Busy1, thanks for posting a followup. Glad to hear everything worked out for you. It may have been a little extra work to add that block, but you get some peace of mind knowing that the joist won't ever warp or twist under the ceiling's load.

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