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Old 02-16-2010, 06:16 PM   #31
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


the wood you have left from my understanding at the bearing point is considered the strength of the member, otherwise he could set on top of the wall, cut the rake of the roof leaving around 5" of vertical wood on the plate and still call it a 2x10. imo i have never heard it to work like that, you stll have to have the full size of the member on bearing.

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Old 02-16-2010, 10:28 PM   #32
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Ok team, there has been a bump in the road. After a previous post that questioned whether or not my joists were 2x10s, which I just assumed they were, I decided to measure them when I got home from work. It turns out that they are 2x71/8". This is a very odd dimension, which I've never seen before. There are also only 4 of them.

I also discovered that toward the middle of the roof, there are 3 2x4s connected to the rafters and the other ends connected to the joists (see attached pic). I'm assuming these are helping support the joists toward the middle of the garage.

So with this being said should I:

1. Remove the 4 joists and replace them with 2x10s and add additional 2x10s where they are currently not and should be? And, leave the current "rafter-to-joist" 2x4s as is.

OR

2. Notch the current joists and try to find more 2x71/8" joists, notch them and hang?
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Old 02-16-2010, 10:40 PM   #33
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Still need this info:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
You need to measure the distance between the wall studs from the inner edges
That will tell us your span distance
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Old 02-16-2010, 10:51 PM   #34
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
Still need this info:

Thanks for responding so quickly scuba. The distance is 22.5".
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Old 02-16-2010, 11:00 PM   #35
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Look at figure #6 here, a page or two more: http://books.google.com/books?id=iwS...joists&f=false

Cut the rake or slope on the top edge, with the bottom outside edge of the angle not below of the joist thickness. Notch across level for the top plate width (3-3/4” or ?), then cut straight down along the inside of the wall vertically to the bottom of the joist. Install a hanger on it shimming the hanger for full support off the wall’s top plate. Bolt or strap the rafter to the joist (tie) using 1-1/2” nails so as not to split the rafter. The 2x8’s would not carry loads spanning 20’. You could replace them with 2x10’s, Doug/fir with fb of 1250 will carry 750# each. OR, sister a 20’ D/f - 2x8 for 912#.(Square cut the ends since the other one ties to the rafter or just strap it).

Use a Simpson hanger on the doubled joist, after figuring how much meat is below the notch: http://www.strongtie.com/products/co...rs/LUS-HUS.asp

Use some straps: LST 16: http://www.strongtie.com/products/co...TS-MTS-HTS.asp

Be safe, Gary
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Old 02-16-2010, 11:01 PM   #36
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Ouch.....22.5'

Just light storage above?
You basically have 2x8's right now
A #2 2x10 hem fir 16" OC 30/10 psf L360 will span 18' as a FLOOR joist
This means something that will be walked on & hold furniture...like a bedroom
L180/L240 (more flex) only gains you 6" more

L360 20/10 psf gets you to 20' 8"
L180/240 gets you to 21' 3"

Basically a 2x12 will span it without any real problem
A 2x10 will span it but may sag over time with heavy storage

I would install the new ones before removing the old ones
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Old 02-16-2010, 11:27 PM   #37
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
Look at figure #6 here, a page or two more: http://books.google.com/books?id=iwS...joists&f=false

Cut the rake or slope on the top edge, with the bottom outside edge of the angle not below of the joist thickness. Notch across level for the top plate width (3-3/4 or ?), then cut straight down along the inside of the wall vertically to the bottom of the joist. Install a hanger on it shimming the hanger for full support off the walls top plate. Bolt or strap the rafter to the joist (tie) using 1-1/2 nails so as not to split the rafter. The 2x8s would not carry loads spanning 20. You could replace them with 2x10s, Doug/fir with fb of 1250 will carry 750# each. OR, sister a 20 D/f - 2x8 for 912#.(Square cut the ends since the other one ties to the rafter or just strap it).

Use a Simpson hanger on the doubled joist, after figuring how much meat is below the notch: http://www.strongtie.com/products/co...rs/LUS-HUS.asp

Use some straps: LST 16: http://www.strongtie.com/products/co...TS-MTS-HTS.asp

Be safe, Gary
Ok Gary, I'm only following you a little here. I understand what you mean by cutting the slope/rake not below 1/2 of the height of the joist and the top cut of the joist to not be in further than the width of the top plate, but is this to mount on top of the top plate next to the rafter and nail into the rafter from the side? Or is to be set directly under the rafter and nailed/tied to it? Thanks.

JP
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Old 02-16-2010, 11:32 PM   #38
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
Ouch.....22.5'

Just light storage above?
You basically have 2x8's right now
A #2 2x10 hem fir 16" OC 30/10 psf L360 will span 18' as a FLOOR joist
This means something that will be walked on & hold furniture...like a bedroom
L180/L240 (more flex) only gains you 6" more

L360 20/10 psf gets you to 20' 8"
L180/240 gets you to 21' 3"

Basically a 2x12 will span it without any real problem
A 2x10 will span it but may sag over time with heavy storage

I would install the new ones before removing the old ones
Yes, this is only for light storage. I currently only have lumber up there. So how about I do 2x12x20s notched 3" from the top and 3-3/4" from the side so they fit flush up underneath the top plate? Do I need the 2xs that are hanging from the rafters to the current joists? I'm not planning using this for more than light storage, but I should be able to walk on it. I'm 230 lbs.

JP
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Old 02-17-2010, 12:17 AM   #39
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jpearson311 View Post
Ok Gary, I'm only following you a little here. I understand what you mean by cutting the slope/rake not below 1/2 of the height of the joist and the top cut of the joist to not be in further than the width of the top plate, but is this to mount on top of the top plate next to the rafter and nail into the rafter from the side? Or is to be set directly under the rafter and nailed/tied to it? Thanks.

JP
Is the attached pic anywhere close Gary?
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Old 02-17-2010, 08:20 AM   #40
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


OK, do your studs line up right under the rafters ?

So I'd run a ledger board perpindicular to the studs to support the new joists
Cut a MAX of 1/4 of the joist at an angle to fit against the roof decking
--as in your Figure B = 2.3" for a 2x10
You have 3.5" roof rafter, then 3" double top plates
A 2x10 should meaure ~9.25" - 6.5" = 2.75"
So the ledger would be ~1/2" below the top plates

By putting the new joist to one side of the roof rafter you can nail into the roof rafter

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Old 02-17-2010, 09:50 AM   #41
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
OK, do your studs line up right under the rafters ?

So I'd run a ledger board perpindicular to the studs to support the new joists
Cut a MAX of 1/4 of the joist at an angle to fit against the roof decking
--as in your Figure B = 2.3" for a 2x10
You have 3.5" roof rafter, then 3" double top plates
A 2x10 should meaure ~9.25" - 6.5" = 2.75"
So the ledger would be ~1/2" below the top plates

By putting the new joist to one side of the roof rafter you can nail into the roof rafter

Thanks Scuba. The studs do line up directly underneath the rafters. However, the ledger board would run on the face of the studs correct? Making my wall protrude? If so, I'd rather do it the first way you suggested by notching the top corner of each joist and putting them snug under the top plate, then support them from underneath with a 2x sistered to the stud down to the bottom plate.

I did notice another thing last night though. I'd like to put a joist at each rafter, but at one location, at the left and right windows, the vertical stud disappears (see attached pic). How do you suggest I work around this for this one single joist? Thanks!

JP
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Old 02-17-2010, 09:56 AM   #42
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Properly nailed to the stud you will not need the stud below the new joist
Especially for light storage
Is there a header above the window?
If not the best solution might be a ledger across the window area & that joist will rest on the ledger
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Old 02-17-2010, 10:00 AM   #43
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
Properly nailed to the stud you will not need the stud below the new joist
Especially for light storage
Is there a header above the window?
If not the best solution might be a ledger across the window area & that joist will rest on the ledger
Wo, are you sure? Define properly nailed and what's the max load weight it could handle without the sistered 2xs? There is no header above the window. Should there be?

JP
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Old 02-17-2010, 10:14 AM   #44
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


If the roof lands above that window there should be a header
How big is the window? A 2' window I wouldn't worry about it
But from your sketch it looks like it only cross 2 stud bays = ~32" wide?
That's not a huge span...but there should have been a header
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Old 02-17-2010, 10:20 AM   #45
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Raising overhead joists in my garage. Is this a good idea?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
If the roof lands above that window there shoul be a header
How big is the window? A 2' window I wouldn't worry about it
But from your sketch it looks like it only cross 2 stud bays = ~32" wide?
That's not a huge span...but there should have been a header
Ok I see. I didn't measure it last night, but it doesn't seem to span wider than 1 stud bay (~22.5"). I'll put a header in there despite. Anything else I should worry about? Thanks!

JP

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