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Old 07-20-2007, 10:30 AM   #16
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Rain water draining into sump pit


1. No

2. No.

3. No.

4. No.

5. YES.

6. Does not sound too frequent. If you want to sleep better get a pump with a battery powered back up or just a normal back-up pump to put on the shelf.

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Old 07-20-2007, 03:55 PM   #17
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Rain water draining into sump pit


I do basement waterproofing for a living and just finished pouring a floor in a dirt-floored basement that was a mud hole when we started. In the middle of a month and a half long drought, there was still water coming up through the floor, obviously from underground springs. The basement is now clean and dry because we didn't try to keep the water out, but channeled it into a drainage system that led to the sump pump. You said you had a battery backup, so I wouldn't worry about the amount of water coming in. Your only concern should be whether or not there's a lot of silt in the water. If there is, the drain tile will eventually cease to be able to function properly. For that reason, we always install a clean-out for any underfloor system we put in. Other than that, the pump is doing it's job just like the roof does it, only you don't here the roof kick on every time it's working.
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Old 07-20-2007, 06:07 PM   #18
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Rain water draining into sump pit


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Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
I do basement waterproofing for a living and just finished pouring a floor in a dirt-floored basement that was a mud hole when we started. In the middle of a month and a half long drought, there was still water coming up through the floor, obviously from underground springs. The basement is now clean and dry because we didn't try to keep the water out, but channeled it into a drainage system that led to the sump pump. You said you had a battery backup, so I wouldn't worry about the amount of water coming in. Your only concern should be whether or not there's a lot of silt in the water. If there is, the drain tile will eventually cease to be able to function properly. For that reason, we always install a clean-out for any underfloor system we put in. Other than that, the pump is doing it's job just like the roof does it, only you don't here the roof kick on every time it's working.
I have a battery back up on the upper basement - that is new interior drain tile that I added to the house. My lower basement, under my addition, does not yet have a battery back-up - but I will get one soon. The drain tile for the addition is exterior to the foundation. I'm going to hold off on finishing that area for a few years - I really have no choice because I went way over budget in just about every other area - and this will give me a chance to see if I need to take any other waterproofing measures before I finish the space.

One question for you regarding clean-outs - when I had the interior drain tile put in on the upper part of the basement, the company did a great job and I've got 3 clean-outs, and the drain tile is PVC. For $75 a year, they come and flush the whole system out, and warranty it for as long as I live here. No-brainer for me.

However, when my addition was built, I really knew nothing about drain tile and sump pits, and they just laid black corrugated pipe in the gravel, and covered everyting up. Had I known better, I would have insisted on PVC and clean-outs. So, as it stands, the only access I have to the exterior drain tile around the addition is through a drain in the window well - that would cover about 80% of the perimeter, but would leave the first 15 feet or so unservicable.

Do I have any options to keep the pipe clean without excavating down to the footing and putting in a clean-out? Would the window well drain serve as an adequate clean out?

Thanks to everyone for their help. I'm sleeping a little better - even more so when I get a battery backup.
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Old 07-20-2007, 06:48 PM   #19
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Rain water draining into sump pit


You may be able to flush the system via the window well drain. Essentially you would run a hose in the drain and turn it on. You can get a special fitting that goes on the end of the hose that inflates due to the water pressure to seal the drain pipe so the water gets forced down the drain rather than coming out the cleanout.

In reality, I prefer perforated corrugated ADS over PVC, but when we use that rather than one of the other systems we install, it goes inside the basement. The reason is that, if water comes from below the footer or in the middle of the basement floor from an underground source, the drain that's laid around the outside of the foundation won't help. (Where does that pipe go? Normally it would have to pitch downhill to a storm drain or other discharge.)

As to what else you can do, if you find water coming in at the joint between the wall and the floor, there are a couple of systems that use a special adhesive to fasten a vinyl baseboard to the floor that then acts as a conduit to conduct the water to the sump pump.

The key is to understand if you have subsurface water that is getting in, nothing you can do will keep it out, but you can channel it where you want it, and then pump it back out. 85% of the houses with basements in America will eventually have water in their basements, but that doesn't mean there's a problem with the house or that the basement cannot be used for living space. It just means that you need an effective way of managing the water that gets in.

HTH,
rww
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Old 07-20-2007, 10:19 PM   #20
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Rain water draining into sump pit


Quote:
Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
You may be able to flush the system via the window well drain. Essentially you would run a hose in the drain and turn it on. You can get a special fitting that goes on the end of the hose that inflates due to the water pressure to seal the drain pipe so the water gets forced down the drain rather than coming out the cleanout.
I think I'll have the company that installed my drain tile in the upper basement service both systems every year. Couldn't hurt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
In reality, I prefer perforated corrugated ADS over PVC, but when we use that rather than one of the other systems we install, it goes inside the basement. The reason is that, if water comes from below the footer or in the middle of the basement floor from an underground source, the drain that's laid around the outside of the foundation won't help. (Where does that pipe go? Normally it would have to pitch downhill to a storm drain or other discharge.)
I'm not sure if you were asking me a question - my corrugated pipe goes right to my sump pit in the corner of the basement, then gets pumped overhead and into the sewer line. Fortunately, my village allows that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
As to what else you can do, if you find water coming in at the joint between the wall and the floor, there are a couple of systems that use a special adhesive to fasten a vinyl baseboard to the floor that then acts as a conduit to conduct the water to the sump pump.
Fortunately, the lower basement has been dry - the sump has worked well (knock on wood) and I haven't gotten any seepage around the footings. It's funny though - I like the system I have on the upper (old) basement better, and that was a retrofit. Goes to show that waterproofing professionals like yourself know how to waterproof. The lower basement is brand new construction, and my foundation guys just laid the pipe around the foundation. Not that they did anything wrong - but if I was building again, I would bring in a waterproofing company to work with the foundation guys. The vinyl baseboard you mention sounds similar to what I had installed with my drain tile in the upper basement - when they dug the trench around the interior preimeter, they put a plastic channel against the wall that goes down into the gravel - so in the event there is any seepage into the wall, the water will find its way down into the drain tile.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
The key is to understand if you have subsurface water that is getting in, nothing you can do will keep it out, but you can channel it where you want it, and then pump it back out. 85% of the houses with basements in America will eventually have water in their basements, but that doesn't mean there's a problem with the house or that the basement cannot be used for living space. It just means that you need an effective way of managing the water that gets in.
I learned when my upper basement was getting water with every steady rain, that it's not keeping water away from your house - it's keeping it from getting where it can do damage. I'm completely comfortable with the system in my upper basement, which is finished living space. I think when I finish the new section, what little I know about waterproofing has given me a couple of ideas. Since as you mention I don't have any interior system in the new basement to keep water from below the footer or in the middle of the basement floor from getting in (while that hasn't been a problem, better safe than sorry), I would put an interior system in with a sump in the corner at the back of the house - I could either connect this to the sewer with the other pump, or run a pipe out under my deck 10 feet away from the foundation. I would also put a floor drain in - I plan on raising the floor on the side of the basement the pits would be on. Eventually I'd like to make this room a home theater, so I could put a large floor drain under the riser I would build for the back of the room. The floor drain would run into the second sump pit. This way, if my first pump from the exterior system ever overflowed, the water would run into the drain, into the second pit, and out to wherever I pumped it. Ideally, the second pump would never be used - there is some likelihood that my one pump, exterior system will work 100%, but it should provide peace of mind.

Does that sound like a decent plan?

In the meantime, while the room is just a concrete slab for a few years, I can monitor to see if any issues arise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwwood View Post
HTH,
rww
Of course it did. Thanks!!

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