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Old 07-30-2010, 11:46 AM   #1
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


So I have my footing sizes all figured out, and plans drawn (Seen Below), but cannot find any information for sizing the pier width for post connection. All the posts will be 6x6 on this deck. Anyone have any guides for something such as this.. I was looking at 10" sonotube, but had me nervous about wind velocity tugging at them. So figured Id ask someone with more experience.
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Old 07-30-2010, 11:49 AM   #2
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Oops.. the large footings are 22", the medium are 16" and the smaller ones are 12"

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Old 07-30-2010, 12:00 PM   #3
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Where are you located?

How deep is the footing pad and how high is the deck?

10" or 12" Sonotubes would be fine. Do you plan on leaving some vertical dowels sticking out of the footing pad? This, along with a couple of vertical rebar set inside the tube would be adequate for most uplift and wind.

When the concrete in the tube is still wet, insert an appropriate Simpson connector into the concrete.

If you local conditions are severe, the code people may require and engineer to sign the plans and remove the design liability from you.

I assume this is a ledger supported deck instead of a free-standing deck, so be very careful about the attachment to the ledger (through bolts are definitely the best). Seal everything, use flashing up and under the primary moisture barrier. There has been a lot written about this type of installation because of the failures and moisture/mold.

Dick
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:03 PM   #4
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Page #9, Table #4: http://www.lancova.com/deckinfo.pdf Verify with local B.D.

Be safe, Gary
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:11 PM   #5
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


I am in St. Louis missouri and my frost line is at 30" below grade. I am planning approx. 34-36" depth. The ledger will be lag bolted to the rim. The deck will stand 96" from ground, and 98" with decking. The 12x12' octogon will reside 4 inches higher than the rest... so approx 102" from ground and will also support a pergola. I was not planning on having rebar protruding, but was planning on having a couple rods inside the concrete pier, and a criss cross of two inside the footer itself. Are the simpson connectors required to installed when wet? Or is there an option when dry? Is there a benefit to having a dowel sticking out?
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:15 PM   #6
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


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Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
Page #9, Table #4: http://www.lancova.com/deckinfo.pdf Verify with local B.D.

Be safe, Gary
Good info... but now I am a bit confused.. that doc said do not attach to brick veneer, but that is what I am doing kinda... everythign I read said you can put the ledger against the veneer, but I have to drill through the veneer and lag to the rim. Is that not true? Of course sealing the drill holes.
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:43 PM   #7
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


You should clear this with your local B.D. They have the final say, not us. Many Inspectors follow the Guide with locational changes and amendments. It will be safer, go on your personal house record with the County, and be covered by your H.O. Insurance.

Another good one: http://books.google.com/books?id=1gg...num=3#PPA31,M1
And: http://rockproducts.com/mag/rock_agg...prevent_frost/

Be safe, Gary
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:54 PM   #8
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


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Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
You should clear this with your local B.D. They have the final say, not us. Many Inspectors follow the Guide with locational changes and amendments. It will be safer, go on your personal house record with the County, and be covered by your H.O. Insurance.

Another good one: http://books.google.com/books?id=1gg...num=3#PPA31,M1
And: http://rockproducts.com/mag/rock_agg...prevent_frost/

Be safe, Gary
Right, my local BD will review my plans so they usually check up on that stuff correct? I am submitting my site plan to zoning, then my my authorized zoning plans goes to the building division.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:29 PM   #9
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Attaching a ledger through a brick veneer is not recommended. It is definitely not as strong as even a lag bolt into a ledge. This is because the lag bolt is very long without any support as it goes through the brick and through the cavity between the brick and the sheathing. Tightening the lag screw can pull the brick tight to the sheathing and moisture barrier, which could also crack the mortar joints (more water intrusion).

All the thing you read say you CAN do it, but do not point out the problems inherent with that approach.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:32 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by concretemasonry View Post
Attaching a ledger through a brick veneer is not recommended. It is definitely not as strong as even a lag bolt into a ledge. This is because the lag bolt is very long without any support as it goes through the brick and through the cavity between the brick and the sheathing. Tightening the lag screw can pull the brick tight to the sheathing and moisture barrier, which could also crack the mortar joints (more water intrusion).

All the thing you read say you CAN do it, but do not point out the problems inherent with that approach.
So it is recommended to make this free standing huh?

Now that really chaps me. Now I have to reassess my plans and how to reconfigure it. Now I am even more at a loss!

Damn.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:39 PM   #11
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


The normal approach to this too common problem is to place piers and post about 2' away from the home and cantilever the joist sitting on a beam back about 2' to near the house. This separates the deck from the house and preserves the brick with a slight air space, so there is no new source for moisture to enter, still the same appearance.

Most deck designers are aware of the problem and the solutions.

Dick
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Old 07-30-2010, 02:16 PM   #12
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


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Originally Posted by concretemasonry View Post
The normal approach to this too common problem is to place piers and post about 2' away from the home and cantilever the joist sitting on a beam back about 2' to near the house. This separates the deck from the house and preserves the brick with a slight air space, so there is no new source for moisture to enter, still the same appearance.

Most deck designers are aware of the problem and the solutions.

Dick
Understood.. I designed my own deck though, off of a different design of course, so I will have to do alot of homework now to modify my current design to alleviate this issue. I assume it will involve 3 more piers closer to the home, just now I come into the issue of to many posts protruding up cluttering up my walkout basement patio.
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Old 07-30-2010, 02:25 PM   #13
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Keep in mind some B.D. want the footings within 5' of the house basement to match in depth. Also noticed the beam with hangers off opposite sides at the octagon, a no-no, per sited Code. Notice the decking screwed to the rim for positive attachment, also.

Be safe, Gary
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Old 07-30-2010, 02:57 PM   #14
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Quote:
Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
Keep in mind some B.D. want the footings within 5' of the house basement to match in depth. Also noticed the beam with hangers off opposite sides at the octagon, a no-no, per sited Code. Notice the decking screwed to the rim for positive attachment, also.

Be safe, Gary
Damn... I just copied that from a design on decks.com. So their stuff must not be up to code?
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Old 07-31-2010, 03:42 PM   #15
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Pier Dimensions for a deck


Post #4. That is why I always try to check with LOCAL Code.
It just means to drop that beam under and block between to prevent rotation of the joists. This will all be in your permitted copy.

Be safe, Gary

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