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Old 05-18-2012, 03:15 PM   #1
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


I have a 58 yr old home with grooved cedar siding. I think they are about 17" with 14" exposure. The paint buildup has become an issue. Condition isn't bad but the paint is peeling unevenly. Removing it on this type of siding is problematic. We are thinking of siding over the existing material, code permitting, with the same material.

I tried something non-standard as a possible approach and am wondering if anyone has ever seen this one. Taking a piece of siding I turned it so the thick side is up, cut it to proper length so that the thicker end goes up under the course immediately above, nailed it on and it looks very good. You wind up with the shadow lines about the original and a decent new surface. The trim will not need modification.

Concerns, code of course, whether there are moisture problems generated by this idea and anything else I didn't think of. I would also on the thin end of all this use construction adhesive to make the bond stronger (removing paint in a strip so it would be wood to wood).

Advantage to all this is that I would not have to remove the old siding, the alignment of the siding would be guided by the original, speed would be no issue as the old siding would still be there.

Crazy idea?

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Old 05-18-2012, 03:44 PM   #2
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


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Crazy idea?
I wouldn't do it.

If you’re going to the expense of new shingles then you should really tear off what you have and do it right.

A 58 year old home will undoubtedly have a few issues under the siding that should be dealt with. Adding more layers is rarely advisable imo and the way you propose to do it is a little "crazy".

You should be able to salvage a lot of the old, turn it over and use it for the under course if you’re careful with the tear off.

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Old 05-18-2012, 06:18 PM   #3
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


Thanks

I was looking for the easiest way out. I guess my main concern is keeping the courses properly aligned. Maybe I should haul out the paint sprayer one more time.
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Old 05-18-2012, 06:30 PM   #4
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


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Thanks

I was looking for the easiest way out. I guess my main concern is keeping the courses properly aligned. Maybe I should haul out the paint sprayer one more time.
That siding isn’t cheap by any means, if you’re going to do it, do it right.

A chalk line is about six bucks, it will help you keep your lines straight.

Post some pictures if you want some info on possibly “restoring” what you have.

BTW, welcome to the forum.
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Old 05-19-2012, 01:36 PM   #5
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


Basically the issue involves failure of the paint between earlier applications. The last painting, Behr Ultra, seems to be strong stuff. You can peel some of it off almost as if it was applied as a siding type product. It removes several layers of paint going down to the first painting we did many years ago.

I believe the house was originally sided with pre-primed grey stain or primer. The siding was back primed. An older neighbor told me years back he thought the house was originally finish coated in grey. Then it had a white coating applied. We bought it a few years after that. It was chalky and had some mildew on it at that point.

Memory, and this goes back a long time, says that we used tsp, brushes and lots of H2O on it back then. I am pretty sure we primed it and applied a couple of coats of finish paint.

After that it was painted three more times that I can remember. Each time primer and finish. The last time, Behr Paint, was just the finish product as it is supposed to be ok as a primer also.

Anyway, I've gotten pretty good at removing the paint all the way back to that white layer. Not 100% but quite a lot of it. If we stay with the old siding I plan wash it with bleach, tsp(if still avail), a gentle power wash. Then primer and paint. A mildewcide in the paint might be good but Behr told me not to do it. They recommended a small amount of bleach.

I plan to test all this before I make my final decision on some kind of reside. It will eventually get done but I would rather wait a bit if it will paint up reasonably well. There is a large amount of other work going on right now.

Problems I am running into: Peeling it well so that as little as possible is left. It generally will pull up from the bottom almost to the undercoarse layer of the next layer above. It leaves an inch or so at the top unstripped. Not sure whether to fight that at all as the strip seems to be adhered pretty strongly. Some areas will not peel at all. That would seem to be ok.

Any thoughts on this are welcome.
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Old 05-19-2012, 05:36 PM   #6
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


For that last inch try a paint stripper or rent an infrared paint stripper . Just don’t get to aggressive with the scraper.
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Old 05-19-2012, 06:10 PM   #7
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The bond is releasing the paint layers because of moisture trying to get out. (Especially back-primed with/if oil based). Are the laps open at the joint, or painted closed?
http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...oss-enclosures

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Old 05-19-2012, 06:29 PM   #8
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The bond is releasing the paint layers because of moisture trying to get out. (Especially back-primed with/if oil based). Are the laps open at the joint, or painted closed?
http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...oss-enclosures

Gary
That could very well be Gary, it could also just be bad prep (dirty siding).
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Old 05-19-2012, 07:54 PM   #9
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


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A mildewcide in the paint might be good but Behr told me not to do it. They recommended a small amount of bleach.
Wait! What? Behr recommended a small amount of bleach be added to the paint?
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Old 05-20-2012, 07:16 AM   #10
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Oversiding Grooved Cedar Siding


Thanks all for the replies. Having informed help is great.

Gary-Not sure what you mean by laps. Probably my ignorance. The siding was applied using undercourse shingles. At this point everything is painted. The only extra breathing the material can do I guess would be what gets underneath the space created by the undercourse shingles.

The structure was originally insulated using double foil fiberglass insulation in the walls and roof. I found this out when any repairs or changes were done.

Interesting link re. moisture by the way. The house has had some history of moisture issues but in all the years we have been here I think I have them in hand. Minimized moisture buildup through the showers, keep the basement dry as possible using a dehumidifier when needed. More recently, a couple of new foundation walls and a full foundation drain system installed. The latter really seems to have helped.

KFRON-I think it is a combination of some moisture that perhaps the paint could handle normally and bad prep. When the paint was applied all those years ago over that chalking layer perhaps the prep wasn't good enough. I remember washing it until I was waterlogged but it may not have had enough pressure behind it as I was using just house pressure. Mild pressure washing might have been better. This is from memory going back more years than I want to admit to.

In any case the siding seem normal enough once you get down to the bottom of the all the paint. It's not water logged or suffering from water damage. I think, maybe that's dangerous, anything I am seeing is just 50+ years of age showing. On the north side, very shaded, mostly unheated area behind as garage is there, siding very good condition. Even the paint is not bad. South side, extreme sun in summer, paint not peeling all that much but siding is dryer and the wood tends to have more cracking and warping. East side, front, was always not bad but now is peeling. West side, semi-shade due to deciduous trees, first floor not bad, paint even adhering. Second floor, provided by shed dormer, history of bad paint adhesion with peeling. Might be that height made prep especially bad at that first repaint. Could also have been moisture issues

Dogris-I have a hunch you don't like the idea of bleach directly in the paint. They mentioned just a very small amount. I was not going to try this without calling them again. The csr sounded shaky on the idea when I spoke with her. Probably need to stick with label directions in the end.


Ted, aka JerseyDevil

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