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Old 12-06-2009, 02:00 PM   #1
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OMG rotted wallz!!


Hello All,
Let me start by saying Yes I am a newbie and I have been a long time thread readererer! I did do some searching however my questions still go unanswered. So heres the problem me and my wife purchased a 1978 ranch in NH 4 years ago we have been doing minor repairs and so on fixing flooring a couple additions. Ill spare the saga anyways recently I decided to go hands on with my bathroom which needed an update it was sporting one of those bathroom covers upon pulling it off HOLY ROT. I have noticed the floor was wet the framing around the window was rotted all the way down to the subfloor. Now the joist underneath are not rotted and Its limited to a small section. So several questions I have I am going to remove the siding and attempt to fix myself. As you can see from the images the rot goes to the bottom however the good news is from what i can see rot is limited to just belwo the window.

1. Is it better to fix from the outside or inside?
2. I noticed part of the subfloor is rotted is it okay to cut that piece out? (this is a non load bearing wall according to my friend)
I will attach some images of the damage so any insight would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Newbie Frank
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Old 12-06-2009, 02:48 PM   #2
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OMG rotted wallz!!


WOW!!!
Looks like a mess... and looks like there might be some insect activity as well...
I'd start by making a plan for eliminating the water intrusion in the first place.... looks like the framing might need to be replaced in some areas and the exterior sheeting, but if you have vinyl siding and /or an newer siding on the outside I would not repair form the outside. as long as you repair the framing it should be structurally intact. make sure you fill the walls with insulation and A PLASTIC VAPOR BARRIER before replacing the drywall. On that note I'd suggest using something like James Hardy panel instead on drywall...it's waterproof. Looks like a window over he TUB???? If you're interested... I have a great solutio for that... contact me if your interested...

You might also look at the EPA site for mold mitigation suggestions.... generally bleac/water mix syrayed on the existing mold should be the trick.... but you need to let it all dry out good first.... Good luck
Here if you need anything else..
Doc

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Old 12-06-2009, 02:50 PM   #3
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I'd definatly remove all of the subfloor under the tub at least and replace.... looks too far gone to repair.
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Old 12-06-2009, 02:55 PM   #4
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Rip it all out, spray for insects
Remove the siding, rebuild the wall & get rid of all the rot
Install sheathing & a proper vapor barrier on the outside
Re-install the window & seal it properly to the house from the outside
Re-install the sheathing

Do it right & you won't have rot again
Do it wrong, not sealed from the outside...and you risk the same thing all over again
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Old 12-06-2009, 03:30 PM   #5
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You are going to have to attack this from the outside. Even if you tried to do it from the inside you will still have to reattach your siding to it. I suggest that you strip the wall and rebuild it properly. One thing to remember is that if you have a window in the shower area you are going to have to pay special attention to sealing around the window from the inside. It looks to me that you have had problems with water seeping under the window from the jambs and draining into your framing. I am usually reluctant to install windows into shower areas. If you are going to do this seal it well.
If it makes you feel better I have seen worse. Good luck.
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Old 12-06-2009, 03:32 PM   #6
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Looks like the window may not have been flashed. Improperly flashed or unflashed windows allow moisture penetration past the window into the wall cavity, which may have happened in this case. To properly flash the window requires that you remove the window, which you are going to have to do anyway in order to repair all of the damage.
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Old 12-06-2009, 04:43 PM   #7
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OMG rotted wallz!!


Thanks for all the responses!! I plan on removing the subfloor to the joist an rebuilding. As for the water intrusion two reasons

1. The bathtub had a crack in the bottom
2. The outside window hadn’t been sealed very well. Probably partly my fault for no upkeep on it the caulking was totally missing.

I’ve never removed siding seems pretty easy from what I see online. I shouldn’t have to remove the whole house just the troubled area. We currently have about a foot of snow so it will have to wait. I did see some bugs and killed em all i hope. As for mold I pretty much got rid of it all however it will need to dry out. My main objective is to literally gut all the rot and build back up. I know now that from the outside is going to be the best and only way due to siding needing to latch on to the outer shell.

Few more questions.

1. Do you guys have any recommendations for shielding around the window?
2. What type of wood should I use on external walls.
3. Would a standard window rough framing work fine?
4. Should I rip up the bathroom subfloor to the joist?
5. Any other insight would be appreciated?

Excuse my non industry jargon.

Appreciatively,
Frank
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Old 12-06-2009, 08:38 PM   #8
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Hey Frank, windows in a tub area are common here and even more common are the problems associated with them. I've tore out a bunch and either got rid of the window completely and did a surround or tile. Or put glass block in. A company I've had good luck with is www.hy-lite.com . I feel as long as your into it do it right. During this time of year when I have a job like your bathroom and have to address the exterior I build a frame and tarp it so I can work in shelter and comfort with a propane heater.
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Old 12-06-2009, 08:42 PM   #9
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A lot of people pull out the larger window
Then they install a smaller window up higher more out of the water
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:37 AM   #10
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Ahem...vapour barriers in NH go on the warm side, not the outside...!

I've seen jobs like that; we'd start from the inside, tear out the wall, support it where needed, reframe 2x6s, new window, spray foam, wall covering and tub, Kerdi waterproofing membrane, and then tile.

Main causes?: water infiltration from the window (covered by that solid surround he tore out) and no vapour barrier. Improperly protected wood siding covered by modern siding. Insects? maybe but they'd have to be tough up here...

There may be a problem with the external sheathing in which case go at it from the outside and replace existing with OSB or plywood and then Tyvek. But that suggests the whole house may have an issue with sheathing.
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Old 12-07-2009, 07:25 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulie View Post
Hey Frank, windows in a tub area are common here and even more common are the problems associated with them. I've tore out a bunch and either got rid of the window completely and did a surround or tile. Or put glass block in. A company I've had good luck with is www.hy-lite.com . I feel as long as your into it do it right. During this time of year when I have a job like your bathroom and have to address the exterior I build a frame and tarp it so I can work in shelter and comfort with a propane heater.
WoW that's what I would do to, get rid of all mold, tarp the outside, remove window and siding, all new siding flooring walls, tub surround.

No more window, mold, moisture, bugs.

Tarp, Shelter, Heat, YEAH!!!!
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Old 12-07-2009, 08:10 AM   #12
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Removing a window completly is IMO a major homeowners design decision - and certainly an option - but when properly done, replacing a window in a bathroom is 'tricky' - and that's all! Not impossible! and you have to know a few things about waterproofing - but a far less drastic an option for the HO.

Remember, the OP is in NH and I challenge anyone to show me a glass block window in a bathroom up here where the HO is fully satisfied with their choice and the work done by a professional...just doesn't happen up here.
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Old 12-07-2009, 08:57 AM   #13
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Interesting. I had just posted How to Flash Windows in the how to section. This will help you flash the outside. Moisture barrier will probably be required inside.
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Old 12-07-2009, 09:14 AM   #14
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Moisture barrier will probably be required inside.
Up here, two things are required: an air barrier on the outside (viz: "Tyvek" or similar) and a moisture barrier or retarder on the inside. This in fact becomes even more important in a shower/bathroom area - so it has to be done right from the beginning.

Under siding on the outside, we use a plastic housewrap. On the inside, we waterproof the walls - but the choice of moisture barrier will depend on the type of insulation used. That's why we go with spray-foam. It acts as a vapour barrier (closed cell type) and thermal break all-in-one.

At the cost of energy up here, we can't afford to guess what is needed.
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Old 12-07-2009, 09:43 AM   #15
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Yes, that's what I thought. No expert on interior here!
I know I would have used a vapor barrier on the inside.

I honestly believe from the photos that a sill pan would have been the cure. It looks like the water was coming through the sill, doesn't it. Faulty window, maybe.

" an air barrier on the outside (viz: "Tyvek" or similar) " I figured this went without saying.


Last edited by tinner666; 12-07-2009 at 09:44 AM. Reason: typo
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