Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Building & Construction

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-09-2012, 09:04 PM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 146
Share |
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


I need to construct a header for a 106" opening on a non load bearing partition wall.

The wall will be supporting a Johnson Hardware Multi-Pass (Tri-Pass) Door Track with (3) 36" x 80" doors with glass.

It will be a 3-Ply header of dimensional lumber to accommodate the track.

Currently, I'm leaning towards (3) - 2 x 8's glued and screwed.

What would you use?

GottaFixIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2012, 10:39 PM   #2
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: B.C. Canada
Posts: 2,040
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


I would not use a header at all. Put cripple studs every 2' (or 16" if you like)

mae-ling is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mae-ling For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-09-2012, 11:22 PM   #3
STAFF
 
BigJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: East Tennessee
Posts: 7,082
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by GottaFixIt View Post
I need to construct a header for a 106" opening on a non load bearing partition wall.

The wall will be supporting a Johnson Hardware Multi-Pass (Tri-Pass) Door Track with (3) 36" x 80" doors with glass.

It will be a 3-Ply header of dimensional lumber to accommodate the track.

Currently, I'm leaning towards (3) - 2 x 8's glued and screwed.

What would you use?
If your wall is thicker than 2X4s I would do just like you suggested.
__________________
New members: Please consider adding your location to your profile.

Jim
BigJim is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to BigJim For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-09-2012, 11:27 PM   #4
Disabled wood vet
 
titanoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,646
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by mae-ling
I would not use a header at all. Put cripple studs every 2' (or 16" if you like)
That makes for a pretty flimsy wall.
And you can go to carpenter hell for putting anything 2' o/c.

The dbl 2x8 is overkill though. You could build a strong-back header (2 2x4's nailed in an "L" shape) and then notch the 1 1/2 x 3 1/2 out of the cripples.
The wall won't have any bounce or sag to it.

Edit: Nix that.
I guess you have a 4 1/2" wall.

Sent from a Samsung Galaxy S2

Last edited by titanoman; 01-09-2012 at 11:34 PM.
titanoman is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to titanoman For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 06:20 AM   #5
Mold!! Let's kill it!
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,833
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


If it's a 2x4 wall, I'd use two 2x6s with a piece of 1/2" plywood glued and screwed between them. That should be more than sufficient to carry the doors. Make sure the header ends are sitting on jack studs.
Maintenance 6 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Maintenance 6 For This Useful Post:
Beanfacekilla (01-10-2012), GottaFixIt (01-10-2012), Willie T (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 06:38 AM   #6
Crusty Old Dude
 
Big Stud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 111
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


I have to agree that 2x8s are overkill. 2x6 would be plenty strong.

My question is, do you not have to drywall the header after putting it in? Or should we assume that the framing is 4 1/2" and with 1/2" drywall will be 5 1/2"?

If it is a standard 2x4 wall, the framing is going to be 3 1/2". Usually you would use 2- 2x6 or 2x whatever with a piece of 1/2" plywood in between.

BTW ....... the other answers about just using a 2x4 on the flat with cripples would likely work as well in a non load bearing wall and be more cost effective. It just depends on what you want to spend,
__________________
All the best to you and yours, Tom
Big Stud is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Big Stud For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 08:52 AM   #7
STAFF
 
BigJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: East Tennessee
Posts: 7,082
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


I do agree 3 2X8s are an over kill but if that is what he wants to do that is fine with me, it will for sure make a strong wall.
__________________
New members: Please consider adding your location to your profile.

Jim
BigJim is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to BigJim For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 09:03 AM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 146
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Here is the installation directions.

It requires a 5 1/4" header. The 3 Two-Bys would give me 4 1/2. I could space or shim these out to 5 1/4" - probably with a couple of sheets of 3/8 ply.

Or I could lay a 6x flat underneath and just deal with the extra 1/8" spacing from the trim.

I guess another option may be to construct a structural box beam.

Ugh... So many choices....

I just want to make sure that this 9' span doesn't bow down over the years...

Still open for suggestions.
Attached Thumbnails
Non Load Bearing Header-doorinstall.jpg  
GottaFixIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 10:09 AM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 146
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Stud View Post
BTW ....... the other answers about just using a 2x4 on the flat with cripples would likely work as well in a non load bearing wall and be more cost effective. It just depends on what you want to spend,
I thought long and hard about just using a flat 2 x 6.

There are a couple of things that bother me about that.

IRC 2006 and 2009, Section R602.7.2
Nonbearing walls. Load-bearing headers are not required in interior or exterior nonbearing walls. A single, flat 2-inch-by-4-inch (51 mm by 102 mm) member may be used as a header in interior or exterior nonbearing walls for openings up to 8 feet (2438 mm) in width if the vertical distance to the parallel nailing surface above is not more than 24 inches (610 mm). For such nonbearing headers, no cripples or blocking is required above the header.


I'm over 8' width. In addition, this is in a lean-to roof above this. It doesn't have a vertical parallel nailer above it.
GottaFixIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 11:28 AM   #10
Framing Contractor
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 1,059
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Go with the box beam or the triple 2x8. I think the glue and screws are unnecessary, but it sure can't hurt. The door itself will be hang from the header and that alone can cause sag over time.
sixeightten is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to sixeightten For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 11:35 AM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: B.C. Canada
Posts: 2,040
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


"That makes for a pretty flimsy wall.
And you can go to carpenter hell for putting anything 2' o/c."

Mis-information here.

This is a non loadbearing wall. Header is not required. And 2foot on center studs are allowed.

Many assume a header above any door, why ? There really is no load.
Even for these doors which hang from the top. If you have a plate above the doors, cripple studs up to a top plate which is nailed to the bottom of the rafters nothing can really go anywhere. Unless these are heavy doors.

Putting in a header is not wrong, just not needed.
mae-ling is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mae-ling For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 11:36 AM   #12
Disabled wood vet
 
titanoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,646
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by sixeightten
Go with the box beam or the triple 2x8. I think the glue and screws are unnecessary, but it sure can't hurt. The door itself will be hang from the header and that alone can cause sag over time.
Also if you have the room double up the trimmers just because it's over 6'.

Sent from a Samsung Galaxy S2
titanoman is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to titanoman For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 11:40 AM   #13
Disabled wood vet
 
titanoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,646
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by mae-ling
"That makes for a pretty flimsy wall.
And you can go to carpenter hell for putting anything 2' o/c."

Mis-information here.

This is a non loadbearing wall. Header is not required. And 2foot on center studs are allowed.

Many assume a header above any door, why ? There really is no load.
Even for these doors which hang from the top. If you have a plate above the doors, cripple studs up to a top plate which is nailed to the bottom of the rafters nothing can really go anywhere. Unless these are heavy doors.

Putting in a header is not wrong,

just not needed.
There is no mis-information here.
And you are a lousy carpenter if you frame 2' o/c.

Sent from a Samsung Galaxy S2
titanoman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 11:40 AM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: B.C. Canada
Posts: 2,040
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by GottaFixIt View Post
I thought long and hard about just using a flat 2 x 6.

There are a couple of things that bother me about that.

IRC 2006 and 2009, Section R602.7.2
Nonbearing walls. Load-bearing headers are not required in interior or exterior nonbearing walls. A single, flat 2-inch-by-4-inch (51 mm by 102 mm) member may be used as a header in interior or exterior nonbearing walls for openings up to 8 feet (2438 mm) in width if the vertical distance to the parallel nailing surface above is not more than 24 inches (610 mm). For such nonbearing headers, no cripples or blocking is required above the header.


I'm over 8' width. In addition, this is in a lean-to roof above this. It doesn't have a vertical parallel nailer above it.
There is no top plate to this wall?
The way I read that is a 2x4 works on the flat up to 8' without cripples, more than 8' needs cripples.

Anything you put in for a header will work go double 2x6 with plywood inbetween or triple or double or triple 2x8, nail it or glue and screw
mae-ling is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mae-ling For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012)
Old 01-10-2012, 11:48 AM   #15
Disabled wood vet
 
titanoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,646
Default

Non Load Bearing Header


Quote:
Originally Posted by mae-ling

There is no top plate to this wall?
The way I read that is a 2x4 works on the flat up to 8' without cripples, more than 8' needs cripples.

Anything you put in for a header will work go double 2x6 with plywood inbetween or triple or double or triple 2x8, nail it or glue and screw
That's what I said in my first post (because of the width, use something on edge). Dbl 2x6 is fine.
Cripples 16" o/c above it.

Sent from a Samsung Galaxy S2

titanoman is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to titanoman For This Useful Post:
GottaFixIt (01-10-2012), Willie T (01-10-2012)
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
load bearing walls rvesci General DIY Discussions 4 12-28-2010 09:51 PM
Load bearing wall! Newtsjetson Building & Construction 2 12-19-2010 07:46 AM
Non load bearing wall door header? nocarpenter Building & Construction 10 06-11-2009 04:16 PM
Is this Load Bearing Wall remodel-virgin Building & Construction 16 05-11-2009 04:25 PM
framing, expanding wall opening wall - load bearing? nave Remodeling 5 01-23-2008 03:44 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.