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Old 03-07-2011, 09:09 PM   #1
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New addition 3" off of plans/help!


Ok toward the end of an addition on our kitchen, we used an architect and a builder that he has worked with in the past. The addition is 100 Sq.ft and calls for 8' ceilings. They poured the foundation and went up from there. after bing insid ethe sheetrocked room I kept saying it looked small. So I went back tonight and measured for myself.

The room is fine with the exception of the ceiling height. it is at 93 5/8th" when it should be 96" and I've yet to add a floor, so tack on another inch.

This make a problem when my cabinets come 36" + crown moldings, we wanted 21" off of the base set. SO that is now out, also wanted a ceiling fan but am worried it will be too low now.

3" on a 96" plan is more then 3% off, is that OK for a GC, am I being pickey?

I'm also worreid that when it comes time for resale it will not draw as much from a buyer. By law I may be able to make him tear it down and do it right, but I don't want to do that. Any suggestions, what would make this right for you.

The job cost me 50K 3% of 50K is $1,500, but that doesn't help me with the low ceilings I'll have to look at or the cabinets I may have to reorder.

And my wife WANTS crown molding!

Thanks in advance for any advice!

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Old 03-07-2011, 11:24 PM   #2
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New addition 3" off of plans/help!


take down ceiling drywall and move ceiling joists up 3 inches. This will only work if you used rafters vs trusses. And depending on the pitch it will give you a small angle at top of wall to ceiling. but a good finish carpenter can hide that behind the crown molding. I have done this before. In this instance I think the sawzall will be your best friend and you should make your gc fix that, but he shouldn't have to tear it all down to do so. But I'm not a licensed builder, just a handyman.

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Old 03-07-2011, 11:57 PM   #3
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you should be able to stand up a full sheet of sheet rock after the lid sheet rock is in. what did they do? only use one top plate, and then...??? find out if there is a reason for not going full height. maybe the existing room it attached to had a height limitation.
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Old 03-08-2011, 07:59 AM   #4
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Measuring from the sub floor to the top of the finished (sheet rocked) wall is 93 5/8ths.
The existing room had a ceiling height of 8' but I didn't know that, they then lowered the existing ceiling to match the new one so there'd be no transition.

I spoke with the architect this am he's trying to moderate the situation, I'll get back with more info as It comes.

Thanks to all.

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Old 03-08-2011, 08:48 AM   #5
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3" on a 96" plan is more then 3% off, is that OK for a GC, am I being pickey?
Bottom line is that we don't know if you are being too picky or not. Either this is a deal breaker for you or it isn't.

It's time to set up a conference with your architect and contractor and find out why this happened. Then go from there. There are too many variables for us to do anything but speculate.

OP - you are right. We 'have no idea what' you are 'paying for' because you didn't tell us.

It is worth pointing out that this site is moderated and run by a dedicated group of amateurs and professionals who GIVE their time freely to help out others - just look at the post counts for some of the folks on here and appreciate how much of their time they spend here. I've been thrilled at the thoughtfulness and responsiveness of all the folks on the forum. All of this comes along with an occasionally wonky sense of humor and an apt amount of constructive criticism (get it??). (I warned you about the wonky sense of humor).

You may not always LIKE what we have to say. You are free to ignore it. But keep in mind that the opinions, questions, and suggestions made by the members are backed by literally 1000s of hours of experience.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:42 AM   #6
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Bottom line is that we don't know if you are being too picky or not. Either this is a deal breaker for you or it isn't.

It's time to set up a conference with your architect and contractor and find out why this happened. Then go from there. There are too many variables for us to do anything but speculate.

OP - you are right. We 'have no idea what' you are 'paying for' because you didn't tell us.

It is worth pointing out that this site is moderated and run by a dedicated group of amateurs and professionals who GIVE their time freely to help out others - just look at the post counts for some of the folks on here and appreciate how much of their time they spend here. I've been thrilled at the thoughtfulness and responsiveness of all the folks on the forum. All of this comes along with an occasionally wonky sense of humor and an apt amount of constructive criticism (get it??). (I warned you about the wonky sense of humor).

You may not always LIKE what we have to say. You are free to ignore it. But keep in mind that the opinions, questions, and suggestions made by the members are backed by literally 1000s of hours of experience.

Leah,

Thanks for the constructive critisisim. I happen to be a moderator for a travel forum and I know what it can be like when a newbie pops in and wants answers fast. Sorry for that!

You'll all have to give me time to contribute more to this site , however my extreamly limited ability will hinder any real advice I can offer.

I felt the "humor" lent from the deleted post post was uncalled for. The reason I didn't tell members here what I paid for was that it had nothing to do with the conversation at hand other then to say it was not a cheap fly by night job. And a polite question of wanted facts could always have been asked. But I'm sure you understand that as I see the post was deleted.

To bring things up to date, I spoke with both GC and Architect, the GC never told the architect he broke ground or that the plans contrdicted what was possible given existing conditions.

That is the fault of the GC in my opinion as in the sealed plans it states any/all alterations must be made to the architect in writing and approved.

We are all meeting on Thursday just to pave over the road. I have a friend that is a builder and he calmed my nerves, he's going to drop by over the weekend (hopefully) and give me his insights.

In short I told them to continue the job as only priming was left to do and I'm not the kind of guy to make them tear down the job over a couple of inches and poor communication.

We did go ouot and chage the cabinet order (no additional cost) so that we can still have the offset lighting we wanted, were are dropping down from 36"- 30" with the exception of 2 corner units.

I may ask the GC to do the crown install now that it will not be as easy of a job as before. In my mind he should do this without cost to me. I guess we'll see come Thursday.

Thanks to all and again sorry if I came on in the wrong fashion.

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Old 03-09-2011, 09:55 AM   #7
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Did I understand you to say that an existing ceiling height had to match the ceiling height of the addition?

If that was the case, was there any other choice than to go with whatever was already existing? Why would they reverse it?
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Old 03-09-2011, 11:18 AM   #8
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Isn't an 8'minimum ceiling height code in most places? I am 6'5". I would never want a ceiling less than 8'
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:06 PM   #9
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Isn't an 8'minimum ceiling height code in most places? I am 6'5". I would never want a ceiling less than 8'
7' is the common minumum. It's 6'8" in other certain circumstances.
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:12 PM   #10
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Did I understand you to say that an existing ceiling height had to match the ceiling height of the addition?

If that was the case, was there any other choice than to go with whatever was already existing? Why would they reverse it?

Sounds to me like the GC assumed that the ceiling heights should match.

In my experience, contractors mostly don't read plans and don't ask questions, so if you're not around watching everything, it probably won't come out exactly like you wanted. I'm sure there are exceptions, and there are probably plenty of contractors who diligently follow plans. I just don't have any experience with that type of contractor
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Old 03-09-2011, 01:01 PM   #11
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When the GC showed me the orig ceiling that had 2X8's he asked if I wanted the ceilings to have a transition or to be level. I said level, assuming that the new ceiling was following plans and would still be 8'. He assumed I knew what he meant. As a contractor and as per the plans he has to sublit any/all changes in writing to the architect before implimenting any changes.

As per the GC the plans contradicted themselves in requierments 1 for an 8' ceiling another for a pitch that was not do-able.

7'6" is minmum in NJ.

We meet tomorrow, I'll get back to you all then.

As always thank you!
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Old 03-09-2011, 02:32 PM   #12
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When the GC showed me the orig ceiling that had 2X8's he asked if I wanted the ceilings to have a transition or to be level. I said level, assuming that the new ceiling was following plans and would still be 8'. He assumed I knew what he meant. As a contractor and as per the plans he has to sublit any/all changes in writing to the architect before implimenting any changes.

As per the GC the plans contradicted themselves in requierments 1 for an 8' ceiling another for a pitch that was not do-able.

7'6" is minmum in NJ.

We meet tomorrow, I'll get back to you all then.

As always thank you!

Oops.

The GC was working for you, right? Not for the architect? So any agreement he had to get changes approved by the architect was an agreement with you. When he asked you which way you wanted it, you could have told him he needed to ask the architect, but instead you made the call, overriding your previous instructions to get changes approved.

The exception might be plans that are approved by a building department and changes that impact the structure, but presumably if there was anything like that the inspector would have not let them put up the drywall.

It might not be a bad call, btw. If you didn't have a firm construction price, then he might have charged you extra for the delay while the architect revised the plans. And delays have a way of growing like snowballs in cartoons.

Last edited by pyper; 03-09-2011 at 02:34 PM.
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:26 PM   #13
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08087,

Quote:
I felt the "humor" lent from the deleted post post was uncalled for. The reason I didn't tell members here what I paid for was that it had nothing to do with the conversation at hand other then to say it was not a cheap fly by night job. And a polite question of wanted facts could always have been asked. But I'm sure you understand that as I see the post was deleted.
I made the post you are referring to that was deleted, glad you got to see it. No humor intended! I have a reputation for being overly coarse and outspoken at times.

It's not the first time I've been criticized for being a realist.

At any rate, I have been duly scolded for my indiscretion and I will hereby publicly apologize to you even though I wasn't asked to apologize.

Sorry 'bout that!
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Old 03-09-2011, 08:19 PM   #14
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08087,



I made the post you are referring to that was deleted, glad you got to see it. No humor intended! I have a reputation for being overly coarse and outspoken at times.

It's not the first time I've been criticized for being a realist.

At any rate, I have been duly scolded for my indiscretion and I will hereby publicly apologize to you even though I wasn't asked to apologize.

Sorry 'bout that!


There are plenty of forums one can go to get into a pissing match if that's what one cares to do. I'd like to think this is not one of those forums.

As I'm sure you noticed I placed the word "Humor" in quotes to indicate subtle sarcasm. I personally don't equate being a realist with being course. You can be real and still have an understanding of what someone with a lesser amount of knowledge then you is going through. It's part of being a good teacher, asking the right questions to elicit the most informative response.

No apology is needed, but I do appreciate the sentiment and I thank you for being big enough man to do so.

No harm done Another time and place/state of mind and I would have agreed with you.

As I mentioned above my ability with a hammer is limited as is my knowledge around construction projects, part of which is why I am here asking questions.

I do check this forum on a weekly basis but rarely find I have much if any advice to offer someone, hence my post total is low.

If anyone here ever wants to travel to Peru SA let me know and I will gladly share all I can.

Back on topic, I meet with the GC and architect tomorrow at noon, I think it has been explained to me in a satisfactory way what took place. The biggest problem was the GC lack of communicating his thoughts and actions prior to any approval or second opinion on how to proceed.

I'll post tomorrow with what resolution we came up with, being we had to fight with the cabinet maker to supply us with 30" cabinets instead of 36" as we wanted I'm hoping the builder will at least install the crown molding without charge and in a way that the 1/2" pitch isn't noticeable.

I'm sure you'll let me know if I'm expecting too much.
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Old 03-09-2011, 08:47 PM   #15
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New addition 3" off of plans/help!


Good luck. Keep it simple. Express your concerns and your expectations. Take notes.

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