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Old 06-16-2012, 03:49 PM   #1
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


Hey gang, we have a 10 year old deck which is original to the home. On the bottom of the deck the joist hangers appear to be coming off the ledger board. It has been this way since we purchased the home about 2 years ago (2nd owner) Please see the attached pictures. It looks like that a number of the joists may have been cut too short and thus the joist hangers were installed this way to allow attachement.

What would be the best method of repair here? I want to just remove the nails from the joist-hanger and then screw/re-nail the hanger into the ledger board but as the boards are not flush with the ledge Im not sure if will be able to firmly reattach the nails from the joist to the hanger. Do I need to replace the joist?

Do I have a severe safety issue?


Thank you for the time!! Photos attached..
Attached Thumbnails
Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures-deck-photos.jpg   Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures-deck.jpg   Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures-deck3.jpg   Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures-deck4.jpg   Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures-deck5.jpg  


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Last edited by akant; 06-16-2012 at 03:53 PM.
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Old 06-16-2012, 04:28 PM   #2
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


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Originally Posted by akant View Post
It has been this way since we purchased the home about 2 years ago...
I prefer the Estwing brand but really any hammer will do.

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Old 06-16-2012, 04:30 PM   #3
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


That's pretty bad, those hangers are not supporting the joist by much. Best solution would be to replace the joists with correct length ones, but verify first that the deck posts are still plumb, as the entire deck may have rotated out of plumb, taking the joists and the hangers for the ride. Assuming the deck is plumb on all sides, the logical conclusion would be that the joists were too short, but how anyone could have installed them with the hanger that far off the ledger is beyond me, even a complete fool would surely have noticed the problem and adjusted the length of the joists...

A reasonable option would be to leave the existing joists and hangers in place and install new joists between the old ones, of course cut to the correct length. It would be possible, though I do not recommend this, to shim out the hangers the correct amount using a wooden plate, leaving the joists in place. Likely more work than it is worth, compared to installing new joists and hangers. By the way, make sure you use the correct nails (the hanger manufacturer will tell you which ones to use) when installing new hangers. Simpson uses two different 10d hanger nails, there are the standard 3 inch long ones typically used diagonally on hangers, and the face frame 1-1/2 inch nails used when face nailing into 2x stock.
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Old 06-16-2012, 05:32 PM   #4
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


Thank you for the response. Everything on the deck looks to be plum from what I can tell. So this looks to be a much larger project than I hoped I am tempted to see if the home manufacturer would covert his under warranty because it looks like a poor job to me. There are not joist hangers used on the front of the deck as well (just resetting on the "support")

So in order to do this I will have to remove all my decking in the process.. any tips for removing nailed down decking and not ripping boards up?

Thanks again!

Kenny



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Originally Posted by Daniel Holzman View Post
That's pretty bad, those hangers are not supporting the joist by much. Best solution would be to replace the joists with correct length ones, but verify first that the deck posts are still plumb, as the entire deck may have rotated out of plumb, taking the joists and the hangers for the ride. Assuming the deck is plumb on all sides, the logical conclusion would be that the joists were too short, but how anyone could have installed them with the hanger that far off the ledger is beyond me, even a complete fool would surely have noticed the problem and adjusted the length of the joists...

A reasonable option would be to leave the existing joists and hangers in place and install new joists between the old ones, of course cut to the correct length. It would be possible, though I do not recommend this, to shim out the hangers the correct amount using a wooden plate, leaving the joists in place. Likely more work than it is worth, compared to installing new joists and hangers. By the way, make sure you use the correct nails (the hanger manufacturer will tell you which ones to use) when installing new hangers. Simpson uses two different 10d hanger nails, there are the standard 3 inch long ones typically used diagonally on hangers, and the face frame 1-1/2 inch nails used when face nailing into 2x stock.
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:48 PM   #5
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


i find this post to be interesting, as I am in the process of building a deck.

The joists on mine are supported by hangers nailed to a ledger board in exactly the same manner as yours.

First, I would not allow anyone on the deck with the hangers being in the state that they are in.
Your deck is very close to collapse.

I would suggest that water has collected and frozen between the end of the joist and the ledger board. Over the course of time, the gap increases and will eventually pull the ledger nails out.

I doubt the joist were originally cut too short. Its likely that your whole deck has been gradually pushed out. To push it back into its proper position would be difficult.
Pehaps a better solution would be to install another beam near the ledgerboard. I would support the beam with posts close to the building!

I'll be looking forward to reading comments from others on this problem.

I REPEAT DO NOT ALLOW ANYONE TO USE THIS DECK IN ITS PRESENT STATE!
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Old 06-17-2012, 09:09 PM   #6
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


The pictures are kind of blury.
Looks like where was no 8 D nails installed in the sides of the hangers that were made to be driven in at an angle to tie the joist to the ledger.
There also looks like there's missing holes for hanger nails on the sides of those hangers . There should be at least three holes per side for nails even if it was 2 X 6's.
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Old 06-17-2012, 09:28 PM   #7
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to me, if there is just one row of outer deck piers.. i would say the problem is that the deck posts have settled due to being installed on disturbed soil. could be confirmed by measuring the slope of your deck with a level and see if it is a lot more then it should be (which is just a bit for rain water to run away from house).

i don't know if this is allowable or a good idea .. but ...

how about sister joist connected to too short existing via zig-zag through bolt. then relocate existing hanger joist under the new sister joist instead. should be lots of room for the "wings" of the joist hanger due to too short existing.

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Old 06-17-2012, 09:59 PM   #8
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


Quote:
Originally Posted by akant View Post
Hey gang, we have a 10 year old deck which is original to the home. On the bottom of the deck the joist hangers appear to be coming off the ledger board. It has been this way since we purchased the home about 2 years ago (2nd owner) Please see the attached pictures. It looks like that a number of the joists may have been cut too short and thus the joist hangers were installed this way to allow attachement.

What would be the best method of repair here? I want to just remove the nails from the joist-hanger and then screw/re-nail the hanger into the ledger board but as the boards are not flush with the ledge Im not sure if will be able to firmly reattach the nails from the joist to the hanger. Do I need to replace the joist?

Do I have a severe safety issue?


Thank you for the time!! Photos attached..
Hi, There are a few things to check out from below the deck before deciding to take out any floor boards, it looks like the builder of the deck did not nail the joist hangers in the correct procedure so time has caused them to pull loose and fail. I think the hangers just need to be nailed correctly but first please read below.....

if it is safe for you to do so, please get up on a ladder and get a line of sight along the uppermost portion of the floor joist where the joist rests against the underside of the floor decking and where the top of the joist planes across to the ledger that's bolted to the house. are the joists in horizontal plane with the ledger or lower than the ledger?

Do you have pics of how the joists end at the outer beam away from the house ?

Last edited by hand drive; 06-17-2012 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 06-18-2012, 02:48 AM   #9
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


From your pictures it looks to me as if you may have more problems with this deck than you first imagined.

It looks like the masonry wall underneath is possibly just a veneer of brick? Is that right?

If so your installer is even more of an idiot than I am presently giving him credit for being.

Your railing doesn't look to be able to withstand anything close to 200 lbs. of lateral force either, difficult to see though from the pictures.

If the whole deck was twisting I would expect to see the deck slats spread apart somewhere but I do not, so that leads me to think that you installer is merely a hack that takes short-cuts at the home owners expense and hazard.

Are the deck joist 2x6? What is the span on those joists?

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Old 06-18-2012, 08:07 AM   #10
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


DO NOT SCREW THEM BACK IN. Most screws are NOT rated (in strength) for that type of use.
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Old 06-18-2012, 08:49 AM   #11
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I am betting they cut the joists too short. Can you get some measurements. Outside facia from the house, to the front fascia, inside at the left & right sides for those measurements, then measure each joist to see what length they are. Also, is this deck still square?
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Old 06-18-2012, 09:08 AM   #12
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Loose Deck Joist Hangers: Pictures


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It has been this way since we purchased the home about 2 years ago
Did you get an inspection when you bought the house? Did the inspector mention this if you did?
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Old 06-18-2012, 05:42 PM   #13
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Seen way too many of these in my line of work. Almost ALL decks here are only 12" to maybe 24" off the ground also, "belly-scrubbers" when you have to repair them. This IMO is NOT a DIY job, call in someone who really knows what they are doing. Not the guy who built the deck for sure.
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Old 06-18-2012, 11:28 PM   #14
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Could you just put a double thick ledger board underneath it?

EDIT: holly crap is that a veneer siding???

Last edited by lewisthepilgrim; 06-18-2012 at 11:32 PM.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:42 PM   #15
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OP silence - i think he sold his house

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