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Old 04-06-2007, 03:32 PM   #1
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DIYers and Professionals Can Work Together.


Some jobs are just too tough for the DIYer. Home Depot ads make you think you can build a marble shower enclosure and be done by dinner! Sometimes this can lead to a much more costly result!

I suggest, to cut costs, the DIYer sticks to demolition, trim work, painting, even the grout work. Let the pros do the setting, plumbing and electrical. In many cities, it is actually illegal to do your own structural, electrical and pluming renovations. Also, you would NEVER get your house insured!

http://www.wilbuildrenovation.com/Hints_and_Tips.html

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Old 04-07-2007, 07:25 AM   #2
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I agree with you but why are many cotractors relucktan or flat out refuse to work together.I bought a house a little over a year ago.I knew I needed to do a total renovation but wanted the kitchen done first since we are liveing here and the wife wanted it first. contacted several contractors and kitchen renovation places,some flat out refuse to talk about it if I was going to do some of the work.Two that did come out to look at it just never called back.I told them I was just planning on doing the demo and reframing the area the rest was all theirs and it is not like I have no knowledge of what I am doing but rater just didnt have the time with all the other work and what I do for a liveing Its a year later and I have ended up doing it myself since I could not get the cooperation I wanted ,its not done but comming along but still dont see what the problem was

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Old 04-07-2007, 08:11 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clasact View Post
I agree with you but why are many cotractors relucktan or flat out refuse to work together.I bought a house a little over a year ago.I knew I needed to do a total renovation but wanted the kitchen done first since we are liveing here and the wife wanted it first. contacted several contractors and kitchen renovation places,some flat out refuse to talk about it if I was going to do some of the work.Two that did come out to look at it just never called back.I told them I was just planning on doing the demo and reframing the area the rest was all theirs and it is not like I have no knowledge of what I am doing but rater just didnt have the time with all the other work and what I do for a liveing Its a year later and I have ended up doing it myself since I could not get the cooperation I wanted ,its not done but comming along but still dont see what the problem was
Clasact.

The reason why this is the case cover several areas.

Here are just a few:

1.) It is not profitable at all for general contractors to do jobs 'piecemeal'. You see, every time they have to 'mobilize' to go into a job, this costs them time and money. Thus, going into a job, setting up, working...then packing everything up and leaving.....then coming back 2+ weeks later to set up, inspect, get more materials, work.....then pack up and leave to come back again in several weeks = more expenses then being there to do several phases of the work - all at once.

2.) Most GC's prefer to do their own framing, their own cabinet installations, their own trim work, their own flooring, etc....or .... they may choose to hire a highly skilled and trusted subcontractor that they have used before.
Why?
Because some one else coming into, and doing a 'portion' or a 'phase' of the job...can damage or negatively effect their own work. Sub standard framing or other unskilled work can and usually do cause serious problems or issues down the road, when installing cabinets, flooring, trimwork, tile, windows, doors, etc...(It happens all the time)
It can change an entire scope, timeline and budget of the GC's job.

3.) It is a fact that Home Owners lack the experience gained from what contractors and GC's have spent years and years of learning about - by making our own dumb expensive mistakes.
Very often, the home owners involved in a 'hands-on' way, with a project that we are doing, causes problems.
Last addition we did, this happened in several areas; built in shelving issues, a custom trim work ordering issue, and improper installation of expanding foam insulation.
If they had not gotten involved (with their lack of experience) They would have saved so much money, because we had to back charge them to correct the wrong work....
Not to mention that the wrong work caused all kinds of 'rippling'. You see, It causes a domino effect into other scheduling, other connected work, and having to rip apart expensive materials, though them away, and start over.

This is a proven fact, that the lack of control on a project creates: confusion, causes misunderstandings and issues, it causes large delays, causes frustration, and most of all, it creates additional expenses that don't exist on 'do it all' type projects. All of this adds up to little or no profit. Believe it or not, it can OFTEN lead to actual profit loss for the contractor.

4.) Piecemeal work often is like being 'forced' to take on a business partner for a duration of time. My business partner and I have been doing work together for 22 years. The first several years doing business together were frustrating and rocky....
You can see where I am going with this....

These are a few reasons why General Contractors shy away from, or prefer to not get involved with such jobs. Don't take it personal. We are business men or women, trying to make good business decisions.....and we base it not on speculation, but on actual past experience events.

Your best option, is to hire out each area to a specific skilled subcontractor. He or she can make a normal profit to come in a do their work, as they would - if hired by the GC direct... (in effect - you be the General Contractor)

Don't get me wrong, we will often do work as hired subcontractors by Home Owners, ''if'' the scope of the work allows us to: go in, do the work, and pack up and leave....simple and complete...no problems, no issues, no delays, no getting stuck there...

I also feel strongly about home owners being involved (they should be) - in the planning, design, layouts, choices of material, decorating, etc - of their projects.

As per my posts on this forum...I am a supporter of DIYers. Many Home Owners are highly skilled in some areas...some even more skilled than some contractors.


I apologize if I ended up offending anyone, but the question was asked - and this is - some of what is going on on the 'other side of the fence'....

Last edited by AtlanticWBConst.; 04-07-2007 at 08:51 AM.
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Old 04-07-2007, 08:54 AM   #4
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Clasact,

Aside from all of that 'real world' information....

FWIW:
If I lived in your area, and you had contacted me. I know I would have done the work and helped you. As much as I try to 'wear' the business hat.....I have a weak spot for helping people out....

If there was anything that you were doing on your own, I would have simply said - call me if you have any questions or run into any problems....

Last edited by AtlanticWBConst.; 04-07-2007 at 08:59 AM.
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Old 04-07-2007, 10:08 AM   #5
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I understand completely and thank you for your honesty.I have read your posts many time and you give very sound advice.I think can speak for many of us on here when I say you have saved many of us from ourselves (lol) Like I said my large project is coming along pretty well although slower then my wife would have liked but she will have to live with it since we still have a long way to go and I am not home to work on it as often as I would like.I was a little put out when the contractors in my area would not work with me as I felt what part I wanted to do would not really inter fear with their part and the majority would have been done by them but to tell you the truth I am glad it turned out as it did.I am getting a lot of satisfaction from doing it myself and so far the only bad thing I have been told by inspectors or others (excluding my wife) is that I am over building but imo thats not such a bad thing
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Old 04-08-2007, 01:43 PM   #6
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Thank you AtlanticWBConst for that detailed post. Like you, I support the DIYer...that is why I suggest doing the demo...and trim/grout/painting/cleanup work. There projects come at the beginning and the end of the project allowing me to come in, finish my work and leave w/o coming back.

I would never allow a DIYer to frame, and neither should the DIYer b/c my warrenty and insurance would not help you if anything were to happen.

A GC that is not willing to work with the client %110 in a safe manner is not worth your dollar. Remember, you are the boss. vbmenu_register("postmenu_39926", true);

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