Concrete slab with hot water heat- Moving walls

skizsam · 02-17-2009, 09:37 AM

hello,

I'm in the design stages of renovating my bathroom and I need to move my closet around to make an entrance to the new bathroom.

My house is on concrete slab with hot water heating running in the cement. My issue/concern is if I move some interior walls, I will not be able to drill/screw into the concrete b/c the hot water pipes will be running below.

Below is a drawing I put together on what I am trying to do. Basically right where the closet doors are is a big warm spot on the floor.

Whats the best way to go about securing the base 2x4 to the concrete? I knwo figure 2 is the correct way to do this, but is figure 3 an option?

Comments appreciated

Wildie · 02-17-2009, 10:23 PM

If it were me, I'd glue a 2X4 plate to the concrete with construction adhesive. Then nail the bottom plate of the wall to this, rather than chance damaging the heating!

II Weeks · 02-17-2009, 10:53 PM

for your base, sole plate, you could use a 2X4 metal track (not stud) with construction adhesive and just a few small 1/4" shot nails or short screws. then slide in your wood 2X4 and continue to frame. This will help with separating the wood from concrete as well.

as far as the plumbing down there, it depends on who done it and at what stage. Those pipes could be as far down as 2" or as close as a 1/2". We pulled up a tile floor once and saw the pipe right under the tiles thin set.

Good luck

so what are you doing here plumbing wise? Is it a 36" wide bathroom? I would gut the existing walls and do the rough plumbing first before I would build the walls. You might have to move some of that radiant heating anyway.

II Weeks · 02-17-2009, 10:55 PM

.....

skizsam · 02-18-2009, 08:24 AM

Thanks II weeks, I will look into using a metal sole plate. But I think I'll still need to nail it down somewhere and liquid nails will not hold it down entirely.

As for the bathroom, I didn't show it in my drawing bt it will be behind the closet wall. that's why I am making the closet a sort of hallway/closet.

Basically, my existing bathroom has a large amount of unused space and It's big enough where I can divide it into 2. I'm sure I will have plenty of more posts when that time comes to discuss the bathroom.

jogr · 02-18-2009, 10:46 AM

You could crank up the heat and use one of the relatively inexpensive IR guns (maybe $40) to map out the radiant tube pattern on the floor. Draw the pattern right on the concrete with a marker as you go.

skizsam · 02-18-2009, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jogr

You could crank up the heat and use one of the relatively inexpensive IR guns (maybe $40) to map out the radiant tube pattern on the floor. Draw the pattern right on the concrete with a marker as you go.

Yup, I thought of that or even a metal detector!

II Weeks · 02-18-2009, 03:12 PM

Quote:

But I think I'll still need to nail it down somewhere and liquid nails will not hold it down entirely.

where did I mention not to nail it down? 1/2" shot nails are made for metal track or you could screw it down with 1 1/4" Tapcons

Wildie · 02-18-2009, 04:34 PM

<quote> II Weeks as far as the plumbing down there, it depends on who done it and at what stage. Those pipes could be as far down as 2" or as close as a 1/2". We pulled up a tile floor once and saw the pipe right under the tiles thin set.<unquote>

With knowing where the heating cable is, I wouldn't drill anywhere! Thats why I would glue wood down first!

Bondo · 02-18-2009, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildie

If it were me, I'd glue a 2X4 plate to the concrete with construction adhesive. Then nail the bottom plate of the wall to this, rather than chance damaging the heating!

Ayuh,...

With it being a no load wall,.. I'd think just Gluing it would be sufficient,...

Construction Adhesive gives a Much stronger bond than mortaring a row of cement bricks(figure #3),.....

skizsam · 02-26-2009, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bondo

Ayuh,...

With it being a no load wall,.. I'd think just Gluing it would be sufficient,...

Construction Adhesive gives a Much stronger bond than mortaring a row of cement bricks(figure #3),.....

OK, So it looks like I should use metal studs and glue with PL polyurethane construction adhesive.

I just hope this will secure the metal to concrete and more importanly meet code/instpection

skizsam · 03-17-2009, 10:50 AM

See pictures of my end result (or close to it).

I ended up using PL glue. By securing the wood framing to the walls and ceiling and the PL glue, everythign is rock solid. there was no need to drill into the concrete.

And yes, my layout slightly chaged as I only built one pocket door:

Closet gutted and pocket door entry cut:

Closet framing down:

Closet framing complete with temp drywall up. As you can I built 2 identical closets with an open hallway which will lead into the Master bathroom:

Sorry for the overall pic with no detail on how the walls are secure. If requested I can take pictures on how I secured the walls.

skizsam · 03-23-2009, 09:55 AM

For those keeping track on this thread...It's becoming more of a build thread:

Bondo · 03-23-2009, 05:44 PM

Ayuh,... Lookin' Good,...

Dave E · 03-23-2009, 08:48 PM

I stapled 6 mil poly to the bottom of a 2X6 plate, laid down a generous bead of PL adhesive, and built the wall in place. 2 x 6's because it separates a furnace/ERV room from a future bedroom and I want to fill it with insulation for sound. I know it's dependent on just some staples, but with a couple of 90 degree bends in there I defy anyone to move that wall. In the future I'll use the metal track, I just never thought of it. But no shots or screws necessary unless it's a long run no corners to stiffen it.
My floor is tubed for hot water. We put down 2" styrofoam, then 6 x 6 mesh, then laid out the tubing and poly-tied it to the mesh. I'd like to think it didn't float, but I simply won't risk shooting into the slab with just my fingers crossed. I also took a zillion photos, but still not confident I know exactly where everything is. I'd like to know more about that thermal imaging. Assuming the tubing is down, say, 3", how well does it show?
Dave in YYZ