DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum

DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum (http://www.diychatroom.com/)
-   Building & Construction (http://www.diychatroom.com/f19/)
-   -   Cemplank or Hardiplank installation question (http://www.diychatroom.com/f19/cemplank-hardiplank-installation-question-21971/)

prstlk 06-08-2008 09:06 AM

Cemplank or Hardiplank installation question
 
On a new house we are having built the builder has installed Cemplank siding (it was supposed to be Hardiplank but that is another thread issue).

Everything looks good except the joints of the product. They have caulked but many - actually most - of the joints have "broken" or cracked apart - meaning the caulk has not held - it has come apart.

I need to know if this is ok? Is this something that should have enough caulk that it remains intact without cracking apart? Is this going to leave a void for water to get into when having a wind driven rain?

What about the edges on the corners?
:icon_confused:

AtlanticWBConst. 06-08-2008 09:37 AM

The million dollar question is: What kind of caulking did they use?

We install flashing squares behind all seams, and only use polyurethane caulking, specifically made for fiber-cement board siding, on all the seams and edges..

prstlk 06-08-2008 09:44 AM

not sure what kind but
 
still wondering if the joints should be solid or apart?

If the joints are to be solid I will make sure they use the correct type of caulk...because they will have to redo the caulking! If not then I will ask...

AtlanticWBConst. 06-08-2008 09:51 AM

Here's the link page for Hardieplank installation instructions. All fiber-cement-board should be installed similarly:

http://www.jameshardie.com/homeowner...Tab=jsnavLink4

prstlk 06-08-2008 10:05 AM

went there
 
and still had no answer to my question thus why I posted here...

it shows leaving a gap then caulking and talks about using caulk according to mfgs guidelines, and so on but...

it still does not answer the root question I have - are the joints supposed to be solid or seperated, cracked apart, not attached to the plank beside it - by the caulk?

AtlanticWBConst. 06-08-2008 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prstlk (Post 128697)
it shows leaving a gap then caulking and talks about using caulk according to mfgs guidelines, and so on but...

I believe you are mistaken. It does not show leaving a gap. It shows nail placement at 3/8" from the edge/end of the board's seams.

In fact, look at page one, diagram on the left.
The wording says clearly: "Install planks in moderate contact". See what this means below.
Cemplank installation Link (Same as Hardieplank): http://www.cemplank.com/install_plank.pdf

Quote:

Originally Posted by prstlk (Post 128697)
it still does not answer the root question I have - are the joints supposed to be solid or seperated, cracked apart, not attached to the plank beside it - by the caulk?

The problem with your question, is that it did not make grammatical sense, and was thus confusing. There is no such concept as a "solid joint". A joint is a seam.
If you are trying to ask: "Do I butt my siding plank ends tight at the seams, or do I leave a gap?" Then, the answer is; you butt the ends "in contact with each-other" at the seams (seam ends). The general practice is to install the siding, so as to not allow any water infiltration, so the seams are butted together without a gap. They are also caulked according to manufacturer's specs. The ends/corners, should also be caulked.
As far as caulking goes, I saw on Cemplank's installation instructions, they advise the use of a siliconized latex (paintable) caulk.

The term "Moderate Contact" is used by the manufacturer, to imply that you want the seams meeting, but you DO NOT want them so tight, that there is no room for minimal expansion. So the procedure is to install so that the ends are "touching eachother".

Reasons why caulking might crack shortly after the initial siding installation:
1.) Boards were damp, and contained moisture prior to installation, were caulked, and slightly contracted pulling caulking apart.
2.) Wrong kind of caulking used.
3.) Caulking applied at improper temperature, or weather conditions.
4.) Board ends were not securely fastened, boards had conditional movement, and caulking seperated.
5.) etc (other reasons not listed)....

prstlk 06-08-2008 03:09 PM

Sorry for confusion but
 
:huh:I'm not a builder here...I'm just a homeowner trying to find out if we need to have the siding company come out and do something to the joints between the planks of the siding. We have a final walk through scheduled for Tuesday and this is one issue I want to know something about so they don't just tell me that is the way it is supposed to be.

They were originally caulked and now the caulk beads have all cracked apart. I have no idea why this has happened. It is my gut feeling that they should not be this way but I wanted to check before our walk-through.

After the mistake was made by the builder and the wrong siding was put on in the first place I question whether it is installed correctly.:confused1:

Bud Cline 06-08-2008 04:29 PM

Those cement siding products come to the job naturally dusty. Caulking over dust wouldn't be a good thing. I'm wondering if siding applicators even address this issue when installing siding.

I would also check to see what caulk is recommended by the manufacturer and what caulk was used on the job. It isn't unusual for a manufacturer to specify a quality caulk to be used with their product and have the builder/installer buy the cheapest product available as a substitute. If this is the case, where you quoted for the higher priced caulk?

I would also be curious to know the variance in cost of the two siding products. Hardie is a quality product with a good reputation, I wonder if this is the case with the product that was substituted. Do you have a credit coming because the product used cost less than the product specified?:)

just some questions that come to mind.

buletbob 06-08-2008 04:34 PM

Explain to the contractor that the caulking all cracked. if he gives you a story hold back the final payment until the problem is corrected.
If they are a reputable company they will agree and fix the problem.
You stated they all ready supplied the wrong manufacture, this should of been discussed with you pryer to the install.

molarsmile 06-09-2008 02:24 AM

cemplank/hardiplank
 
Does anyone know the exact difference between the 2 kinds of sidings?
Our builder initially promised for hardiplank for our newly constructed house with a 50 yr warranty but what we are getting is Cemplank with 25 yr of warranty! Looks like we are in the same boat as Prstlk!
Our closing is soon....this week itself...Any advice will be appreciated!
Thanks


Quote:

Originally Posted by prstlk (Post 128690)
On a new house we are having built the builder has installed Cemplank siding (it was supposed to be Hardiplank but that is another thread issue).

Everything looks good except the joints of the product. They have caulked but many - actually most - of the joints have "broken" or cracked apart - meaning the caulk has not held - it has come apart.

I need to know if this is ok? Is this something that should have enough caulk that it remains intact without cracking apart? Is this going to leave a void for water to get into when having a wind driven rain?

What about the edges on the corners?
:icon_confused:


AtlanticWBConst. 06-09-2008 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molarsmile (Post 128877)
Does anyone know the exact difference between the 2 kinds of sidings?
Our builder initially promised for hardiplank for our newly constructed house with a 50 yr warranty but what we are getting is Cemplank with 25 yr of warranty! Looks like we are in the same boat as Prstlk!
Our closing is soon....this week itself...Any advice will be appreciated!
Thanks

From what I understand, they are one in the same.

JamesHardie has owned Cemplank since 2001: http://www.cemplank.com/new-011212.shtml

Cemplank is run as a separate division of James Hardie (a James Hardie subsidiary).

prstlk 06-09-2008 09:47 AM

Hardi vs Cem
 
When we were first told about the "accidental" placement of the wrong stuff on the house they offered a $400 credit towards our closing costs for the mistake. Thinking this was not enough I called around to 3 different builders supply companies in our area and found that this was the approximate difference in the cost between the 2 products. We agreed to the credit. Like stated by AtlanticWBConstr it seems that Hardi Products bought Cem Products about 5 years ago and they are all made by Hardi Products now.

I would love to know where molarsmile is located as well!

I still am not clear on the caulking and joint issue so I will try to find a telephone number to call today about it.

Termite 06-09-2008 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prstlk (Post 128907)
I still am not clear on the caulking and joint issue so I will try to find a telephone number to call today about it.

I read every post on this thread and I still don't think I understand the description of the problem.

You say the joints have broken or cracked apart. Do you mean that they have separated and the caulk didn't bridge the gap? The caulk has somehow released or cracked?

Or, did the siding material itself somehow fail, crumble, or crack at the joint location? This would certainly cause the caulk to have problems.

Fiber cement siding is very dimensionally stable, and in most cases it shouldn't shrink after installation. Being cement-based, it can expand and contract, but I doubt that it would do that to the extent that the joints would separate. Structural issues with the home such as settlement would certainly cause joints to separate.

prstlk 06-09-2008 11:49 AM

Yes yes yes finally someone understands!
 
You say the joints have broken or cracked apart. Do you mean that they have separated and the caulk didn't bridge the gap? The caulk has somehow released or cracked?

Yes - this is exactly what I mean...

AtlanticWBConst. 06-09-2008 07:10 PM

I would still advise using a paintable polyurethane caulk on fiber-cement siding.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:56 AM.


Copyright 2003-2014 Escalate Media LP. All Rights Reserved