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Old 07-07-2014, 01:27 PM   #1
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Box header, code compliant?


Waiting on a call back from building dept... could be days. Does anyone know if a box header like the one pictured would be code compliant? 2012 IRC...

Box header, code compliant?-forumrunner_20140707_142646.jpg

Note: Application is for window and door headers. Max span would be 3'-4". 2x members are 2x10 SYP.


Last edited by Pittsville; 07-07-2014 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 07-07-2014, 05:44 PM   #2
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Box header, code compliant?


How do you insulate the inside?? Ron

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Old 07-07-2014, 06:12 PM   #3
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Box header, code compliant?


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How do you insulate the inside?? Ron
You insulate the cavity before the top "plate" gets nailed on.
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Old 07-07-2014, 06:20 PM   #4
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Box header, code compliant?


I would doubt it is prescrptively permitted.... depending on its application, a BO may say fine.....or if structurally questionable, may want a wet stamp... or depending on your jurisdiction, maybe the BD eng will OK.

I don't know of any restriction to a box header in itself per se.... but I honestly can't think of any issue I've used one....you don't want to just lam it all the way up......

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Old 07-07-2014, 06:23 PM   #5
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Box header, code compliant?


Bearing or non bearing. For ex, project I am working on now has two bye six walls and calls for all first floor door and window headers to be triple two bye ten with plywood spacers. So it can depend on what your architect specs out. (As an aside, I am still figuring how to get the double 1 3/4 inch 24' lvl that goes over the front garage door into place! Sucker is heavy!! ) ron
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Old 07-07-2014, 06:36 PM   #6
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Box header, code compliant?


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. (As an aside, I am still figuring how to get the double 1 3/4 inch 24' lvl that goes over the front garage door into place! Sucker is heavy!! ) ron
Oh Boy Ront... I feel for you...

My son and I fought that issue a while back on his addition....(no boom/limited budget).

Some makeshift headers/rigging, 2 chain hoists and one farm jack, a bunch of SOUTHERN ENGINEERING.....a good escape route.... but we are both still alive.

My advice next time.... get a boom

Good luck
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Old 07-07-2014, 08:16 PM   #7
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Box header, code compliant?


it depends entirely on what your local building authority accepts, some places will accept it. others wont even consider it
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Old 07-07-2014, 08:36 PM   #8
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Box header, code compliant?


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it depends entirely on what your local building authority accepts, some places will accept it. others wont even consider it
Interesting part is that the IRC provides for single member headers. The box beam/header satisfies the single member requirement and then goes beyond that. If anything, it's over built, which should be a good thing. Oh well, have to wait and hear back from the BO.

On a side note, I've always wondered how a single member or even double member header is structurally sound. Only a portion of the studs above are supported by the header. For example, you have a double 2x header in a 2x6 wall. Only 3" of the 2x6 studs and plates from the second floor are supported. The remaining 2.5" is "floating" over nothing. Seems like a lateral force applied perpendicular to the header would cause a failure much easier then if the studs were fully supported. (Say with a 5.5" header) Maybe I'm missing something.
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Old 07-07-2014, 08:55 PM   #9
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Box header, code compliant?


Pitt.... Conceptually, I bet it is weaker and less structurally sound as you question/observe.... by how much, and if below code minimum requirements, apparently not.

It's a questiion for an eng as to the caqlcs... and I'm not even sure if the limiting factor is compression or lateral forces.....

Way over my head.... especially if we are talking second story
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Old 07-07-2014, 09:00 PM   #10
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Box header, code compliant?


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Originally Posted by Pittsville View Post
Waiting on a call back from building dept... could be days. Does anyone know if a box header like the one pictured would be code compliant? 2012 IRC...

Attachment 86976

Note: Application is for window and door headers. Max span would be 3'-4". 2x members are 2x10 SYP.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTN REMODEL LLC View Post
I would doubt it is prescrptively permitted.... depending on its application, a BO may say fine.....or if structurally questionable, may want a wet stamp... or depending on your jurisdiction, maybe the BD eng will OK.

I don't know of any restriction to a box header in itself per se.... but I honestly can't think of any issue I've used one....you don't want to just lam it all the way up......

Best
I never saw your bolded dimensions under the picture, in my earlier response that I thought it would not be prescriptively fine.

With caveat that I have no eng background, I would be very surprized if the BD raised any issue... and if they did, I would sure appreciate to know/learn why

Best
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Old 07-07-2014, 09:46 PM   #11
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Box header, code compliant?


Certainly want to run it by your local code officials but it seems like it should be fine. For a span that small a normal header would only be double 2x8s sincere timbers are larger it seems like it should be fine.
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Old 07-07-2014, 11:54 PM   #12
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Box header, code compliant?


Quote:
Originally Posted by MTN REMODEL LLC View Post
Oh Boy Ront... I feel for you...

My son and I fought that issue a while back on his addition....(no boom/limited budget).

Some makeshift headers/rigging, 2 chain hoists and one farm jack, a bunch of SOUTHERN ENGINEERING.....a good escape route.... but we are both still alive.

My advice next time.... get a boom

Good luck
I raised a 5x16x20' PSL by myself using come-alongs.....took longer to setup than actually raise...

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Old 07-07-2014, 11:57 PM   #13
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Box header, code compliant?


To the OP....3-4' span would be 4x4 or 4x6 at most....doing a box header using 2x12 or 2x14 would actually be stronger. Toss in some insulation in the cavity and you can reduce the thermal bridging compared to solid lumber.
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Old 07-08-2014, 12:13 AM   #14
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Box header, code compliant?


Found a pic....not a great pic but sort of shows the header above some existing windows.

Look at the top and you will see the 2x14.
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Box header, code compliant?-img-20120927-00202.jpg  
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Old 07-19-2014, 12:39 AM   #15
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Box header, code compliant?


Ok... so I've yet to hear back from the building department. (Things don't happen very fast around here) After uncovering more of the framing, I'm wondering if a header is even necessary now.

The wall in question is post-and-beam construction. There's an original true size 4x8 beam that sits atop the first floor wall studs. The second floor studs then rest atop this beam. There are true 4x4 posts on either side of the window openings. The second floor window opening is positioned exactly over top of the first floor opening. (4x4 posts line up) The window openings are 35" wide. The house (and it's windows) have been fine for over 130 years. I feel now that the existing 4x8 beam above the first floor window opening should be sufficient as a header. What do you all think?

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