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Old 10-12-2008, 10:12 PM   #16
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


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Originally Posted by RolandOG View Post
I think it was both, 4just1don. The joists are just kinda thrown up there, somewhere around 16" oc, except where they're 24" oc. Some are twisted, some are crown up, some are crown down.

The funny thing is, the rest of the house is very well built. We've had pro contractors out to the house say as much. Anyway, it appears when they built the garage they used the dregs of the lumber they had left.

Buletbob,

This was a garage until about 3 months ago. What's a strong back? Is this a joist running perp. to the ceiling joists to force them down? Some sort of brace tied to the rafters above to force them down? I'm not familiar with that term.

EDIT: a quick search answers the strong back question. That may be a possible solution but the house has a hip roof and no gable to tie into at the ends. One end is at the roof edge and the other is at the center of the house so there's nothing to tie into.
RolandOG,

Since you are a seasoned poster 27+ and as Buletbob has not had the opportunity to respond Please allow me to try explain with my very limited ability.

Cat walk... rat run.. Strong back... might be colloquial expressions or nomenclature for the same thing. 2 X's nailed in an L shape running perpendicular to and on top of the Ceiling joist (collar ties for Wilde). In hurricane country we install 2' off each the wall and 4' oc.

Yes, the older the garage the less the care in it's construction. ( Horses would make a comeback). Your living space may have received the above or cross bracing (more common on floor joists) or blocking. These good techniques help keep the joists from twisting, sagging, warping, wind load resistance, etc... . Most older garage ceilings would be very lucky to have received any attention framing wise other than required (collar tie framing).

You have not posted any pics,,, so from the info you have posted you have 2x6 joist (collar ties) running wall to wall under a hip roof of undisclosed span... that do not present a flat ceiling plane. You want to install a drywall ceiling that is nice and flat ( and I assume trouble free).

The answer to your situation may be complex depending on your conditions. Your joists (collar ties) may be too "set in there ways" to allow any help from above. If pictures are not an option then I suggest a set of old all knowing eyes take a peak at your particular situation and advise the best easy fix.

The proper solution will depend on the results you want and are willing to pay for.

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Old 10-13-2008, 12:44 PM   #17
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


Big Bob,

Thanks for the detailed info. You hit it on the head with a number of comments.

I installed a strong back across the joists and while it didnít get everything level it did line up a number of the joists and reduce the shimming considerably. It still took a LOT of shimming, though. What should have been a couple hour job took all day. I got 75% of the ceiling strapped and a spot-check with an 8' straight edge shows that it's pretty flat. Definitely within an 1/8" and in most cases dead flat. Did I mention a LOT of shimming?

Wildie, I'm using 3" x .131 ring shank nails in my framing nailer. There's no way I'm swinging a hammer over my head all day long. Plus, there's no way in hell those nails are coming out.

BTW, these 2x6 joists/collar ties are spanning 12'-8" with no bridging. I can post pics but I think I've got it solved now.

This site is a great help to those of us who know some but not enough about construction techniques. Thanks to all of you who take the time to help us DIYírs out.
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:52 PM   #18
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


Within 1/8" is better than most new construction I come across...........well done!
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Old 10-13-2008, 02:20 PM   #19
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


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Within 1/8" is better than most new construction I come across...........well done!
Really? I figured 1/8Ē or less was the norm. I wish I didnít have to shim so many joists but Iím definitely feeling better now after reading that.
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Old 10-13-2008, 02:35 PM   #20
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


I think you'll be glad you did. If it were my own personal home, I'd try for that kind of perfection. I play the cards I'm dealt on the job. Up to 1/2" discrepancy is not uncommon. If there are just a couple of joists/studs crowned the wrong way, (worse than 1/2") I'll fix them. If it's many, it's time to renegotiate the price or call the framer back.
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Old 10-13-2008, 07:28 PM   #21
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Best way to flatten/level existing ceiling framing?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Bob View Post
RolandOG,

Since you are a seasoned poster 27+ and as Buletbob has not had the opportunity to respond Please allow me to try explain with my very limited ability.

Cat walk... rat run.. Strong back... might be colloquial expressions or nomenclature for the same thing. 2 X's nailed in an L shape running perpendicular to and on top of the Ceiling joist (collar ties for Wilde). In hurricane country we install 2' off each the wall and 4' oc.

Yes, the older the garage the less the care in it's construction. ( Horses would make a comeback). Your living space may have received the above or cross bracing (more common on floor joists) or blocking. These good techniques help keep the joists from twisting, sagging, warping, wind load resistance, etc... . Most older garage ceilings would be very lucky to have received any attention framing wise other than required (collar tie framing).

You have not posted any pics,,, so from the info you have posted you have 2x6 joist (collar ties) running wall to wall under a hip roof of undisclosed span... that do not present a flat ceiling plane. You want to install a drywall ceiling that is nice and flat ( and I assume trouble free).

The answer to your situation may be complex depending on your conditions. Your joists (collar ties) may be too "set in there ways" to allow any help from above. If pictures are not an option then I suggest a set of old all knowing eyes take a peak at your particular situation and advise the best easy fix.

The proper solution will depend on the results you want and are willing to pay for.

Roland sorry for not responding right away,I am having problems with the site not sending all the responses from some posts, And thanks BIG BOB that was exactly what I was suggesting. if this practice was done at time of construction you would of not had to shim as much, but its good you brought everything back in plain. BOB

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