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Old 07-11-2012, 07:17 PM   #1
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Beam for Deck


Greetings,
I am building a deck under a covered roof (picture attatched) and am wanting to cantilever it out a bit. I am wondering if it is ok to lag bolt the beam to the two 6x6 posts that are holding up the roof or if I should build a seperate beam. Also any recomendation on beam and joist size for the span I have (9ft) if I attatch it to the current posts would be greatly appriciated.
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Old 07-11-2012, 08:15 PM   #2
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Beam for Deck


Do you need to get permits?
If you do that will determine a lot.

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Old 07-11-2012, 08:37 PM   #3
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Beam for Deck


You say you want to cantilever it. How far past the house would you like to go?
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:40 PM   #4
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Beam for Deck


Brett,

attached is the Prescriptive Residential Deck Construction Guide for the 2009 International Residential Code. It has tables that you can look up the size beam you'd need based upon span and tributary load. http://www.awc.org/Publications/DCA/DCA6/DCA6-09.pdf The tables provides beam spans for various species of wood. Make sure to select preservative treated or naturally durable wood such as western cedar or redwood.

You would need to notch your 6x6 for your beam or use a metal connector or even a cleat nailed onto the column that extends down to your concrete foundation for the beam to bear upon, lag screws or through bolts are not a proper means of attaching a beam to a wood column. I know it's done all the time, but read through the guide and you'll see for yourself. When doing this the load is supported by the area of the bolt passing through the column. Too much weight per square inch crushes the wood fibers in the column thus your beam and bolt tend to go down over time as the column's wood fibers are crushed further. The Guide will provide details on proper framing.

Good luck!
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:25 PM   #5
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Beam for Deck


Looks like you will need to add a footing by the house also.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:32 PM   #6
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Beam for Deck


Use a beam hanger from simpson strong tie and hang the beam between the posts, you'll need to confirm that the hanger, piers and connections can handle the load applied by your design. Personally the piers look undersized to me unless they're wider underground.
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Old 07-11-2012, 11:53 PM   #7
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Beam for Deck


I concered with the way you attached that ledger to the house.

Sure looks like you can see a band under it of something that looks like the same color of the siding. It looks like you just attached it over the siding.
It could just be the way it looks in the picture.

It also looks like someone has already reinstalled the siding and used a piece of J molding tight againt the ledger board. How do you plan on installing the decking with the siding in the way?

It also looks like you used 2 X 6's, 2 X 8's would have been much better.

I'd skip the cantilever, reason being mark my words at some point your going to want to enclose that deck and add onto it because your going to find it's to small. Eather way enclose it or add onto it that cantilever will end up being in the way.
It's best to keep the deck under the roof line so you can add a wall there later on.
Just going by 30 years of seeing this over and over, no no we just want an open deck, first night someone tryes to sit on the deck after dark and the bugs roll in there minds change and the phone rings.
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:12 AM   #8
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Beam for Deck


Come on joe ! It's under a covered roof! Sure hard wind with rain can get there, but it is a step up from what we're used to seeing. I say its a 2x8 ledger, and of course the 6x6 are new which I found funny. But come on, the guy has 9' to the house, a 2x8 joist is adequate.. Hence me asking how far he want's to cantilever it. If it were my deck I would keep it flush as well. A lot less work and a lot stronger tieing in hand rail to a post to the roof. I like this project. I'm just glad he didn't start building ALL of the deck before asking questions.
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:04 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBrackins View Post
Brett,

attached is the Prescriptive Residential Deck Construction Guide for the 2009 International Residential Code. It has tables that you can look up the size beam you'd need based upon span and tributary load. http://www.awc.org/Publications/DCA/DCA6/DCA6-09.pdf The tables provides beam spans for various species of wood. Make sure to select preservative treated or naturally durable wood such as western cedar or redwood.

You would need to notch your 6x6 for your beam or use a metal connector or even a cleat nailed onto the column that extends down to your concrete foundation for the beam to bear upon, lag screws or through bolts are not a proper means of attaching a beam to a wood column. I know it's done all the time, but read through the guide and you'll see for yourself. When doing this the load is supported by the area of the bolt passing through the column. Too much weight per square inch crushes the wood fibers in the column thus your beam and bolt tend to go down over time as the column's wood fibers are crushed further. The Guide will provide details on proper framing.

Good luck!
Good to know.

I have been designing decks using carriage blots a the connections for years. What I would have done in this case is put a 2X on either side of the column and lagged all the way through and then put the joists right over the top.

What you said makes sense, but with 4x4 posts notching the column for the beam is going to effect the column moments at that location due to reduced cross sectional area.

How is that addressed?
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:34 AM   #10
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Beam for Deck


There 6 X 6's not 4 X 4's.
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:42 AM   #11
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There 6 X 6's not 4 X 4's.
Gotcha. Still, if you have a 2X beam cutting into a 6X6 which is 5.5" thick, you are basically removing over 1/4 of its cross sectional area. That's significant and surely effects the columns moments at that location.
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:18 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcarlilesiu View Post
Good to know.

I have been designing decks using carriage blots a the connections for years. What I would have done in this case is put a 2X on either side of the column and lagged all the way through and then put the joists right over the top.

What you said makes sense, but with 4x4 posts notching the column for the beam is going to effect the column moments at that location due to reduced cross sectional area.

How is that addressed?
use a 6x6 to start with, notch out 1-1/2" (code requires minimum 1-1/2" bearing) will still leave you 4" solid post. many different ways to accomplish
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:41 AM   #13
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Beam for Deck


Instead of notching add 2 - 2x4 or 2x6 under the beam on the side of the post.
Especially if it is to be covered in and won't be seen.
Notching creates a way for the post to possibly crack, although usually no big deal.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:03 AM   #14
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Beam for Deck


I can't imagine you're "allowed" to notch those existing posts. Maybe research hangers9and the loads they'll hold) like someone above suggested.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:26 PM   #15
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Beam for Deck


Quote:
Originally Posted by jcarlilesiu View Post
Good to know.

I have been designing decks using carriage blots a the connections for years. What I would have done in this case is put a 2X on either side of the column and lagged all the way through and then put the joists right over the top.

What you said makes sense, but with 4x4 posts notching the column for the beam is going to effect the column moments at that location due to reduced cross sectional area.

How is that addressed?
You need to checkout page 8 of Prescriptive Residential Deck Construction Guide for the 2009 International Residential Code. There are many discussions on this forum on why this is bad.

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