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Old 08-18-2010, 08:11 AM   #1
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Basement construction project


I just started my first major build out of our basement this week. Already running into some first timer questions. I just got the XPS foam up Monday, glued it with glue that was appropraite for concrete to foamboard contact, that dried now for about 24 hours. Taped all the seams with "house wrap tape" aka Tyvek tape... so have a nice seal between the foam boards... went around with low expansion foam and filled around all the pipe penetrations in the foam board and at the top the foam board went 1/2" above the concrete then there was about 1/2" from there until it hit the sill plate so I filled that gap also with expanding foam so now I have a continuious barrier from the sill plate all the way to the floor and thats where it stops... and my questions start


There is obviously a gap between the slab and the bottom of the foam board, its about 1/16". should I caulk this with silicon caulk? or after I get the PT bottom plate in should I spray foam the gap between the wood and the board since there will be a slight space between the joists and the foam board for "air circulation".

Second question is about putting down the bottom plate for the starting of framing.... I know most people say build it on the floor and raise it... but I had a hard enough time getting 8x4 foam panels raised into place with all the stuff in the ceiling, I want to just frame it out in place.. what is the best way to do this? Here's my plan for attaching the bottom PT plate so far...


1) Measure from wall to end where PT board will be the interior wall of the new room. do this along the wall, then use a chalk line to make a straight line along this, the distance includes the "gap" between the wood and the foam board for air space.

2) use the 3/4/5 and 6/8/10 methods to check for square at the corners

3) lay out the PT bottom plate, mark where I expect the studs to be 16" OC and figure out where to anchor this to the floor inbetween the studs so the screws wont get in the way

4) Drill with a standard drill bit, 1/4" pilot holes in the PT plate and push some into the concrete to mark it where the holes are, then use the tapcon concrete bit to drill the remaining depth needed (plus 1/2" i think it was extra) for the screws, screws spaced out 3 ft from each other the length of the wall

5) Lay down sill gasket foam the length of the PT board on the concrete, set the board on it, and use the tapcon screws to screw the board down

at this point I run into the what next question, I know I need a top plate, but how do you ensure you have it in the right spot? I've seen people hold it up and use a 2x4 plus a level to measure from the floor up on the outside of the bottom plate and I've seen the plumbbob method but not sure really how to do either of those without error, and videos or instructions on this that I could read / watch before I get to that point?

the rest of the framing I have a good handle on, its just the top and bottom plates that will be my fun....

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Old 08-19-2010, 07:25 AM   #2
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Basement construction project


alright have my first framing issue... I have drain pipes that go from the slab to the ceiling in the basement two of them in the room I'm working on right now on different walls...

the PVC pipes are 3" and has a Y at the top where it branches out and a Y at the bottom for a cleanout plug its almost against the concrete wall, its about 1/4" from the wall... I'd like to hide this without building a column structure around it so the wall is as flat as possible except the little door to get to the cleanout... here's what I've done so far


3/4" XPS foam on the wall then hald an inch gap for air space then a 2x4 sill plate... it seems like I will clear this with about 1/4" left I dont want to build it out to far and waste space in the room. would this be good enough? how exactly do you measure how far a pipe is from the wall? would you put a level on it find the highest point then measure to the level?


the other question is I have this same wall running parallel with the joists... the joist I'd put my top plate onto is almost perfectly center with where the top plate would go (parallel) do I just screw the center of the top plate to the joist and skip the blocking or should I put blocking in to the next joist even though it would have little room for the 2x4 plate to touch?

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Old 08-22-2010, 02:18 PM   #3
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Basement construction project


Well I found out that a laser with a level in it is my best friend... used it to find the highest point on all my PVC pipes to determin the distance the walls would need to be out from the wall to frame it in a way that would cover the pipe up flushly with a little bit of space to spare...

as for the parts where the pipe runs horozontally down the wall... I built up a standard 16" OC wall to about 2" from the 3" PVC pipe then built the top part the same way and anchored it to the ceiling joists with 3" drywall screws to hold it in place until I could get it where I want it... used three screws that I could loosen and tighten as I moved the top into plumb with the bottom always had one screw as a pivot point to hold the top wall up (its about 20 inches high at the top with the top and bottom plates on it so it wasnt too heavy to hold with one hand and a pivot screw... after I got it in place I attached temporary brackets made out of 2x4 to the ends that furred it out to plumb so it would be held in place while I installed brackets to attach it to the wall

first I put on 12" metal braces from each stud over the pipe down to the other wall.. this helped to stiffen up the wall by making a metal connection on each stud to the other end of the wall, it also helps when I go to drywall so I dont screw into the PVC pipe, the metal brace should help as a screw preventer like they use for wire locations in studs... the brace is about 1/16" thick so it shouldnt push out the drywall much where it is going over... after that was in, I cut out some XPS foam on the cinder block wall the size of an L bracket where I wanted to place them to hold the "floating" walls in place... I have them secured on the top and bottom of the room but the center has no real support right now, so the L bracket from the studs to the wall is the best way to go it seems... I took the bracket found the best locations for them on each corner of the 2 parts of the walls... marked the drill holes and drille them out with TapCon concrete bits, then anchored them with ~2" tapcon screws then screwed the other end to the studs... after that I filled the void in the XPS with low expansion foam and it is sealed up again and the wall feels solid as the other complete wood frame walls...

more obsticles and framing to come, pictures to come soon also!
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Old 08-23-2010, 10:16 PM   #4
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Basement construction project


Sounds good so far to me. Pictures are worth a thousand words, post some up when you get a chance.

THanks.
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Old 08-23-2010, 11:15 PM   #5
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Air space is required to be fire-stopped every 10' lineally and at the top, continuously from the wood- over the foam- to the wood. http://www.codecheck.com/cc/images/CC5thEdSample.pdf
Also, you will negate the batt insulation in the new wall with an air space convective loop: http://oikos.com/library/insulating_...lls/index.html
http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...archterm=insul

Be safe, Gary
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Old 08-24-2010, 02:26 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
Air space is required to be fire-stopped every 10' lineally and at the top, continuously from the wood- over the foam- to the wood. http://www.codecheck.com/cc/images/CC5thEdSample.pdf
Also, you will negate the batt insulation in the new wall with an air space convective loop: http://oikos.com/library/insulating_...lls/index.html
http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...archterm=insul

Be safe, Gary

I've read some places that unfaced fiberglass insulation counts as a fireblock on the top, is this true? our local code doesn't require it amazingly at the top
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Old 08-24-2010, 09:17 PM   #7
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pp. #4- Fire-blocking: http://www.codecheck.com/cc/images/CC5thEdSample.pdf

Be safe, Gary
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:32 AM   #8
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Basement construction project


well got some more framing done last night... this little each day thing works out relatively well... only thing I've hated so far is getting the bottom pressure treated plate straight over long lengths and square in corners, because I dont think the original builders made the one wall they did put in that room straight to start with so measuring from that wall at different point gets me slightly different measurments... and the outside cinder block wall has a slight curve to it, so in some places it looks like my inch off the wall framing is closer or farther away... plays with your mind when you look at it but when I check plumb on all the studs they all come within the two black lines on the level on front and side and the laser level shows the boards are straight down the wall...

ran into a problem last night im going to have to account for though ugh... the Pressure reduction valve for the water line is on the ceiling and hear the wall... right now it would have to have studs go through it to frame the wall... so I am going to have to move it somewhere else, prefereably closer to the water meter because I am going to build an access closet around that to hide it, might as well have that there too
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Old 09-03-2010, 07:12 AM   #9
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Basement construction project


things have definalty slowed down now.... ran into some problems... have to move a water line thats in the wall of one wall being framed, move some HVAC lines, few other random things... but did get one room completely framed, insulated, elecrical wired, put access panels in where the drain cleanouts are... last night got a soffit built around an I beam, drywall is going up in that room... a lot slower process now especially carrying 50 sheets of drywall down stairs that is littearly just big enough to fit a sheet only if you move it in the right angle and turn it just right as you go down, you get about 1/8th of an inch to spare so that has been a process... only got 11 sheets of the 50 down so far... and used 10 of the 11 sheets up and still have more to go in this room.. hoping to get the outside framing 100% complete this weekend and start some more interior rooms... definatly time consuming but kinda fun
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Old 11-30-2010, 01:19 PM   #10
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Basement construction project


well after about a month of trying to find the perfect stain color... what fun that was! I am moving ahead on construction again... I need to get some pics up, but found out how much fun a router can be

made my first attempt this weekend to make a window sill and apron for a basement window that sticks out 1 inch past the wall, with a nice roman ogee routing on it.

made some big purchases in the tool area, with the new router, a table saw, random orbital sander...

and unfortinautly broke my jig saw when trying to tilt the bottom plate on it to 45 degrees ugh.... time to buy a new one... not sure why but it locked in place and when i tried to unlock it, it bent a metal lock and a pin snapped in it... guess I was trying a little to hard
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Old 11-30-2010, 04:05 PM   #11
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Sounds like you're having fun, Blue!
This comes too late for you, but for studded basement walls that go perpendicular to the joists, I set a pt2x4 on the floor and shoot it in place. Then I do the same with a reg 2x4 on the underside of the joists. This allows me to then build a studded wall that I can actually raise to a vertical position and slip in between the installed plates. I even cut the studs shorter so that the wall slips in easily, and then shim between the two top plates. You use a little more lumber this way but it's worth it.

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