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Old 04-10-2012, 11:40 PM   #1
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Hello, I'm building a wrap around porch. Due to ground clearance I have a flush beam (3 2X10) around the perimeter of the floor and then I have Joist (8 feet - 2X10 - 12 inch centers). I now need to get a roof on this thing. I'm going to install 8X8 columns for the look - not for the strength as it's not close to needed. I could use a 6 X 6 and trim out to the 8 inches or I could use a 8 inch post.

My problem is that I can't envision how to attach the post to the beam. It's a flush beam and it's 4.5 inches thick. I need about an inch or so for the decking to attach around the post (I'd have another inch of overhang beyond that for the decking) So all said and done I can get about 4 inches of column to land directly on top of the flush beam which attaches to a footing directly below.

So what would you all recommend in this situation. I was thinking of adding a few 2X8's and bolting through it to make the flush beam wider where the columns will sit but it would mean all the weight would be on the bolts. Any better solutions to this problem? Or thoughts on whether this would at least be acceptable?

Thanks

Hick

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Old 04-11-2012, 07:39 AM   #2
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


What about steel posts and plates. They would provide more than enough structure and support with a much smaller "footprint". I shouldn't think they would be that much more than sistering stuff together or using oversized wood posts just for the look. Trim them out with whatever post look you want? You can even buy elaborate round column trim and crown etc.

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Old 04-11-2012, 11:17 AM   #3
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


I will tell you some thing you probably don't want to hear now but may help someone else reading this. Posts should have run to the ground/footing.

Your beam now, what does it sit on? Your posts should line up with whatever it sits on.
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:28 AM   #4
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Consider notching the post. Your 8x8 post is actually 7-1/4" x 7-1/4". 4" of the post will rest on the beam; 3-1/4" of it will dip below and be fastened to the beam with two carriage bolts. You'll want to make sure the post rests above a beam support (sonotube or whatever you're using); if it can't rest directly above it, it can rest up to 9-1/4" inches away (the actual depth of the 2X10 beam)
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Old 04-11-2012, 01:56 PM   #5
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


I created a video to explain better what I'm doing - forgive me for calling a joist a beam in one of my dumb comments Appreciate you taking a look and giving me your thoughts.
http://youtu.be/2zPnOACkqGs

Maeling-you mentioned running the posts right to the ground. I don't think it's feasible to run a decorative column from footing to roof where deck isn't the same level as the footing unless I'm missing something. For a deck made of ceder or PT posts I can see doing that although you would then have all your load on the brackets attached to the side of the post. You would need big brackets to attach a triple 2X10 to the side of the posts as well.

I guess I could just run 6X6 and then trim the post out instead of using prefab column as well. I could then notch the 6X6 like you said cortell.

Any other thoughts after watching my video


Thanks,
Hick
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Old 04-11-2012, 02:14 PM   #6
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Hick, you deserve some sort of award for posting that video. You've basically brought us all to the work site to check out the situation. Brilliant. If only everyone who had a question did that!

I'm sticking with notching the post--whether it's 6x6 or 8x8. It looks like with an 8x8, you'd need to move that one joist over to the right a bit. The 6x6, on the other hand, may just fit in between the joist and the carriage bolt that's to the left of it.
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Old 04-11-2012, 02:21 PM   #7
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Actually, I take that back. If structurally you need a min of 6x6 (not sure what sort of load you'll be holding up there), notching it would decrease the load point footprint. I'd go with an 8x8 in that case, and then frame an opening around so you can keep that right joist in the same location, but shortened--like framing for an opening in an attic floor.

Also, I'd probably use long lag screws instead of carriage bolts, simply because visually it will look funny given the surrounding carriage bolts.
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Old 04-11-2012, 02:56 PM   #8
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Hey Cortell, ok, I understand what you mean - thanks. I'm thinking of possibly using these manufactured permacast or PVC posts as well. To use the them I would have to build up a base instead of nothing to fit the whole post on something. Have you ever seen something like that done or how these manufactured posts are attached to a flush beam?

Everywhere I look I only see details where they put them on flat surface or something.

I'm not concerned about what it will look like on the outside because I'm going to trim everything with Azek so it won't be visible.

Thanks,
Hick
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Old 04-11-2012, 03:28 PM   #9
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Quote:
Originally Posted by hick23 View Post
Hey Cortell, ok, I understand what you mean - thanks. I'm thinking of possibly using these manufactured permacast or PVC posts as well. To use the them I would have to build up a base instead of nothing to fit the whole post on something. Have you ever seen something like that done or how these manufactured posts are attached to a flush beam?

Everywhere I look I only see details where they put them on flat surface or something.

I'm not concerned about what it will look like on the outside because I'm going to trim everything with Azek so it won't be visible.

Thanks,
Hick
Here's an idea. Cut two boards, same stock used in built-up beam, and lag screw them into the beam (I'd use four 1/2" hot-dip galvanized 8") and end-nail or screw them into the joists (four hot-dip galvanized 10d common or 3" deck screws). As long as a good amount of the post is sitting over the beam, I'd be comfortable with the rest of it sitting on these two boards. Again, only you know what sort of load we're talking about here, so use your judgement.
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam-post_platform.jpg  

Last edited by cortell; 04-11-2012 at 03:30 PM.
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Old 04-11-2012, 03:37 PM   #10
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Cortell - you just took it a step above. Awesome - I appreciate your help here and grabbing the frame and making it clear. Awesome. Thanks!
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Old 04-11-2012, 03:41 PM   #11
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Quote:
Originally Posted by hick23 View Post
Cortell - you just took it a step above. Awesome - I appreciate your help here and grabbing the frame and making it clear. Awesome. Thanks!
You bet. Make sure to use washers with those lag screws. And please post some pics with the post attached if that ends up working for you. Good luck!
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Old 04-11-2012, 04:33 PM   #12
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


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....and end-nail or screw them into the joists (four hot-dip galvanized 10d common or 3" deck screws).
To clarify, four per side per block, not just the four seen in the image. Total of 16 nails or screws
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Old 04-11-2012, 04:51 PM   #13
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


Man this should be awarded the best thread ever title, or at least the best explained
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Old 04-11-2012, 05:16 PM   #14
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


This was my first thread on this forum - I can't believe what a great place this is.
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Old 09-25-2012, 07:25 PM   #15
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Attaching Porch Column to a flush beam


So how close do you have to be on the vertical alignment between the deck post on the frost footing and the porch post on the beam above? Do I have to dig a new adjacent footing if a porch post is not directly over the deck post? (My corner posts are right on but I need to fudge the two middle ones to get them evenly spaced. This came about because the porch roof was an afterthought --no cantilever of the deck at the corner. Its 9x21 ft with house ledger on two sides. Thanks.

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