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Old 05-08-2012, 01:37 PM   #1
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


Hi All,

The side entry steps & landing of my recently purchased house need to be replaced. It consists of 2 stairs and a 3' by 4' landing all PTL. I noticed that the existing 4x4 posts are buried about 5 or 6 inches in the ground before they come to rest on the cement piers. To say it another way, the cement piers are 5 or 6 inches below grade. I've been racking my brain trying to think of the best way to deal with this (anchoring new 4x4 posts to concrete pier) as I get ready to frame this out with PTL. I was thinking about using Simpson Strong-tie anchor ABU44 (or something similar), but I'm concerned about the anchor rusting out. Can some folks share how they would deal with this?

Thanks

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Old 05-08-2012, 01:47 PM   #2
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


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Originally Posted by ulrichfolkers View Post
Hi All,

The side entry steps & landing of my recently purchased house need to be replaced. It consists of 2 stairs and a 3' by 4' landing all PTL. I noticed that the existing 4x4 posts are buried about 5 or 6 inches in the ground before they come to rest on the cement piers. To say it another way, the cement piers are 5 or 6 inches below grade. I've been racking my brain trying to think of the best way to deal with this (anchoring new 4x4 posts to concrete pier) as I get ready to frame this out with PTL. I was thinking about using Simpson Strong-tie anchor ABU44 (or something similar), but I'm concerned about the anchor rusting out. Can some folks share how they would deal with this?

Thanks
Use Simpson post connector you can purchase in any store. You will also need a sleeve anchor to attach the connector to concrete.
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:08 PM   #3
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


Do you think I need to be concerned about this rusting over time?
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:10 PM   #4
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Nope.
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:14 PM   #5
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Thanks......
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Old 05-08-2012, 03:34 PM   #6
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


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Do you think I need to be concerned about this rusting over time?
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Nope.
That's assuming OP doesn't live on the Coast.
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Old 05-08-2012, 03:43 PM   #7
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That's assuming OP doesn't live on the Coast.
Correct.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:46 PM   #8
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


the type of achor greg posted is the cats meow. honestly. they have more than enough strength and the void at the bottom creates an air space so the bottom of the post itself can dry out
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:52 PM   #9
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the type of achor greg posted is the cats meow. honestly. they have more than enough strength and the void at the bottom creates an air space so the bottom of the post itself can dry out
It should be noted it's also considerably more expensive than other, simpler post connectors.
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Old 05-08-2012, 07:33 PM   #10
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


Is the post to remain in contact with the ground?
That is, will be buried also?

Andy.
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:13 PM   #11
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I’ve used those a few times.

There easy and it’s nice they hold you off the ground and yes there pricey but when do you use them anyway???

When your building something off a slab, as an afterthought, as a way to connect something that wasn’t designed to be there in the first place.

I’ll bet that at least half the time their used there should be a footing under that slab that doesn’t exist.
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:28 AM   #12
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


if you are concerned about rusting you could purchase those in stainless steel. certainly cost more.

I think Andy was bringing up the fact that if you are going to bury the 4x4's in the ground make sure your pressure treated posts are rated for ground contact and not normal pressure treated. ground contact gets more treatment than normal pressure treated.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:28 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by AndyGump View Post
Is the post to remain in contact with the ground?
That is, will be buried also?

Andy.
Yes, about 5 or 6 inches of the 4x4 will be buried. I was thinking about putting some gravel around the 4x4, to provide a bit more drainage.

I was surprised to find the cement column (pier) below grade. Was this a common practice at one time in the past?
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:33 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by GBrackins View Post
if you are concerned about rusting you could purchase those in stainless steel. certainly cost more.

I think Andy was bringing up the fact that if you are going to bury the 4x4's in the ground make sure your pressure treated posts are rated for ground contact and not normal pressure treated. ground contact gets more treatment than normal pressure treated.
Good call about the ground contact PTL. I believe I'm looking for .60 treated vs .40 treated?

You're right about the stainless steel anchors. I'll check to see how much more they are.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:42 AM   #15
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Anchor 4x4 Post to Cement Pier


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Originally Posted by ulrichfolkers View Post
Yes, about 5 or 6 inches of the 4x4 will be buried. I was thinking about putting some gravel around the 4x4, to provide a bit more drainage.

I was surprised to find the cement column (pier) below grade. Was this a common practice at one time in the past?
Replacing the 5-6 inches of soil with gravel is a good idea. It will definitely reduce the amount of moisture that portion of the post is subjected to. However, it's much better to just extend the pier to above ground at least 4 inches.

As for why the pier was not poured to above ground...aesthetics. It's looks neater having the post come out of the ground than to have a concrete pier protruding 4-6 inches above ground. Also, it's cheaper--less concrete. It's a bad call, IMO. Eventually, that wood will deteriorate and fail--even if it's PT rated for underground use, or cedar. When? Who knows. Maybe 10 years; maybe 30. Depends on a number of factors. Keeping wood from direct contact with soil makes a drastic difference in the lifespan of the wood.

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