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Old 05-29-2011, 06:40 AM   #16
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Wiring for swimming pool


In NJ certain areas have there own requirements. Where in NJ are you located, If you wish you can pm me for any questions.

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Old 05-29-2011, 07:28 AM   #17
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Wiring for swimming pool


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Originally Posted by jomay View Post
the estimate i had to get it thru electricoan is 1k, and i felt thats a little too much considering he'll just pop-in new breakers.
I think you are downplaying the significance and scope of this job to justify your unwillingness to pay a professional to do the job right.
If you are able to learn how to do this job with no mistakes or future problems that is fine, but do not belittle the role of someone who knows what they are doing.



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is it true that i need 8' grounding/bonding rod for the pool, filter or lights?
Not now, not ever.
Folks who sink ground rods for pools don't know what they are doing.
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Old 05-29-2011, 07:29 AM   #18
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Wiring for swimming pool


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In NJ certain areas have there own requirements. Where in NJ are you located, If you wish you can pm me for any questions.
So how does this help the rest of the board to learn?
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Old 05-29-2011, 07:56 AM   #19
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Wiring for swimming pool


In some areas wiring to above ground pool has to in in conduit from panel to pool outlet, while other areas will allow romex from panel to outside wall of house and than conduit to pool outlet.
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:00 AM   #20
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Wiring for swimming pool


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In some areas wiring to above ground pool has to in in conduit from panel to pool outlet, while other areas will allow romex from panel to outside wall of house and than conduit to pool outlet.
And unfortunately in some areas inspectors make things up, while others will actually provide substantiation for their requests.

Honestly, this is one amendment I have not heard much of. Most places that I have seen/heard are in line with the NEC on this, excepting Chicago of course.

As usual, it is best to check with your local AHJ.
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Old 05-29-2011, 09:11 AM   #21
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Wiring for swimming pool


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In some areas wiring to above ground pool has to in in conduit from panel to pool outlet, while other areas will allow romex from panel to outside wall of house and than conduit to pool outlet.
In my area, they follow the NEC for 2008 now. That means a GFCI within six feet. Since my pool pretty much gets set up within four feet of the edge of our garage, the whole assembly is a Intex Quick Set pool, so no overkill.

Only draw is that the overhead POCO lines need to be 20 feet off from the ground, and lockable gate and same for back door. Pretty simplified, no over kill. If I had to go with a steel wall above, yes I would make changes, but following the NEC guidelines, again no need to overkill it.
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Old 05-29-2011, 09:20 PM   #22
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Wiring for swimming pool


Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedy Petey
I think you are downplaying the significance and scope of this job to justify your unwillingness to pay a professional to do the job right.
If you are able to learn how to do this job with no mistakes or future problems that is fine, but do not belittle the role of someone who knows what they are doing.

Not now, not ever.
Folks who sink ground rods for pools don't know what they are doing.
I did not intend to "belittle the role of the professional"... I just thought it was too much (for myself). After researching further, the 1k seems to be reasonable bec of other work involved - trenching and burying ground rod for bonding... I just got confused with your comment about grounding rod... Am I really talking to an electrician who quoted me for 1k including bonding?
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Old 05-29-2011, 09:26 PM   #23
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Wiring for swimming pool


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Originally Posted by NJMarine
In some areas wiring to above ground pool has to in in conduit from panel to pool outlet, while other areas will allow romex from panel to outside wall of house and than conduit to pool outlet.
Thanks. I decided to use gfi for both my breaker and outlet... I think extra $40 for the outlet is easy to recover over 3 years. I'm doing romex from panel thru the crawlspace then conduit (sched 40 PVC) from outside to the pool filter (5' away from pool). I'm also doing the same for extra outlets but it's 10' away from pool.
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Old 05-29-2011, 10:51 PM   #24
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Wiring for swimming pool


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I'm doing romex from panel thru the crawlspace then conduit (sched 40 PVC) from outside to the pool filter (5' away from pool). I'm also doing the same for extra outlets but it's 10' away from pool.
You cannot use NM-B underground or outside. You need to make sure the cable is UF.
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Old 05-29-2011, 11:07 PM   #25
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You cannot use NM-B underground or outside. You need to make sure the cable is UF.
Wished they told the idiot that did that with my garage, before I ran #10 UF from the house to the garage. My wife looked at me when I pulled it up out of the ground, and just walked back inside, because she knew I was pissed once I figured out why no power to the garage.
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Old 05-29-2011, 11:40 PM   #26
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Wiring for swimming pool


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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post
In my area, they follow the NEC for 2008 now. That means a GFCI within six feet. Since my pool pretty much gets set up within four feet of the edge of our garage, the whole assembly is a Intex Quick Set pool, so no overkill.

Only draw is that the overhead POCO lines need to be 20 feet off from the ground, and lockable gate and same for back door. Pretty simplified, no over kill. If I had to go with a steel wall above, yes I would make changes, but following the NEC guidelines, again no need to overkill it.
Pools have more than NEC requirements, there are lots of offset requirements - so things like drunk guys climbing on a roof so they can jump to their death trying to dive don't happen. It's been 8 years since I put in my pool and mine was way back from the house, but I remember I was pretty much as close to my fence as I was allowed and I think it was more like 6'.

To put the $1000 in context, consider my current project of a garage feeder and service upgrade... Way heavier duty stuff involved and that's a lot of the expense (panel, socket, rigid conduit, heavier gage wire - although mine is aluminum so cost per for isn't actually that far off)

My materials came to about $1000... before the inspector failed me, and I had to spend another $250. Plus the rental of 2 teenagers to dig my 30' trench for $80 (which is cheaper than the walk behind trencher at $125)

This can easily be a $500 DIY project. Especially if you have any rework resulting from inspection.

Somebody will hopefully correct me if I'm wrong, but you can pull THHN and it will most likely work out cheaper than the UF.

And definitely use schedule 80 PVC conduit where you come up out of the ground. When we had a pool and the electric came up and was mounted on a post, that was an area I had to use a weed whacker.
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Old 05-30-2011, 12:01 AM   #27
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Somebody will hopefully correct me if I'm wrong, but you can pull THHN and it will most likely work out cheaper than the UF.
Do you mean THWN?
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Old 05-30-2011, 12:03 AM   #28
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Wiring for swimming pool


EDIT: I guess some is dual rated THHN/THWN, but I'd suggest being careful to determine that.
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Old 05-30-2011, 12:54 AM   #29
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Wiring for swimming pool


Willk, drunk guys/gals jumping off the roof, etc is mandated by insurance, anything else not covered by that or NEC usually falls under HOA crap. Everything needed to know about pools, decks, etc is pretty much laid out on the city website, and some have guidelines in books that homeowners can download to put them on the right track.

As for failing inspection, yes each process means possibly having the inspector come back at each time, but in all reality, they are there to protect the homeowner from the liability of doing it wrong, in the event that something happens, so the homeowner does not come back and go "I didn't know."
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Old 05-30-2011, 06:47 AM   #30
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Wiring for swimming pool


Since the OP is from NJ, here is a sample guidline from a NJ Town.
It does have about the equipotential bonding, which also is required.
If you already have a gfi outlet that is 10-20 feet away from pool edge than that can be the convience outlet.

Sample guidelines for electrical requirements for Swimming Pools
01. No direct burial cable permitted underground. Conduit system is required. 680.21
02. Minimum attachment cord size # 12 AWG. 680-21
03. Minimum ground wire size # 12 AWG. 680.21
04. 20 Ampere Locking type outlet required for filter motor for above ground pools located between 5’ and 10’ from
pool wall. This outlet shall be Ground Fault Protected and shall employ a “In-Use” cover. This circuit shall be
dedicated to the Filter Motor. 680.22
05. Convenience outlet shall be located between 10’ and 20’ from pool wall, shall be Ground Fault Protected and
shall be connected to a routine circuit in the dwelling. This outlet may be protected with a “in- use”
weatherproof cover. 680.22
06. All metal parts within 5’ of the pool shall be bonded together with #8 solid wire and shall be bonded to filter
motor. 680.26
07. Filter motor may be “hard wired” but disconnecting means is required.
08. Burial depth is routinely 18” for PVC and 6” for Rigid metal conduit. 680.10
09. Any approved wiring method within the dwelling is approved within the dwelling unless a pool light is involved.
If a pool light is installed, a conduit system is required to the service panel board and a green insulated ground
is required to be installed. 680.21
10. All wiring installed in a conduit system must either be Ground Fault or not. Do not intermix these two types of wiring protection
11. A # 8 Solid Green wire is required to be installed between the pool chassis and a lug provided on the filter
motor. A proper lug is required on the pool chassis. 680.26

12. A time clock must be installed so the pump can be set to run at off hours as per the Model Energy Code


Last edited by NJMarine; 05-30-2011 at 06:55 AM.
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