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-   -   Wire Heat In Conduit? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/wire-heat-conduit-104219/)

BusterMN 05-11-2011 11:41 PM

Wire Heat In Conduit?
 
I am running 3 new breakers to an addition. I will run 3 new wires through the pvc type conduit from the breaker box out to the new room. The 3 wires will be one 14-2 for lights, one 12-2 for outlets, and one 12-2 for a 6ft electric baseboard heater. The closest part of the new room is about 18 ft from the breaker panel and from there on, all 3 new wires will have between a 16 and 28 ft run. So the new wire will run a total of 34 to 46 ft. The lights will have the shortest run and the baseboard heater will have the longest. My question is, will running a 14-2 and two separate 12-2 wires in the same 1 inch pvc conduit make heat or get hot enough to cause a problem? The three wires will be together in the conduit for only 4 to 7 ft, only to run them from the old part of the house, outside for 3-1/2 ft to the new addition. The three wires fit well in one inch conduit not too tight and not too loose. If you've read this far, thank you for any comments.

Anti-wingnut 05-12-2011 12:00 AM

The electricians will be here soon to root out issues but,
1) Will the outside conduit be buried? If so, you must change to a wet location wire
2) If this addition is a different building than where the panel sits, then you must install a sub panel

BusterMN 05-12-2011 12:19 AM

Wire Heat In Conduit?
 
The conduit will not be buried. The addition is not a separate building it is a new bedroom connected to the house. Would running a sub panel be a better, easier, and safer idea even if it isn't required? I have a 100 amp main panel in the basement. Can I and how would I run a sub panel.

mpoulton 05-12-2011 12:50 AM

You have 6 current carrying conductors. 7 or more conductors in one conduit require derating. So your installation is fine as-is. However, you cannot generally install cables (NM, UF, etc.) in conduit. If you are using conduit, you must use individual conductors (THHN/THWN) instead. Why conduit if it's not buried or outside?

vsheetz 05-12-2011 12:53 AM

Why the need for conduit?

BusterMN 05-12-2011 01:11 AM

Wire Heat In Conduit?
 
The reason for the conduit is because I am coming out of the top of the basement wall, running along the outside of the house 3 to 4 feet into the new bedroom. I like the idea of a sub panel in the new bedroom to run the lights, outlets, and heater out of. Is this possible out of my 100 amp main? How?

frenchelectrican 05-12-2011 01:46 AM

First thing first.,The NM cable is not allowed in the conduit in outdoor locations at all per NEC code., UF cable can but some way if you can make a junction box to transalted them to THHN/THWN conductors that will work better this way.

Is your house split level ?

And any finshed room most states will required AFCI breakers so check that out as well.

As far for the heater baseboard heaters ? size ?

I know you mention subpanel in bedroom but only one area is complety off limit is cloth closet and bathroom as well.

Merci,
Marc

BusterMN 05-12-2011 02:23 AM

Wire Heat In Conduit?
 
OK here is where my technical ignorance shines bright. What do these mean: NM cable, UF cable, If you are using conduit, you must use individual conductors (THHN/THWN) instead. So if the closet is off limits for a sub panel, can I put one in the wall in the living area of the bedroom? The house isn't a split. I'm trying to figure out how to get power from a partial basement to a new bedroom added on to the part of the house that is just a block foundation. No basement access to new part. The bb heater requires 240.

frenchelectrican 05-12-2011 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BusterMN (Post 646231)
OK here is where my technical ignorance shines bright. What do these mean: NM cable, UF cable, If you are using conduit, you must use individual conductors (THHN/THWN) instead. So if the closet is off limits for a sub panel, can I put one in the wall in the living area of the bedroom? The house isn't a split. I'm trying to figure out how to get power from a partial basement to a new bedroom added on to the part of the house that is just a block foundation. No basement access to new part. The bb heater requires 240.

Ok I will clear up that part about the subpanel location the best is right behind the door in bedroom where the door stay open and behind that door genrally have nothing behind that door { if near corner part that fine }

The NM cable is not rated for wet locations due the conduit {pipe } is at the outdoor location.

Ahh I get it what ya mean about the no access port.

For the baseboard heater I know you say 240 volts but watch the wattage rating if you know what size baseboard heater we will able give you the answer quick { most baseboard are pretty much standerized with wattage/ foot length }

Just try to find a spot where you can punch a hole with least amount of effort or mess if possible do you have crawl space below the bedroom or not ?

Merci,
Marc

mpoulton 05-12-2011 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BusterMN (Post 646231)
OK here is where my technical ignorance shines bright. What do these mean: NM cable, UF cable, If you are using conduit, you must use individual conductors (THHN/THWN) instead. So if the closet is off limits for a sub panel, can I put one in the wall in the living area of the bedroom? The house isn't a split. I'm trying to figure out how to get power from a partial basement to a new bedroom added on to the part of the house that is just a block foundation. No basement access to new part. The bb heater requires 240.


NM cable = "romex" - standard multi-wire cable for use in home wiring. It's generally white for #14, yellow for #12, and orange for #10.

UF cable = the outdoor equivalent of NM, rated for wet locations and direct burial. It's gray. It's also really annoying to work with.

THHN/THWN = individual wires. THWN is wet location rated. Most wire for sale is dual-listed as THHN and THWN. You have to use proper colors for the application and it must be in conduit.

You can put a panel on the bedroom wall. Potentially ugly, but allowable.

The easiest and best way to get power from the partial basement to the addition is to run underground conduit from the basement up through the new foundation and into a wall. It's really easy and convenient as long as you do it when the foundation is dug but not installed yet. Sounds like it's too late? If the addition's already up, I'd probably run it as you describe: out the old foundation wall above grade, over, and into the new wall just above the sill plate.

BusterMN 05-12-2011 08:22 AM

Wire Heat In Conduit?
 
The bb heater will be a 6ft Cadet 1500w 240v. There is no crawlspace access from partial basement to the new bedroom. I don't have a problem putting a sub in the bedroom by the door. This sounds like the easiest way to do it rather than trying to run 3 separate cables from the main panel. If possible, how can I run a cable from the 100 amp main in the basement to feed a sub in the bedroom? I do have 6 spaces open in the main. What size cable, breaker, etc? Can the sub feeder cable go in conduit?

rjniles 05-12-2011 08:48 AM

If you have the room in the main panel, the most cost effective solution would be to run 3 separate circuits.

Even if the main is full, you could easily install a small sub next to the main and run the 3 new circuits.

quincy 05-12-2011 12:13 PM

Please forgive me for hijacking this thread for my curious question.
What is the length of wire/circuit should i upsize the wire gauge to prevent heat and voltage drop?
Thanks in advance

a7ecorsair 05-12-2011 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quincy (Post 646426)
Please forgive me for hijacking this thread for my curious question.
What is the length of wire/circuit should i upsize the wire gauge to prevent heat and voltage drop?
Thanks in advance

If you have a question then start a new thread with the details. The above comment is useless to us.


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