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-   -   What outdoor electrical is required in 2008 NEC? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/what-outdoor-electrical-required-2008-nec-104732/)

WillK 05-17-2011 08:25 AM

What outdoor electrical is required in 2008 NEC?
 
I am working on a subproject of eventually having the entire house rewired so I'm doing a section at a time. The scope of the current subproject is a service entrance move and 200 amp upgrade and running a 100 amp feeder to a subpanel in the detatched garage.

The goal this weekend is to complete all work needed to schedule rough inspection next week. The new service entrance and 200 amp panel are ready for inspection on the house, I have 2 nephews digging the trench and they should be finished tonight. If it wasn't raining so much they would've finished Sunday. I have rigid conduit and 1/0 aluminum XHWN ready to go in the trench.

My questions are about what would be the minimum requirements for outdoor lighting and receptacles, and whether there are dedicated circuit requirements to be aware of.

At present, there are only dead receptacles in the garage, so I'm treating the garage as if it has no electrical. There is a garage door openner and I know that it needs to be on tamper-proof GFCI. There is one porch light at the back door for the house. There are no outdoor receptacles anywhere on my house, garage or property.

I don't plan on dealing with the front of my house at this time, that will be later.

Questions specifically I have:

1) Is there anything that would require seperate circuits for anything off the garage subpanel, I plan to put in 1 duplex receptacle for general use, 2 switch operated ceiling receptacles for inside flourescent lights and 1 ceiling receptacle for the garage door openner, plus one outdoor duplex receptacle. Would all of this be allowed on one circuit?

2) I will be putting one outdoor duplex receptacle on its own circuit on the house, it will be easiest to put this near the meter socket. Any distance restrictions I need to observe?

3) Is there any code requirements for outdoor lighting on the garage?

4) Garage ground rods: I have 2 put in for the house, I am using the rigid metal conduit as my ground conductor and it is buried 21" and I plan to put in 1 ground rod for the garage. I know this varies by locallity, but is a second ground rod very likely to be required for 100A in a detatched structure?

jbfan 05-18-2011 04:08 PM

#1-Yes, all that can be on one circuit.
#2-No restrictions.
#3- Not sure about the garage, but any door should have a light.
#4-1 ground rod is allowed as long as you can prove it it less than 25 ohms, but the equipment needed to prove that is costley, so most people just put in 2 rods and be done.

Leah Frances 05-18-2011 05:33 PM

Specifically question #3 - - At least one wall switch-controlled lighting outlet must be installed to provide illumination on the exterior side of outdoor entrances or exits that have grade-level access to dwelling units, attached garages, and detached garages if they have electric power. FYI: a vehicle door is not considered to be an outdoor entrance. 210.70(A)(2)(b)

So, if you only have a garage door then you're good.

Here's some misc info about 'outdoor' 2008 NEC rules

- 210.52(E)(1) - at least one rec shall be installed in the front and another in the back of a family dwelling. No more than 6.5 feet above grade. (additional recs may be installed higher).

- 210.52(E)(3) - at least one rec shall be installed within the perimeter of the balcony, deck or porch. unless it has useable area less than 20 square feet.

- Your garage needs at least one rec in addition to recs installed for specific equipment (duh!). see 210.8(A)(2) and 210.52(G)

- the interior of your garage needs at least one wall switch-controlled lighting. 210.70(A)(2)(a)

WillK 05-18-2011 09:18 PM

2 car garage door plus seperate people door enterring the workshop, which of course doesn't have any exterior light, so yep I'll put one there.

Sounds like it'd also be slick to do this light as a 3-way with a switch inside the house, so I'm thinking I have 2 options:

1) 14-3 or 12-3 UF through the conduit (2" rigid metal acting as ground conductor for the feeder with 3 1/0 aluminum XHWN)

or

2) 3 THHN conductors. If I did this, could I pigtail the ground for the switch inside the house off the other switch that will be next to it, which would be running off a house circuit?

Saturday Cowboy 05-18-2011 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leah Frances (Post 650564)
FYI: a vehicle door is not considered to be an outdoor entrance.

For a minute i though you meant a car door:laughing:

Saturday Cowboy 05-18-2011 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillK (Post 650696)
Sounds like it'd also be slick to do this light as a 3-way with a switch inside the house, so I'm thinking I have 2 options:

Don't you already have a conduit going between the garage and the house? If there is extra space you can pull in you travelers to your main panel and from the main panel in to the house.

WillK 05-19-2011 05:46 AM

I think that's what I meant, I just didn't use the proper terminology... I guess the question was about grounding the switch in the house, it will be a switch on a circuit off of the garage subpanel. Does the ground conductor have to run with the travelers or would it be permitted to ground it off a pigtail for a different circuit in the house?

Saturday Cowboy 05-19-2011 06:11 PM

a complete circuit must be run back to the house(travelers,switchleg and ground). and the ground you bring from the garage is not supposed to be attached to any others that might be in a multi gang box in the house.

WillK 05-19-2011 07:08 PM

Well, 4 THHN runs is still cheaper than UF-B, now I need to figure out how to deal with the fact my fish tape is 25' long and I have 30' plus 2 long radius elbows to pull through.

Saturday Cowboy 05-19-2011 07:31 PM

sorry can't help you with that one:laughing:

jbfan 05-19-2011 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillK (Post 651206)
Well, 4 THHN runs is still cheaper than UF-B, now I need to figure out how to deal with the fact my fish tape is 25' long and I have 30' plus 2 long radius elbows to pull through.

A string, baggie and vacuum!

Tie the baggie to the string and suck it through.
Use the string to tie a pull robe and pull the wires.

Leah Frances 05-19-2011 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbfan (Post 651254)
A string, baggie and vacuum!

Tie the baggie to the string and suck it through.
Use the string to tie a pull robe and pull the wires.

:thumbup:


This seems more workable then my still-under-construction-idea involving rodents of unusual size and magnets.

WillK 05-19-2011 08:33 PM

Actually, I figured out a way to kind of kill 2 birds with 1 stone. I still have a piece of 10-2 UF and this piece happens to be more than 70' long. So here's what I did so far:

I need to pull 3 runs of 1/0 XHWN through this conduit. My conduit is laid out as 3 10' pieces with long turn elbows at each end going up to my pull elbows. I pulled 1 run of 1/0 XHWN plus the UF cable through the first LB, the first elbow and 2 straight 10' pipes using the fish tape.

Once that was through, I disconnected the fish tape, fed it through the other LB, then the other elbow, then the last 10' pipe. I taped it to the 1/0 and UF. Then I reconnected the last 10' conduit then the elbow and LB. Then I was able to finish pulling the 1/0 and UF cable through.

I'll have to get a helper tommorrow so someone can push while I pull, then I can use the UF to pull the other 2 conductors of the 1/0 through. I'll have a UF cable running through and I'll just need another individual conductor, so I can get a 50' spool of THHN to take care of that.

Also of assistance is the huge bottle of conduit grease I bought way back when I bought the UF when I was doing a 90' run to the pool.

jbfan 05-19-2011 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leah Frances (Post 651257)
:thumbup:


This seems more workable then my still-under-construction-idea involving rodents of unusual size and magnets.

Might take a while to train the rodents!

WillK 05-20-2011 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbfan (Post 651270)
Might take a while to train the rodents!

Oh man, you mean I could've had a use for those 15 rats I killed and threw in the garbage in December?

On a more serious note... seriously, this is going to be a path into the house because I know I've had squirrels living in the garage, and I don't think I'm going to have the budget before the winter to do the renovations on the garage that it would take to keep rats squirrels and/or insects out.

So once I have all my cables pulled, is it allowed to shoot some Great Stuff or whatever expanding foam product into the end of the conduit to seal the openning?


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