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Old 02-20-2012, 10:41 PM   #31
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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Originally Posted by rrolleston View Post
Use USE 2 in conduit and direct bury the wire outside 24" MIN below grade. Having the wire in conduit for peace of mind would only add 30 bucks at most to your project. Be sure to order 20% extra just in case because this stuff does not stretch.
It would need to be in conduit up to both panels though right?

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Old 02-20-2012, 10:43 PM   #32
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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It would need to be in conduit up to both panels though right?
Yes right into the panel with a threaded male adapter lock nut and bushing.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:44 PM   #33
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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I'm trying to stick with one type of wire/cable for feeding a sub-panel 125' away from a 60amp 2-pole in my main panel. Something that can be used within walls, in a crawl space, and direct buried. This is what I am considering using-

http://www.wireandcabletogo.com/Indu...th-Ground.html

Any suggestions/comments are appreciated.

Thanks!

The cable you linked to may be iffy, however 600V power cable type tc rated as xhhw or xhhw-2 would be hard for an inspector to deny as a sub-feed to a panel in a direct burial application. It would be treated much like nm-b or uf-b as far as protection above ground and supporting. It is far superior to UF-b IMO.

http://www.southwire.com/ProductCata...prodcatsheet70
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:45 PM   #34
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


I think it needs to be in conduit because of the insulation during a fire. So anyway, if I had clean soil I would use direct burial and conduit in the structures.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:45 PM   #35
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


So that means I get to brush up on my sheetrock work I guess...
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:48 PM   #36
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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The cable you linked to may be iffy, however 600V power cable type tc rated as xhhw or xhhw-2 would be hard for an inspector to deny as a sub-feed to a panel in a direct burial application. It would be treated much like nm-b or uf-b as far as protection above ground and supporting. It is far superior to UF-b IMO.

http://www.southwire.com/ProductCata...prodcatsheet70
Exactly my thoughts, but I got an immediate NO on this thread when I posted it up. This cable seems to exceed requirements IMO.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:50 PM   #37
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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Exactly my thoughts, but I got an immediate NO on this thread when I posted it up. This cable seems to exceed requirements IMO.
I will run this by whoever is there when I pick up the permit....
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:50 PM   #38
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


I see Stubbie is here. Hi Stubbie!

I don't know much about wire but I just wanted to throw my ideas out there for you to think about without splicing.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:51 PM   #39
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


Copied from nec

II. Installation
336.10 Uses Permitted. Type TC cable shall be permitted
to be used as follows:
(1) For power, lighting, control, and signal circuits.
(2) In cable trays.
(3) In raceways.
(4) In outdoor locations supported by a messenger wire.
(5) For Class 1 circuits as permitted in Parts II and III of
Article 725.
(6) For non–power-limited fire alarm circuits if conductors
comply with the requirements of 760.49.
(7) In industrial establishments where the conditions of
maintenance and supervision ensure that only qualified
persons service the installation, and where the cable is
continuously supported and protected against physical
damage using mechanical protection, such as struts,
angles, or channels, Type TC tray cable that complies
with the crush and impact requirements of Type MC
cable and is identified for such use with the marking
Type TC–ER shall be permitted between a cable tray
and the utilization equipment or device. The cable shall
be secured at intervals not exceeding 1.8 m (6 ft).
Equipment grounding for the utilization equipment
shall be provided by an equipment grounding conductor
within the cable. In cables containing conductors
sized 6 AWG or smaller, the equipment grounding conductor
shall be provided within the cable or, at the time
of installation, one or more insulated conductors shall
be permanently identified as an equipment grounding
conductor in accordance with 250.119(B).
Exception: Where not subject to physical damage, Type
TC-ER shall be permitted to transition between cable trays
and between cable trays and utilization equipment or devices
for a distance not to exceed 1.8 m (6 ft) without
continuous support. The cable shall be mechanically supported
where exiting the cable tray to ensure that the minimum
bending radius is not exceeded.
(8) Where installed in wet locations, Type TC cable shall
also be resistant to moisture and corrosive agents.
Informational Note: See 310.15(A)(3) for temperature
limitation of conductors.
336.12 Uses Not Permitted. Type TC tray cable shall not
be installed or used as follows:
(1) Installed where it will be exposed to physical damage
(2) Installed outside a raceway or cable tray system, except
as permitted in 336.10(4) and 336.10(7)
(3) Used where exposed to direct rays of the sun, unless
identified as sunlight resistant
(4) Direct buried, unless identified for such use
336.24 Bending Radius. Bends in Type TC cable shall be
made so as not to damage the cable. For Type TC cable
without metal shielding, the minimum bending radius shall
be as follows:
(1) Four times the overall diameter for cables 25 mm
(1 in.) or less in diameter
(2) Five times the overall diameter for cables larger than
25 mm (1 in.) but not more than 50 mm (2 in.) in
diameter
(3) Six times the overall diameter for cables larger than
50 mm (2 in.) in diameter
Type TC cables with metallic shielding shall have a
minimum bending radius of not less than 12 times the cable
overall diameter.
336.80 Ampacity. The ampacity of Type TC tray cable
shall be determined in accordance with 392.80(A) for 14
AWG and larger conductors, in accordance with 402.5 for
18 AWG through 16 AWG conductors where installed in
cable tray, and in accordance with 310.15 where installed in
a raceway or as messenger-supported wiring.
III.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:54 PM   #40
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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I see Stubbie is here. Hi Stubbie!

I don't know much about wire but I just wanted to throw my ideas out there for you to think about without splicing.
I don't know much either but I do know I would like to avoid splicing and/or cutting out sheetrock in my house.

I do appreciate the input!
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:57 PM   #41
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


I read the same thing out of the 2008 nec, but frankly I have no idea whether or not it can be used in residential applications after trying to decipher that. Is a breaker panel a "tray" or "device"???
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Old 02-20-2012, 11:30 PM   #42
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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I read the same thing out of the 2008 nec, but frankly I have no idea whether or not it can be used in residential applications after trying to decipher that. Is a breaker panel a "tray" or "device"???
Cable trays are discussed in NEC 392 and are long metal or pvc trays that the TC cable lays in. When used in cable trays special tables are used for ampacity.

Otherwise you would simply use 310.16 for the type of insulation .. provided the insulation is of a type listed in those tables. There are many styles and insulations of power tray cable so you need to make sure it is 'power cable' and a insulation type that is acceptable for residential use such as those in table 310.16

The designation type tc simply means it can be used in trays where other cables cannot go. Theres nothing special about it after that.

Loadcenters are nothing more than distribution panelboards .. they are just specialized for residential applications.

They are not trays ... they are devices used to distribute power.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:35 AM   #43
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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Originally Posted by rrolleston View Post
mpoulton answered your question.

USE-2 in conduit for the whole run.
I don't think I did. My answer was based on an apparently incorrect interpretation of 338.12(B). His original TC cable will work, since it is identified for direct burial.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:35 AM   #44
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Is Tray Cable acceptable for Residential use?


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I see Stubbie is here. Hi Stubbie!

I don't know much about wire but I just wanted to throw my ideas out there for you to think about without splicing.
Hi Zappa

Sorry I didn't see your greeting earlier .... I'll try to be more observant in the future.

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