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Old 07-02-2011, 02:38 PM   #1
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


We have an older home and want to install a fan where there was a ceiling plate covering a junction box. The wires coming out of the ceiling (and capped together with wire nuts) are:
2 ground
3 white
2 black
1 red & 1 black

We left the combination above as is and added the green ground from the fan to the two ceiling grounds, white to white, black to black, and the blue from the fan to the red/black combination.

It did not work and we do not know where to proceed from here. Any help is greatly appreciated.

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Old 07-02-2011, 03:11 PM   #2
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Couple of questions----How many wall switches control that ceiling box?

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Old 07-02-2011, 03:17 PM   #3
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


No switches that we can find - all switches are accounted for. The box had a cover over it and was not in use when we bought the house. The house is located in Bethany Beach, DE

Last edited by simonecmd; 07-02-2011 at 03:19 PM. Reason: location
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Old 07-02-2011, 03:25 PM   #4
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Do you have any type of electrical tester?

Are you planning on turning that on by pulling the little chain for the fan or the light?
If so--The white wire from the fan gets hooked to the neutral in the box(usually a white)

the two colored wires from the fan are stripped and twisted together and then attached to the constant power in the box.

Use the tester to see if you have a neutral and a constant power in that box.
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Old 07-02-2011, 03:26 PM   #5
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


A cheap neon tester will work fine and should only cost $2.00 or so.
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Old 07-02-2011, 03:28 PM   #6
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


yes, we are planning on using the chain for the fan and light. We do not have a tester here, I guess I will have to purchase one. I do have the white to white - I don't understand why there were so many extra wires coming out of the ceiling.
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Old 07-02-2011, 03:35 PM   #7
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


That box is a junction box----lots of things coming and going to other places---

Kind of like a major freeway intersection----lots of streets going different places---you need a tester.

Find a constant hot and hook onto that.
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Old 07-02-2011, 04:30 PM   #8
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


I’d bet the other end of the black, red, white cable in the ceiling could be found in a switch box somewhere close…might have been used at one time, but now is capped off.
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Old 07-02-2011, 11:03 PM   #9
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Quote:
Originally Posted by simonecmd View Post
yes, we are planning on using the chain for the fan and light. We do not have a tester here, I guess I will have to purchase one. I do have the white to white - I don't understand why there were so many extra wires coming out of the ceiling.
So you started this not knowing what you are doing and without even a simple tester???
Rarely is this work as rudimentary as white-to-white, black-to-black, as you have now found out.

Get you a tester and figure out what wires are what.
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Old 07-02-2011, 11:26 PM   #10
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Quote:
Originally Posted by simonecmd View Post
We have an older home and want to install a fan where there was a ceiling plate covering a junction box. The wires coming out of the ceiling (and capped together with wire nuts) are:
2 ground
3 white
2 black
1 red & 1 black

We left the combination above as is and added the green ground from the fan to the two ceiling grounds, white to white, black to black, and the blue from the fan to the red/black combination.

It did not work and we do not know where to proceed from here. Any help is greatly appreciated.
That combation of wires you have in there what we are instering is the numbers of cablés entred in the junction box due one cable is incomming source but outgoing that will depending on how it wired up some case you may have MWBC incomming source if that so be extra carefull there.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 07-03-2011, 08:07 AM   #11
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Quote:
Originally Posted by SD515 View Post
I’d bet the other end of the black, red, white cable in the ceiling could be found in a switch box somewhere close…might have been used at one time, but now is capped off.

Good idea, thank you.
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Old 07-03-2011, 08:12 AM   #12
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


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Originally Posted by Speedy Petey View Post
So you started this not knowing what you are doing and without even a simple tester???
Rarely is this work as rudimentary as white-to-white, black-to-black, as you have now found out.

Get you a tester and figure out what wires are what.

I see no reason to post such a rude response. This was not our first installation and we do have basic knowledge. The purpose of this forum is to be helpful - even if you think the original question or poster is stupid.
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Old 07-03-2011, 08:37 AM   #13
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


I don't think it sounds that rude - but you really should listen to the point he was trying to make. You connected wires which you were unable to determine were live or not at the time, and a simple tester will tell you that.

Most "pros" will not work on a live or unknown circuit, and tend to get a little "short" when they see an inexperienced person do the same.
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Old 07-03-2011, 09:12 AM   #14
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Thank you Tribe for the logical reply.


Quote:
Originally Posted by simonecmd View Post
I see no reason to post such a rude response. This was not our first installation and we do have basic knowledge. The purpose of this forum is to be helpful - even if you think the original question or poster is stupid.
I guess the red means your mad or something. Sorry if your feelings got (unreasonably) hurt.
What I wrote was not rude, nor did I ever say you were stupid.
What I meant was simply because there is more than just the basic black, white and ground in the box, DOES NOT mean there are "too many" wires. THIS my friend IS basic electrical knowledge.
Even opening up a box or removing a fixture with some sort of electrical tester, IMO, is quite foolish, for exactly the reason you are experiencing right now.

Once you figure out what wires go where, which are feeds, which are switch legs, this will be quite easy.
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Old 07-03-2011, 09:35 AM   #15
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Too many wires in ceiling for fan installation


Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedy Petey View Post
Thank you Tribe for the logical reply.



I guess the red means your mad or something. Sorry if your feelings got (unreasonably) hurt.
What I wrote was not rude, nor did I ever say you were stupid.
What I meant was simply because there is more than just the basic black, white and ground in the box, DOES NOT mean there are "too many" wires. THIS my friend IS basic electrical knowledge.
Even opening up a box or removing a fixture with some sort of electrical tester, IMO, is quite foolish, for exactly the reason you are experiencing right now.

Once you figure out what wires go where, which are feeds, which are switch legs, this will be quite easy.
I 2nd what you say. How do you know what is what lot's of time white to white is not the right way? I been in radio and tv repair and retired now but if you didn't know what the teste's are and didn't have them you are total in the dark and can get hurt. I have wired house's and put in lot's of item's and hook up lot's of 2 way stuff and many other strange hook's up's. Always know where the voltage is. Hope it is not in your hand. A few smart's can go a long way sometime's. oh well my 2 cent's

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