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Old 05-26-2012, 07:35 PM   #1
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Are there knockout seals that works?


I have been redoing a bunch of wiring and in some cases I need to cancel some of the connections.

Once I removed the EMT conduits from the metal boxes, and removed the connector I am left with a 1/2" or 3/4" hole I need to plug.

This is the product I use.



The problem is, this product only works if you have the box empty and oriented such that you have access at an angle to tab it in using a screw driver and a hammer. Half the time it won't go in anyways and you have to try repeatedly to finesse it in. If the box is full of wires or it is a double box where the hole is all the way in the back, forget it.

Pushing this thing into the hole, then fold each tab back is a real tedious and time consuming task.

Are there not products out there that makes this easier? I will gladly pay 5 times more if it means there is a better way to do this. Is there a plastic plug you just push in with your finger, or some metal ones with wing nuts, something...THERE HAS TO BE A BETTER WAY!

This thing is the most frustrating thing. I have in some cases, change the box out to a new one, took the time to disconnect and reconnect all the wires and connector to avoid putting in one knockout seal. It's nuts.

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Old 05-26-2012, 07:41 PM   #2
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Buy the plastic snap in KO fillers. much nicer... Arlington makes the one I posted, I wouldn't stray from this brand...


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Old 05-26-2012, 08:58 PM   #3
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Based on your description of your difficulties, it sounds like there might be an issue of technique. The KO blank goes in from the outside of the box, and usually only one good whack with a hammer is needed to pop it in place. No folding of tabs needed. They can be a tad bit loose (spin easily) but they don't fall out without a good push from the inside. But the plastic ones are better.

Example of easy KO seal installation:
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Old 05-26-2012, 09:00 PM   #4
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Quote:
Originally Posted by mpoulton View Post
Based on your description of your difficulties, it sounds like there might be an issue of technique. The KO blank goes in from the outside of the box, and usually only one good whack with a hammer is needed to pop it in place. No folding of tabs needed. They can be a tad bit loose (spin easily) but they don't fall out without a good push from the inside. But the plastic ones are better.
The metal ones suck, plain and simple. And where is the shot of the video where he smashes his fingers installing that ko filler.

Last edited by stickboy1375; 05-26-2012 at 09:02 PM.
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Old 05-26-2012, 09:25 PM   #5
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Are there knockout seals that works?


There are also ones that secure with a screw arrangement.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=elect...9,r:2,s:0,i:83
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Old 05-27-2012, 04:58 AM   #6
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Quote:
Originally Posted by mpoulton View Post
Based on your description of your difficulties, it sounds like there might be an issue of technique. The KO blank goes in from the outside of the box, and usually only one good whack with a hammer is needed to pop it in place. No folding of tabs needed. They can be a tad bit loose (spin easily) but they don't fall out without a good push from the inside. But the plastic ones are better.

Example of easy KO seal installation:
I think this video you showed is an ideal situation. The back is exposed with nothing in the way.

Yesterday I was on an 8' ladder bending my neck upwards with half my body in the attic reaching up to a box nailed to one of the trusses chord. There are five EMT conduits going to this box and the hole I was trying to seal cannot be reached by a hammer because of conduits in the way. The only way to do it would be to hold a flat head screw driver against it and whack the screwdriver with a hammer upside down and of course it ended up bouncing off somewhere and trying to find where it landed with fiberglass insulation and a flash light is no easy task.

I have had similar experiences half a dozen times now.

Sometimes you have to actually bend the tabs further in for it to go in easier.

I try to fold the tabs back (two of them) to make sure they stay put and not pop off because someone pounding a hammer near by. One electrician that I hired some years back said he folded all the tabs back because he doesn't want to risk a short inside the box when someone unknowingly push, pull wires in a congested box, sometimes a wire can be caught between tabs and could cause problems.

There was this one time I tried so many times finally gave up, installed an EMT connector instead at the hole, then cut a short piece of EMT, pounded one end with a hammer to close it flat, then installed the other end to the connector. I'd say when I had to do that the metal knockout seal failed.
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Old 05-27-2012, 10:56 AM   #7
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Are there knockout seals that works?


You don't have to fold the tabs back. Just push it in with your thumb or any tool and done.
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Old 05-27-2012, 08:52 PM   #8
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Are there knockout seals that works?


I have never been able to just push it in with my thumb. I will say it's fairly easy if it's a box located at eye level or below and no much existing rigid conduits in the way. Most of the time however it's not that situation.

As to whether you fold the tabs back, I think it's a matter of personal preferences. I have seen those who do not, and some who fold back two opposing tabs and some who folds back all the tabs. I have seen some who push the seal from inside out (where tabs would be on the outside of the box) and some that push the seal from outside in.

The main concern would be if you are not working on that box, but one upstream or downstream from it, and you pull on a wire a little on that end, there is a chance that wire will get caught in between the tabs, get nicked and result in a short. With Romex this is not an issue, but with conduits and regular wires it may be a real concern.
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Old 05-28-2012, 04:27 AM   #9
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Those metal ones are a pain in the (choose favorite body part here).

I use the plastic ones made by Arlington, or T&B. Snaps in with your finger. You can install it from the inside or outside of the box.

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Old 05-28-2012, 05:57 PM   #10
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Are there knockout seals that works?


stickboy1375 and kbsparky, thanks. I will try the plastic ones. Couldn't find a source locally but can mail order.

Jim Port, thanks for that link. I also looked but can't seem to find any Gardner Bender 1/2" seal locally, and online order seems to have a minimum order of 1 bag (100 pcs) and I need about a dozen the most.
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Old 05-28-2012, 06:06 PM   #11
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Are there knockout seals that works?


try here

http://www.garvinindustries.com/Elec...r-Type)/KOS-50
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Old 05-28-2012, 07:08 PM   #12
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Are there knockout seals that works?


When access from the outside is difficult- install from inside the box.
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Old 05-28-2012, 10:03 PM   #13
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Are there knockout seals that works?


Ahhh this is great!

Thanks so much!
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Old 05-29-2012, 04:17 AM   #14
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Are there knockout seals that works?


We use a special type of KO seal, it comes in a roll.


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Old 05-29-2012, 08:30 AM   #15
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Quote:
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We use a special type of KO seal, it comes in a roll.


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