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Old 05-07-2013, 11:31 PM   #1
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


Just finished installing our above ground permanent pool (48") and need to install outlet for pump (8A) and pool light (.4A). I have a 15A GFI about 15ft away that powers our low voltage lighting and I was planning on running some 1/2" conduit off this GFI along fence rails and mount weatherproof box w/GFI on fence post for pool pump/light. This new GFI for pool will come off the line side terminals of first GFI. New GFI will be about 2' from pool

Anyone see any issues with this plan?

Anything extra need done for safety?

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Old 05-07-2013, 11:38 PM   #2
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Just finished installing our above ground permanent pool (48") and need to install outlet for pump (8A) and pool light (.4A). I have a 15A GFI about 15ft away that powers our low voltage lighting and I was planning on running some 1/2" conduit off this GFI along fence rails and mount weatherproof box w/GFI on fence post for pool pump/light. This new GFI for pool will come off the line side terminals of first GFI. New GFI will be about 2' from pool

Anyone see any issues with this plan?

Anything extra need done for safety?
Real quick, I'm pretty sure the GFCI receptacle must be at at least 3' from the inside walls of the pool.

Also, shouldn't the new GFCI should come off the LOAD side?

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Old 05-07-2013, 11:47 PM   #3
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


Also, there's a requirement, I believe, called Equipotential Bonding, or Grounding, whihc I don't know much about except that I believe it consists of either rebar or wire mesh around or under the pool. The Pros will jump in here soon, so hang in there.

Article 680 of the NEC should be read very closely, and followed.
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Old 05-08-2013, 01:42 AM   #4
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


You will have to read the Art 680 there is no leeway with the pool system espcally with that deep of pool size you have there.

You will have to run the #8 bare Equipotential Bonding conductor around the pool wall area plus the pump will be have to be bonded as well.

For the rest of the details I will let one of our Americian electricians to fill you in the rest due I am used to French Nomes ( French electrical codes ) so it will be differnt in some way.

Normally this part I genrally recommened have a licensed electrician to this part due too many issue can go wrong quick.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:19 AM   #5
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


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Originally Posted by stevekem View Post
Just finished installing our above ground permanent pool (48") and need to install outlet for pump (8A) and pool light (.4A). I have a 15A GFI about 15ft away that powers our low voltage lighting and I was planning on running some 1/2" conduit off this GFI along fence rails and mount weatherproof box w/GFI on fence post for pool pump/light. This new GFI for pool will come off the line side terminals of first GFI. New GFI will be about 2' from pool

Anyone see any issues with this plan?

Anything extra need done for safety?
NONE Of this is right, acceptable or safe.

IF you are insistent on doing this yourself you MUST read Art. 680 of the NEC, AND have a decent grasp of Chapter III as well.
There are MANY code you MUST follow with regard to wiring for any pool.

In a case like this, where I get the impression that you really do not have any idea about these codes or practices, my only advice is call an electrician who is experienced in wiring for pools.
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Last edited by Speedy Petey; 05-08-2013 at 03:10 PM.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:45 AM   #6
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


Thanks guys for the input... Can someone please post article 680 for me to review?
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:57 AM   #7
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I found the article, thanks!
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Old 05-08-2013, 08:30 AM   #8
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Part III does not apply .... Ie 48".
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Old 05-08-2013, 08:42 AM   #9
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekem View Post
Just finished installing our above ground permanent pool (48") and need to install outlet for pump (8A) and pool light (.4A). I have a 15A GFI about 15ft away that powers our low voltage lighting and I was planning on running some 1/2" conduit off this GFI along fence rails and mount weatherproof box w/GFI on fence post for pool pump/light. This new GFI for pool will come off the line side terminals of first GFI. New GFI will be about 2' from pool

Anyone see any issues with this plan?

Anything extra need done for safety?
Crowdsourcing info works well for some home projects, but not all.

Electrocution (meaning death) can occur from work not being done up to NEC standards.

From a Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) pdf-

"There have been 60 electrocutions and nearly
50 serious electrical shocks, involving electrical
hazards in and around swimming pools, since
1990."

I strongly suggest hiring a licensed electrician.
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Old 05-08-2013, 03:11 PM   #10
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Part III does not apply .... Ie 48".
Sorry, that was my mistake/typo. I meant to say Chapter 3.
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Old 05-10-2013, 11:56 AM   #11
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I've attempted to review article 680, but I just do not have the time/experience to attempt to interpret the code. Since this obviously is more involved than just installing a GFI, I was wondering if any electricians on here would be interested in consulting me so I do this right? I would pay a reasonable consult fee for doing so as well. I can email you pictures of the area and I just need to know what has to be done to make this safe? Any takers?
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Old 05-10-2013, 01:28 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by stevekem View Post
I've attempted to review article 680, but I just do not have the time/experience to attempt to interpret the code. Since this obviously is more involved than just installing a GFI, I was wondering if any electricians on here would be interested in consulting me so I do this right? I would pay a reasonable consult fee for doing so as well. I can email you pictures of the area and I just need to know what has to be done to make this safe? Any takers?

The potential for loss of life is always present with electricity, but even more so when dealing with pools.

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but the fact that you do not feel comfortable interpreting/implementing Art. 680 should tell you that you are not qualified for this particular job. There is a lot more potential danger involved here than clubbing a basement or changing receptacles.

I would not be interested in consulting on this project. I am more than comfortable during the job myself, but it's quite another matter to tell someone what to do and never be onsite to physically inspect.

If you must do this yourself, pull a permit and get an inspection to insure code compliance.
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Old 05-10-2013, 01:56 PM   #13
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The potential for loss of life is always present with electricity, but even more so when dealing with pools.

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but the fact that you do not feel comfortable interpreting/implementing Art. 680 should tell you that you are not qualified for this particular job. There is a lot more potential danger involved here than clubbing a basement or changing receptacles.

I would not be interested in consulting on this project. I am more than comfortable during the job myself, but it's quite another matter to tell someone what to do and never be onsite to physically inspect.

If you must do this yourself, pull a permit and get an inspection to insure code compliance.

Thanks for the reply, I appreciate your thoughts. Yes, I do have to do this myself. I do feel I am capable of doing the work, as I follow directions well and have done a great deal of electrical work over the years (inspected and passed). I just have never done anything with swimming pools before, other than simply GFI's. In fact I never knew anything else needed to be done differently with a swimming pool as all my neighbors pools and our old pool only have basic GFI's protecting them.

I'm just looking for a little guidance to make sure it's done right and would be happy to pay a reasonable price for it.
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Old 05-10-2013, 04:17 PM   #14
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Swimming pool GFI outlet for pump/light


I don't think there's any way someone can physically do the work without understanding the requirements of 680. You have to know what to do when you're out there in the field working on it. I think your best course of action would be to really study 680, search the web thoroughly for tutorials on article 680 (http://www.mikeholt.com/files/PDF/Pooldownload.pdf), and start working when you know you understand why the rules are the way they are. This forum can answer a lot of questions, but you'll have to do some studying on your own.
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Old 05-14-2013, 10:43 PM   #15
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Thanks mpoulton for the link to article 680 tutorial. I had a chance to read it and have come up with the following plan below. Am I missing anything?

1) Run 1/2-in PVC conduit underground direct from panel to GFI mounted at least 5ft from inside walls of pool (pool is within 10 ft of dwelling - restricted space)

2) Run (2) #12 THWN feeders with (1) #12 insulated ground.

3) Run #8 solid copper wire around perimeter of pool and attach securely to at least 1 point on pool, pump motor and gfi outlet box. Also run under walkways with 3 feet of pool in a 12" x 12" grid pattern. (Ladder and light are not metal)

A maintenance disconnect is not required correct? Pump and light both have plugs which will be plugged into GFI outlet.

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