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Old 10-26-2013, 02:57 PM   #31
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Pf you have merely “registered” to work in a PA township and paid them an annual fee and showed them an insurance certificate, please note that is not a “license” as referred to in HB 1585.

Can a person who is just registered be upgraded to licensed by passing the exam similar to those in the municipalities?

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Old 10-26-2013, 04:12 PM   #32
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PA Electrical Licensing


That will also put an end to the matter that City of Pittsburgh, PA has a CLOSED licensing system that refuses to recognize out of town or out of state experience unless a federal judge or a common pleas judge forces them to recognize out of town or out of state experience.

Hopefully, they will also agree to reciprocate with Ohio.

Here in Ohio state licensing of electricians is a farce because Ohio Construction Industry Licensing Board is refusing to prosecute unlicensed maintenance electricians. They ( falsely ) claim that Ohio Building Code does not allow them to enforce the law in a maintenance situation because Ohio Building Code does not require a building permit to merely replace something. The result is that they will not prosecute the unlicensed quacks who took away my lat full time job. What an employment law attorney told me is that for any kind of job that pays generously and lasts a long time is that if you do not sue for a job what you get is didally squat because Congress created too many categories or people who have a right to sue for a job.

However, Cliff Honeycutt, who is the #2 electrical inspector for Columbus, Ohio says that OBC does require a permit to replace receptacles in a 4 dwelling unit or greater apartment building or to replace a 480-volt motor. He essentially says that OCILB lied to me about what their enforcement power are. What OCILB is doing by refusing to prosecute unlicensed maintenance electricians is equivalent to the Ohio Highway Patrol refusing to enforce the speed limit against commercial truck drivers or the Ohio Medical Board only requiring private practice doctors to have a license to practice medicine.

Even worse, Cleveland, Ohio only accomplishes about 40% of the building inspections that they are supposed to be doing because citu council does not see how doing electrical work the right way is a matter of staying out of the graveyard or the burn unit.

As long as Pennsylvania does electrical licensing the right way then fine. But, they can be just as Ricky Rat as Ohio.

I also know that in western PA outside city of Pittsburgh the electrical inspections are done by private companies, not by the government. Same thing is Morrow County, Ohio
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Old 10-26-2013, 04:54 PM   #33
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Electrical Licensing in PA


A lot of us, including David Eli Shapiro and I never did a formal apprenticeship, not by a long shot. I am not medically qualifed to get a milliion dollars of technical training from the US military and when I graduated from high school in 1980 there were no apprenticeships. Most of my apprenticeship experience was from a chain of knowing people that started when I got into ballroom dancing in September 1982. Even then, 7 years and a month elapsed from when I graduated from high school and when I obtained my 2nd month of work experience.

My earliest work experience was on my parent's house in the Town of McCandless, PA north of Pittsburgh. Fortunately, everybody outside of the City of Pittsburgh was prohibited by commonwealth law from having licensing. Otherwise, I would not have obtained that first month of work experience including replacing my parents' service entrance in order to get other people interested in hiring me.

You cannot just simply apply for an IBEW apprenticeship like with medical school. You have to be born into IBEW. Even if you are born into IBEW like the first 4 women who earned a New York City master electrician license, the going is tough. The 3rd woman who earned a New York City master electrician license, Nancy Montecalvo, moved her shop to Akron, Ohio and is a member of the Ohio Construction Industry Licensing Board, This was because there is more opportunity for a female electrical contractor in Akron, Ohio than in New York City.

A lot of us started our apprenticeships in those areas of the US that somehow have escaped from licensing. If it was not for unlicensed areas a lot of us would NEVER have obtained the first month or year of experience.

By the way, I am licensed as an electrical contractor by Ohio construction Industry Licensing Board lic. no. EL45,008 and I have a Bachelor of Science in Electrical Engineering/Physics.

One of my former bosses who is now licensed Ohio and formerly by Akron and Cleveland did his first apprenticeship years in the nonlicensed areas of PA.
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Old 10-27-2013, 05:01 AM   #34
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from what i know and have as personel experience .. in the state of PA there are 2 tests that are valid ..

the

Pennsylvania (Philadephia) Standard Master Electrician- 211

Pennsylvania (Pittsburgh) Standard Master Electrician- 701
and both are given now by the ICC ..


the 211 test is what people call the PHILLY test ... the 701 is what peeps call the ICC TEST ..

there are small citys that will not except the 211 philly test, or reciprcate with philly ... ie west chester and Pottstown


experience is based on whom you worked for ..do not need to work for the union ... just have 5 yrs working as electrician



you can go take the test for $100.00 thats all you need is the money ..try it ....LOL

100 questions 5hrs to complete ,, avg 3 mins per question and OPEN BOOK NEC ... multiple choice
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Old 10-27-2013, 05:23 AM   #35
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I always thought that there should be 2 test or 3 ..

Industrial
commercial ... 120/208 1 phase thru 277/480 3 phase
residential .. 120/240 1 phase (only) 200 amps or less

and then the ability to pull permits based on the level where your at or by VOLTAGE or AMPERAGE ...
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Old 10-27-2013, 09:27 AM   #36
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mc5w;

We had issues were out of town contractors could not pull a permit in some rural jurisdictions. The state license put a stop to that.

I never served a formal apprenticeship and it never hurt my career path.
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Old 10-27-2013, 10:23 AM   #37
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mc5w;

We had issues were out of town contractors could not pull a permit in some rural jurisdictions. The state license put a stop to that.

I never served a formal apprenticeship and it never hurt my career path.

was that a good thing or bad thing ??? we are talkin ELECTRICAL CONTRACTORS correct ??

my brother has BUS. in Lynchburg ...
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Old 10-27-2013, 10:37 AM   #38
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was that a good thing or bad thing ??? we are talkin ELECTRICAL CONTRACTORS correct ??

my brother has BUS. in Lynchburg ...
I should have said Out of Town ELECTRICAL contractors but this was true across the board for all trades trying to do work in their specific area of work in these towns or counties. I thought it was a bad thing, everyone should have a chance at bidding if they follow all the legitimate laws.

You are probably closer to me in Philly than Lynchburg BUT Lynchburg is a great town on the James River.

Oh and my Son lives in Lancaster.

Last edited by Know A Little; 10-27-2013 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 10-27-2013, 01:39 PM   #39
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I should have said Out of Town ELECTRICAL contractors but this was true across the board for all trades trying to do work in their specific area of work in these towns or counties. I thought it was a bad thing, everyone should have a chance at bidding if they follow all the legitimate laws.

You are probably closer to me in Philly than Lynchburg BUT Lynchburg is a great town on the James River.

Oh and my Son lives in Lancaster.
LOL Smith Mountian Lake .....yee hawww
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Old 10-27-2013, 03:23 PM   #40
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LOL Smith Mountian Lake .....yee hawww
Smith Mountain is SWEET, but has gotten expensive.
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Old 08-02-2015, 02:43 AM   #41
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I'm not usually one to resurrect long gone threads, but I'd like to hear how this one worked out and especially since "K Buz" who's apparently a licensed electrician and also from SE WI like I am commented here and he was correct, in WI its been a while since a homeowner could could pull their own permit and either do the work themselves and have it inspected (and you can bet the inspector will look a LOT closer at the DIYer's work than K Buz's work) and eventually, assuming all is done totally to code, pass it and satisfy the permit. This also allowed a homeowner to hire maybe a laid off journeyman electrician or one looking for side jobs, etc to do all the work, help with it, etc someone likely just as qualified as a master electrician, but charging a LOT less. This change was pushed through due to HEAVY lobbying of the IBEW on the state, BUT IT HAS HAD A MAJOR UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE FAR WORSE THAN THE NON-EXISTENT PROBLEM OF HOMEOWNERS GETTING PERMITS, INSPECTIONS AND PASSING THEM.

The major unintended consequence is that now when your choice is either hire a licensed master electrician as ONLY they can pull a permit and pay either $70 or more an hour (or comparable rate if job is bid out for flat price) or just do the work and not tell anyone, we now have all sorts of electrical work being done with NO PERMITS, NO INSPECTIONS, NOTHING! Same goes for plumbing, which I believe was part of the same law change.

I choose to pay the $$$$ to hire a licensed electrician to do the work, not because I'm worried about the inspector "busting me", but because of liability, I don't want a house fire 5 or 10 years down the road coming back to wipe me out, yet I really think among people who renovate homes for a hobby or a living, I'm the exception to the rule.

As someone said, residential wiring isn't rocket science and even though I feel quite confident I could wire an entire home with no problems and pass any inspection, I'd likely go the route of finding the journeyman electrician who'll do it for a cut rate, but the IBEW chose to use the law to line their member's pockets and in my opinion it has backfired badly, I hear daily of work going on all over that has NO permits, NO inspections, etc and is often sold to unsuspecting buyers. Furthermore, here in the city of Milwaukee, we have a massive backlog of homes now owned by the city via tax foreclosure, bank REOs and the new thing, "zombie homes" that are all in the lower or lowest priced parts of the area, where even a home in great shape may fetch $50k or $60k MAX, which thanks to the exorbitant cost of rewiring and replumbing, (as most have been stripped of all copper, etc) are going to find no other future than to be either bulldozed or will have to be subsidized by yet another MASSIVE gov't assistance program to make them make any $$$ sense to save.

Thing is, there was NO problem in the first place with the homeowners pulling permits, they had to get them inspected to satisfy the permit and I'm darn sure those inspectors went over them with a fine toothed comb, whereas now we have all sorts of work going on with no oversight whatsoever!

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