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Old 08-27-2012, 07:33 PM   #61
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Starting down the big hill


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Originally Posted by ddawg16 View Post
No kidding.....makes the 25' trench from my house to my garage seem.....'insignifcant'....
Trust me dawg....I had noooo idea.... not a clue... what was I thinking. It all looks so easy till ya start digging.

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Old 08-27-2012, 08:49 PM   #62
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Starting down the big hill


About 50í more to go and this completes the 900í run to another sweep under the bucket. My phone is on the left and I will tie them together in an 8X8 plastic box.

Starting down the big hill-p8250007.jpg




Couple pics of the 500í run and other creeks which I did last year. The end of this run is pictured above. Start at the pole and first creek.

Starting down the big hill-p8130031.jpg


Starting down the big hill-p8200016.jpg




The biggest creek. You can see the same orange cone at the end where Iím joining up to right now.

Starting down the big hill-p9180025.jpg


Starting down the big hill-p9250001.jpg




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Old 08-27-2012, 11:27 PM   #63
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This has got to be the craziest job i've seen in a long time.
I was going to say the same thing as well but just try that over in France we have to use the AMFO to blast few rocks out ( I manged to tick few peoples off ) but it was not that bad compared what you are going thru.

Zut !! That is pretty tough project you have there but you got it there so far.

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Old 08-28-2012, 04:23 AM   #64
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but just try that over in France we have to use the ANFO to blast few rocks out
Merci,
Marc
Marc, I feel very lucky that in only 3 cases I had to go slightly shallow with the trench to go over top of rock that was too large to get out. I still have about 200' of trench to dig so hopefully I won't run into any more.

This rock here was only 12" deep so I had to either get it out or divert the trench around it which is tons of rework to keep a gentle sweep. Some ANFO sure would have been fun though.

Starting down the big hill-p4140003.jpg
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Old 08-28-2012, 06:53 AM   #65
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A bag of Sakrete comes in handy to hold the conduit down in the bed because they want to float up in the water.
When I was a first year apprentice I was working on a job where we laid thousands of feet of PVC conduit (4"-6") in the ground and buried them in concrete. My foreman told me to get into the trench and step on the conduits that were floating after the concrete had been poured on top. I figured I'd vibrate the conduits down with my feet.

When the foreman came back he started screaming, "Look at what you're doing!"

I turned around to see where he was pointing and behind me was about 100' of duct bank that had floated to the surface due to the vibration I was creating.

Zappa, you're going to get the DIY Award of the Year for, well... just about everything!
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Old 08-28-2012, 01:11 PM   #66
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Thanks Julie.....you always have some good stories to tell.
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Old 08-28-2012, 02:04 PM   #67
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Attachment 56432[/quote]


Now I better appreciate aerial wiring.
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Old 09-03-2012, 05:49 AM   #68
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I was so relieved to see this pop out of the conduit. It was always in the back of my mind that something would break and the anxiety got higher towards the end. According to the length markings on the cable, 870 feet. The red leader is 25 feet of #12 solid and I did that to keep the phone cable out of the last freshly glued joint. I used 20í sticks.

The wires will be tied together in an 8X8X4 inch box but Iím not sure what kind of fittings are available to enter the box with. The conduits will also get a lot of heat from the sun and Iím wondering if I should use some sort of sliding joint, like maybe an unglued bell? The grey plastic boxes I found at the big box stores are not very impressive quality wise but should work. Does anyone have any suggestions for a higher quality box?

Thanks!

Starting down the big hill-p9020002.jpg


Starting down the big hill-p9020007.jpg


Starting down the big hill-p9020012.jpg
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Old 09-03-2012, 10:27 AM   #69
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This rock here was only 12" deep so I had to either get it out or divert the trench around it which is tons of rework to keep a gentle sweep. Some ANFO sure would have been fun though.

Attachment 56432

Can I have that rock???
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Old 09-04-2012, 06:54 AM   #70
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Can I have that rock???
Of course you can have it. Would you like it shipped UPS or parcel post?
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Old 09-04-2012, 07:59 AM   #71
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The wires will be tied together in an 8X8X4 inch box but Iím not sure what kind of fittings are available to enter the box with. The conduits will also get a lot of heat from the sun and Iím wondering if I should use some sort of sliding joint, like maybe an unglued bell? The grey plastic boxes I found at the big box stores are not very impressive quality wise but should work. Does anyone have any suggestions for a higher quality box?

Thanks!

Any help here? This is the first time I have worked with conduit and outdoor boxes.

1) Metal or plastic boxes? My top concern is keeping moisture and bugs out. I would like to do this once and not worry about replacing a cracked or rusted box in the future.

2) Should I be concerned about the conduit expanding and contracting and use some sort of slip joint? The conduits receive direct sunlight for most of the year and they are out of the ground about 30".

3) Any worries about UV on the phone conduits or box? My other power sweep which was installed last year is turning almost white on the side towards the sun.

4) Is there a standard connector that goes from the conduit to a box? (see conduit pic above)

Here is the box I was planning on using but I saw it in the store and it seems a bit cheesy.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/...99&R=100404099

Here is a metal box but it doesn't show how it opens or seals.

http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical-...&storeId=10051
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Old 09-04-2012, 10:35 AM   #72
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Any help here? This is the first time I have worked with conduit and outdoor boxes. I apprenticed for two years doing nothing but underground. Because of that, it seemed I was the go-to girl for underground projects for much of my career, which eventually led to project managing an underground division of a large EC here. I learned a lot in the process BUT, the last UG project I did was in 2005 so products may have come along since then that I don't know about. I'll do my best to answer your questions.

1) Metal or plastic boxes? My top concern is keeping moisture and bugs out. I would like to do this once and not worry about replacing a cracked or rusted box in the future.
I like the fact that PVC doesn't rust and that comes in really handy when you're pulling through underground conduit, especially old stuff. As far as boxes, I'd probably go with metal so long as the finish on it is decent and it's NEMA 3R approved.

Moisture is a ***** to keep out, so are bugs. But I have seen more problems with moisture in metal boxes than in PVC boxes, especially the ones using properly glued slip joints. (But I'm talking buried boxes here.) Make sure you use a gasket on the inside of the box under the locknut on the PVC connectors if you go PVC.

BTW, I have a metal box I installed in 1993 to split up the AC disconnect and hot tub panel on the back of my house. It has a nice thick rubber gasket all around the cover. When I opened it this summer, water came pouring out. The conduit inlets are all from the sides and back and all have thin gaskets on the outside. I also found a few spiders in there too.


2) Should I be concerned about the conduit expanding and contracting and use some sort of slip joint? The conduits receive direct sunlight for most of the year and they are out of the ground about 30".
I prefer slip joints over compression for PVC. Just make sure you clean it well with primer before applying glue. As far as the sunlight, check with the manufacturer. Some PVC is not UV resistant.

3) Any worries about UV on the phone conduits or box? My other power sweep which was installed last year is turning almost white on the side towards the sun.
See above. Code around here requires all conduits exiting the ground to be metallic, GRC or IMC. In some areas, you can use PVC for phone conduits.

4) Is there a standard connector that goes from the conduit to a box? (see conduit pic above)
Use slip joints with gaskets on the threaded half and glue well. Compression fittings label themselves "raintite". There's a reason you don't come into the top of an outdoor box with a conduit - water seeps into anything it can. In the JB on the outside of my house, once I saw the water, I drilled holes into the bottom. If I had conduits coming out the bottom, the water would have probably seeped out there. Nothing is perfect.

Here is the box I was planning on using but I saw it in the store and it seems a bit cheesy.
If you're going to use that box for the conduits in the picture and mount it with the cover vertical, you may have problems with the angles on the sides of the box. If I'm seeing the box right, that's the kind of box that has sides that are less than 90 degrees in relation to the top and bottom. They are designed to bring conduits into the bottom. Bringing conduits into the sides will invite moisture into the box.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/...99&R=100404099

Here is a metal box but it doesn't show how it opens or seals.

http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical-...&storeId=10051
What you're looking at in the picture is the top of the box. The cover is fastened on the bottom with a screw and slides away at the bottom to remove it from the overhang at the top. That box is about as raintite as you need and if the paint never chips or gets dinged will probably do just fine.
Go to the Hoffman website and check out what they have. Then talk to a local supplier who knows underground. Where your phone conduits come up, you may need a pedestal large enough to set a terminal box. Depending on the situation, the phone company here will install the pedestal, at your cots on your property, at theirs on public property.

All electrical boxes should be 10x the size of the largest conduit unless it's a straight pull through, then it's 8x. As far as metal vs. PVC on boxes, metal is conductive but rusts, PVC doesn't rust but is not conductive. But PVC can break down under UV unless it's properly treated.

Don't take this as gospel. I'm sure there are other opinions. This has just been my experience.

Last edited by JulieMor; 09-10-2012 at 09:44 AM. Reason: "NEMA R" should have been "NEMA 3R"
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:10 AM   #73
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Go to the Hoffman website and check out what they have. Then talk to a local supplier who knows underground. Where your phone conduits come up, you may need a pedestal large enough to set a terminal box. Depending on the situation, the phone company here will install the pedestal, at your cots on your property, at theirs on public property.

All electrical boxes should be 10x the size of the largest conduit unless it's a straight pull through, then it's 8x. As far as metal vs. PVC on boxes, metal is conductive but rusts, PVC doesn't rust but is not conductive. But PVC can break down under UV unless it's properly treated.

Don't take this as gospel. I'm sure there are other opinions. This has just been my experience.
I'm very grateful for your time and information Julie!! I will check out the Hoffman site and I believe you have persuaded me to go with a metal box. The demarc is 500' away back at the power pole so I'm just using this box to splice the already pulled phone wires together.

Thanks again....
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Old 09-09-2012, 08:27 PM   #74
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I installed the pad for a junction box (pull point) today. Itís the same spec as a transformer pad but it will be a hollow box that they splice the wires together in. In the future if someone wanted to pull low voltage at this point the power company would install a transformer instead. Or they could extend the primary in a different direction if needed.

Starting down the big hill-p9090014.jpg



I had to jack the back up quite a bit to keep it level.

Starting down the big hill-p9090004.jpg
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Old 09-10-2012, 09:28 AM   #75
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Utility companies have very specific layouts for their transformer pads. Some of the ones I've done have some pretty small openings for the primary and secondary. Here's a link to a company I used to buy products from showing a pad layout. This gives you an idea of what I'm referring to when I talk about small openings: LINK

Should your UC decide to set a transformer there I'm sure they will have an exact layout for their pad. So I wouldn't pour a pad until you know if that will be a pull point with a junction box or a transformer pad.

BTW, you may want to consider purchasing lockable junction boxes or boxes with tamper-proof screw covers. You never know who might run across your handiwork and decide to alter it. Some "WARNING - HIGH VOLTAGE!" stickers could be a deterrent so you might want to add those too.

But then there's those who like scrapping wire. Don't think because of the warnings or the length of the pull no one will consider it. People who can't read can be unpredictable.

I read an article in the newspaper about a man who blew his arm off trying to get some wire to scrap. Get this - he jumped a fence inside which were transformers and distribution equipment. He then spotted some exposed wire and took out his hacksaw. It didn't take long for him to experience what it's like when thousands of volts runs through your body. And that's how he lost his arm. I have no idea how he lived. True story though.

Never underestimate the stupidity of the human animal. Maybe that's how the term "Idiot Proof" came about.

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